Walk behind tractor

While I am learning a lot here, I have to agree with Eric. I have made a choice and a clear decision to till and attempt to build soil. I think it might be time for all of us to go our separate ways and close this thread.

Thank you, Eric for posting while I was typing. I deleted almost all of my reply.

John,

So its been a while since we talked about this topic.  Do you have a better idea of which walking tractor you want to buy?  Or do you plan to stick with your 4-wheel tractor and its tiller?

Eric

Eric,
For now, I think it's going to be the better financial decision to go with the 4-wheel tiller attachment. but I am defiantly leaning towards the BCS in a diesel, or one of the 749s or 750s. Its an interesting prospect and I think that in the future it will be something useful. I'll defiantly need to save more.
I'd choose BCS because it is easier to maintain with more mechanics used to it already, but I'm not to keen on the clutch system.

John,

Actually, I think that is a sound financial decision.  I imagine that a new 48" tiller is running somewhere around $2k.  Does that sound about right?  And even if it is more, that is still under the $4k budget you were planning.  I don't know if the diesel BCS machines are ever going to be available anymore--from what I heard its an emissions thing.  I could certainly be wrong on that, but it has been several years since Earthtools had a diesel tractor and their disappearance seemed to coincide with tier IV emissions.  Again, maybe I am wrong.  Too bad as I bet those were fantastic little(ish) machines.

Eric

Paul Young wrote:
What I've found to be true by experience with this property is that the minute I stop dumping organic
matter onto a clay site, it quickly, in a year or two, returns to its original clay dome condition. Like I had never touched it. So, in the long run, have I really changed the soil composition?

Out of curiosity, have you done any experiments with biochar in your soil?

Ok, this thread is starting to drift off topic.  If you want to start a new thread about the benefits of no-till then I suggest that you go ahead and start one over in the soil section.

Sorry, I posted that question before reading this!

I'll humor you, I have and had little result. So much so that I actually saw decreased growth (smaller plants) in that area for a few years. I believe it does hold merit, but with the clay, I can still dig in the area and will find charcoal fragments that are primarily clay and if I cook them in a fire, you can almost see where the pores were filled with clay sediment. I do however add charcoal from my fires to my garden regularly, but mostly for the ash side of it. Biochar works better in my wife's garden though. (higher elevation and better drainage).

Does anyone have any thoughts on the clutch issue?

John, did you just use charcoal or did you activate it first?

John, I am no mechanic, but I can get input from my friend who works on all kinds of engines, including my BCS, has his own BCS now.  He is a live soil farmer, though doing successive plantings in a season, he uses a “power harrow” which reaches the top 6 inches of his soil.



Might have valuable information, for sure a set of preferences and opinions.

Specifically, what would you want to know about clutches on walk behinds, or specifically BCS clutch?

My friend’s tractor is (maybe) a 749.  I know it’s bigger than my 739. His can run a flail mower, and a power harrow.  Each requires more than my 739

If you tell me specifically what kinds of information you would find helpful, I can do my best to get my friend’s input.😊

John, I had a thought that is far cheaper than a tiller or a 2-wheel tractor.  Have you ever thought about a subsoiller?  This looks like a double sided plow that you pull behind your tractor.  I have one that I used on my JD2305 and it was an absolute beast!  It digs far deeper than 6 inches and really loosens the soil.  If memory serves, it cost about $100.  I would suggest using before tilling.

Eric

And if you are curious about “subsoiling”  there’s a lot of information on the practice at yeomans plow Australia website.  Subsoiler plow is based on the design of the yeoman’s plow (invented in 1954 in Australia as a soil improvement implement).

Eric,
I have a subsoiler, and it's about as good as my tires are. Once I push the clay out of the way and fill it with good dirt, give it a few weeks and you'd never know you did anything. If you dig, you're only going to find a slightly darker clay. Thats why I'm doing the rows and filling in between them with manure this year. Worse comes to worse, I'll get enough compost on top of the clay that it'll stick around for a while. (I've watched a lot of videos on making Australia airable. I enjoy when humans f@$& up the area and people have to figure out how to fix it. I'm in a series of fixing dry creek beds right now.)
As far as implements go, I'm finding a disk harrow to be the most helpful, right now, although it only works as long as my tire tracks aren't deeper than the height of the undercarriage (you can always use the bucket on the front to push yourself out). The main goal for the tiller is to mix the manure with the dirt that is already in the rows to create a richer topsoil on top of the rows. If that results in the roots straddling the rows, reaching to either side for more nutrients, that's fine, I'll do a deeper tear up at the end of the season or before I do a second planting to really spread it out.
I know it may sound like it, but I'm not trying to bury the clay. I'd like to make a nice smooth transition between the soil and the clay layers so that as time goes on and I lose soil to erosion, I can still maintain a healthy subsoil.

Thekla,
First, can you type how you pronounce your name. I'm having trouble saying it in my head and would like to know the correct way instead of calling you T.
Second, I'm really bad about leaving things in gear... like REALLY bad. I just used my tractor and shut it off in gear and walked away. The only time I use the parking brake is when I'm going to be working downhill from it. Crushing = bad.
I was actually looking at maybe saving up for the 749's or the 750's. I wouldn't mind going larger than I need. I wouldn't use the power harrow, but the bush hog, flail mower, and (I may be wrong) the mini baler. (I love me some mini round bales!)  But through my research, I've seen a lot about how if you don't disengage the clutch, the cone will seize, and you'll be stuck with a several hundred-pound paperweight. Which, while it would look cool next to my 1949 McCormick Farmall, I'd like to get to use it a little bit before it becomes a yard decoration.

Eric,
I have done the stuff to activate charcoal and added it. I found that I had "eh" results with it, but that using straight charcoal from the fireplace produced better plants (in my situation).  This was probably because I did most of my testing areas where I grow my tomatoes (east side, so they get the most sun) (I usually do around 150-200 tomato plants) (I like eating them off the vine before they come inside), so I think the ash did more for them than for the soil.

Hi John,

Say the th as in think.

Thek rhymes with speck,

Accent the first syllable, then fall off on the la, and really, that second syllable is more like luh, rhymes with the.

And, as for leaving the BCS in gear, I didn’t know you weren’t supposed to!  I never do anything but turn it off.  I leave my car in gear…..

I’ve noticed that some people take it out of gear, put the parking brake on…. What a pain I always think.  And lend it out less and less!  Having said that, as I consider moving to a new community, it’s a great way to make friends and see other people’s places.  Volunteer to come and bring my tractor 😊

I can ask Brian about it, worst he can do is smile and say, well it’s better if you don’t.  He’s very good natured.  He might leave his in gear, he has flat ground, very flat, and, come to think of it, it’s pure clay.

It may take me a few days to get back with his answer.

Thank you for that. I also tried thEEEkla, they-kla, t-he-kla, and th-eee-kl-Ay. Eventually I got lost.

Your friend, and yourself, seem to have pretty good luck with the BCS's working in clay. Does your soil waterlog? Basically, my house is at 25' elevation, my front porch, 28'. My garden is between 10-15'. I'm already pretty close to the water table, but when it rains, I will have puddles for days after. And it's not a drainage issue, its that there is so much water already in the clay, that it won't absorb any more. When we get into the summer, we may go 2-3 weeks without rain, and it will still be wet 6" down while to topsoil is bone dry. My major issue is that I can work the clay if I can get it dry enough, but during times like now, where it rains 1-3 times a week, all I have is mud. I would use the BCS (or if something else catches my eye) to mix in more organic material to better stabilize the moisture levels, improve drainage of excess and retain water when it is in short supply, and improve available nutrients.

Well, about the clay, we live in the desert.  He has a pond to irrigate his farm.  When he and his wife put the pond in, a mutual friend and I convinced them not to use a pond liner.  I’ve been “gardening” adjacent to the pond.  Research if you will…. On saturated alkaline clay as a growing medium 😊.  Doing good so far.  I am playing with distance from the water, and have many species with live roots in the soil.  

Where I have comfrey, soil development is going especially well.

The pond has been holding water for several years.  And there’s getting to be a thicker layer of soil between the water and the surrounding pure clay.

Did you and I talk about clay flocculation? That might be something to experiment with.

Right now I personally only have half an acre of alkaline silt with lots of rocks …. and preparing to find a new home with irrigation water.

About the clutch on the BCS, seems like mine is very like an automatic transmission and it doesn’t matter what I do.  The larger model that my friend and mechanic Brian has something about like a clutch.  He says the clutch needs to be disengaged when left.  There’s a handle to squeeze, and a clip of some kind which you use to clamp the handle to keep the clutch disengaged.

He says moisture can get trapped in between the two parts of the clutch,

This may not be any more than you already know

My neighbour has one of the biggest BCS with the Honda engine, a flail that's about 2' wide, a rotary plough and a scythe thingy.
He moved in about six months before we did and he let me borrow it with the flail to try and tame the grass that has ruled the roost here for decades. It has a locking diff and braked wheels and lots of gears.
I am not unfit and not unstrong (is that a word? :))
The ground had been grazed generations ago then left to the occasional deer, lazy beds mostly but with uneven areas and wide ditches. It would go almost anywhere at any angle taking you with it. Turning it around is hard. Getting it to go where you want rather than it wants is hard. Keeping it out of a ditch while cutting along the edge is hard. Trundling along on a flat smooth bit of ground is easy. Turning it on flat smooth ground is easy. I used it for three sessions of a few days each just with the flail on unsmooth ground.
Other neighbours borrowed it to rotary plough two lazy beds of maybe 50 yards long, 3-4 yards wide. Slightly more exposed so the grass on them is not quite as hostile as mine. Three of them in turns and it pretty much broke all of them over two days. One handle had to be anchored in one hip  while it bucked. Similar experience for the neighbour owner when he ploughed some of his. All previously ploughed decades ago so no stones.
Talking to some dealers about a small 4 wheel tractors one thing they said was to use a draw plough on a 2 wheel would not have the weight to grip to pull unless it had dried out much more than a four wheel could cope with.
I bought the smallest Goldini 4 wheel with a three and a half or four foot flail I forget, a "normal" plough, tiny backactor and a tipping box. The flail really struggles with the grass, maybe I should have got a smaller flail or bigger tractor? But up one size of tractor ups the implement prices hugely. Second hand at tiny tractor size is rare and beaten to death.
It's fab. Flotation tyres and centre pivot means it won't sink unless it's carrying max weight. Front and back diffs means it will cross wide ditches dangling wheels as it goes. The lazybeds are maybe 4 yards wide and 100 long. I can shunt a few times and turn round easy enough. With a 2 wheel I would have to have my feet down in the ditch while pushing the thing round. The flail or plough are not light so you would most likely have to lift them off the ground to swivel it all 180 degrees?
Mine wasn't cheap but has allowed me in two years to found my future firewood, this alone means it will pay for itself compared to buying it in. This year will be first ploughing to plant cereal now I've got some of the grass beaten. Grass tufts that sensibly speaking needs an axe to get it up. Ridiculous.
I would suggest the effort needed even for a fit person is off putting on that 2 wheel unless you are on flat easy ground. If so I can see some appeal.