• Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
permaculture forums growies critters building homesteading energy monies kitchen purity ungarbage community wilderness fiber arts art permaculture artisans regional education skip experiences global resources cider press projects digital market permies.com private forums all forums
this forum made possible by our volunteer staff, including ...
master stewards:
  • Anne Miller
  • Nicole Alderman
  • r ranson
  • Pearl Sutton
  • Mike Haasl
  • paul wheaton
stewards:
  • Joylynn Hardesty
  • Dave Burton
  • Joseph Lofthouse
master gardeners:
  • jordan barton
  • Greg Martin
gardeners:
  • Carla Burke
  • Ash Jackson
  • Kate Downham

Friends and politics.

 
pollinator
Posts: 767
Location: North Carolina zone 7
147
  • Likes 10
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
While chatting with a friend the subject of politics came up. We’ve been friends for decades and I’ve always known him to lean right of center. During the course of conversation it became obvious that he’d now gone well left if center. While quite a shock to me I didn’t question but let him talk. Our talk about politics started to blend with a discussion of his granddaughter. She is very disabled and he had witnessed the policies of the right slowly stripping away her much needed resources. A real conversation about real issues! No twitter or Facebook users screaming at each other, only a concerned grandfather and his friend.
This post is not meant to start any arguments nor will I respond if it goes that direction.
 
Scott Stiller
pollinator
Posts: 767
Location: North Carolina zone 7
147
  • Likes 4
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
This post is not meant to cause any controversy. Maybe it’s just time that we sit, listen, and learn.
 
gardener
Posts: 1711
Location: South of Capricorn
658
dog rabbit urban cooking writing homestead ungarbage
  • Likes 4
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
In this day and age, I think coming up against changing ideas is pretty common. Our opinions change, priorities change, the world changes, and unfortunately taking all your ideas and all your beliefs on All the Things and boiling them down into choosing one candidate or one party line eliminates a lot of really good reasons people have for thinking the way they do. It's eye-opening (and great for everyone) to listen to why people stand for certain things.
 
gardener
Posts: 1788
Location: southern Illinois.
410
composting toilet food preservation homestead
  • Likes 4
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Politics appears to have more to do with tribalism than thought out positions.  
 
Scott Stiller
pollinator
Posts: 767
Location: North Carolina zone 7
147
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Very much in agreement with you both. It was just an experience that I wasn’t expecting. To have your entire political leanings hinge on the wellbeing of someone you love certainly simplifies things.
I almost didn’t post this and may still regret doing it. I did because in a world where literally everything is an emergency and hyperbolic I thought it was a great learning experience for me. Hoping that may be the case for someone else too.
 
John F Dean
gardener
Posts: 1788
Location: southern Illinois.
410
composting toilet food preservation homestead
  • Likes 3
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Scott,

My previous post was intended as a general observation.  Specific to your friend, it may not be as simple as it seems.  I am sure the child was an influence. It is also possible that you friend was in a more hazy realm than you thought, and the experience with the child pushed enough to make the difference.

Most often we are pretty influenced by our parents.  If our parents were  brand loyal and always bought Brand x .....odds are our first major appliance will be brand x.  If we shift, it can be because of a specific incident.  I bought brand x and it broke down right after it went out of warranty.   Humans are strange creatures.

 
Tereza Okava
gardener
Posts: 1711
Location: South of Capricorn
658
dog rabbit urban cooking writing homestead ungarbage
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I`m glad you posted, Scott, and hope my response didn't come across as a dismissal. Positive things like this are scarce in my area today and every little bit counts.
 
Scott Stiller
pollinator
Posts: 767
Location: North Carolina zone 7
147
  • Likes 3
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Thank you, but I didn’t think either of your responses were dismissive or harsh. I honestly had a hard time even wording it. To broach the subject seemed like a slippery slope no matter what I said.
I hope to continue this discussion but right now my granddaughter is running around and thinking isn’t going well. 😂
 
gardener
Posts: 493
Location: Ontario - Gardening in zone 3b, 4b, or 6b, depending on the day
291
dog foraging trees tiny house books bike bee
  • Likes 5
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I am always impressed when someone changes their position when confronted with new experiences and new information. Especially when they have the self awareness to know that they have changed and why they changed. I am also always intrigued when someone has a view I don't expect from them, as those are often their most well thought out positions.

Sounds like a good, thoughtful, mature, and respectful discussion. Always a thing to cherish, and a foundation for good friendships. Wishing us all many more of them.
 
Scott Stiller
pollinator
Posts: 767
Location: North Carolina zone 7
147
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I completely agree with your take Catie. My plan is to interact with more people in this manner. No pretense, smirks or body language. I am not the best at this because I am a judgmental person by nature. Just like a great garden; it takes mindful cultivation.
 
pollinator
Posts: 1565
Location: RRV of da Nort
253
  • Likes 3
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

John F Dean wrote:

Most often we are pretty influenced by our parents.  If our parents were  brand loyal and always bought Brand x .....odds are our first major appliance will be brand x.  If we shift, it can be because of a specific incident.  I bought brand x and it broke down right after it went out of warranty.   Humans are strange creatures.



This can take strange twists, however.  My own observation is that, depending on the *relationship* with the parents, we can either copy their choices or end up rejecting those choices, both being not such conscious decisions.  What often is observed being retained between the generations of a family, is the argumentative toolset by which a position/choice is justified.  And what is so very striking in so many parents I've talked to are the number who, in an emotionally charged situation with one of their children, respond (regretfully) a way that their own parent responded similarly years back, only later to say "I told myself umpteen times I would never treat my own child that way!.....".  Ultimately, as noted, it's through continued observation of what works and what doesn't, and *actively* incorporating these observations into behavior, that begins to sloooooooowly change our outlook.

All of which, when stepping back even further,  somewhat dovetails on Freud's concept of "the compulsion to repeat" and is in broad agreement with your statement that "Humans are strange creatures".....
 
John F Dean
gardener
Posts: 1788
Location: southern Illinois.
410
composting toilet food preservation homestead
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Hi John,

To expand your Freud comment, I will go to Glasser.  If you keep doing what you are doing, you will keep getting what you have got. We tend to repeat what we are secure with , and that is what we have done before.  Too often the question regarding if what be did before worked either doesn't enter the picture or does so narrowly .  That said, I agree with your observation that just because we may be influenced does not mean our behavior is dictated.
 
See ya later boys, I think I'm in love. Oh wait, she's just a tiny ad:
Sepp Holzer's 3-in-1 Permaculture documentaries (Farming, Terraces, and Aquaculture) streaming video
https://permies.com/wiki/141614/videos/Sepp-Holzer-Permaculture-documentaries-Farming
    Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic