Non grafted apple tree

Hello, does anyone know where I can buy non-grafted au naturelle apple trees?

Yes I'm well aware of all the arguments against it, so there's no need to educate me. I would like to grow a big natural, un-chopped up and stuck together, apple tree with pleasant tasting apples. I know I know it's a terrible idea and I should be shot, but I would still like to do it.

Thanks
Rob

Where are you located?

I’ve come across a few sites that sell “grafting stock”, which might help? depending on the stock I guess... Also, there are some decent threads about growing your own!

https://permies.com/t/113669/Growing-Tree-Seedlings-Seed-Trays

You can grow it from a seed! I've done  it, and many others on this site have done it. Plant fresh seeds from an apple that you like (preferably one from an orchard that you know has apple trees as the pollinizers, not crabapples). My experience has been that if I plant several apple seeds in containers of soil in the autumn, and keep them damp and cold for the winter, some will sprout in spring, and then I plant them out either that same year when they are a few inches tall, or keep them in the container for another year and plant them out the next year.

I second what Rebecca is saying.  It is so easy to start apple trees from seed it's almost ridiculous.   I start my apples inside but I've started pear outside that sprouted.  I currently have 25 or thirty baby apple trees that I started from Kazakhstan seed.


I would try to start seeds that are from a stock that will do well in your area.  Know the diseases that are common to apple in your area and try to get seeds from parents that are hardy against them.


Check out Skillcult on Youtube.  He is very knowledgable and cool.    Here is a series of video on home-scale apple breeding.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL60FnyEY-eJAMOPvU-yyF4JfuW5ocJvC4[/youtube]

Wunderbar!! thanks guys. I was desperate and a little on the fence. But now? I am excited! and resolute! and less desperate!

If I cant find someone who sells em I'll grow from seed! (I only want to buy one because I want to save a bit of time, hopefully get a few that are a couple of years old)

Thankyou!

I love non grafted trees too, and was also looking for them a while back and couldn't find any for sale, so I'm going to make my own.

I hope to offer only non grafted fruit trees for sale in the future!

If you have to purchase a grafted tree like I did, you can air layer a branch to form it's own roots and plant the new tree as an own root tree, as long as the variety isn't patented.

I love planting fruit tree seeds as well, and am hoping to discover lots of good new varieties that are vigorous growers, disease resistant, and best adapted to the area they are planted in!

Here's a video on how I selected which apple seeds to grow since I didn't have any currently producing apples yet.



Wish you lots of success!

I was just looking for 'non grafted' keifer pears and found this site https://morsenursery.com/product/kieffer-pear-non-grafted-1-year-containerized/
Looks like the only non grafted apple they have is  chestnut crab apple

I've never ordered from them and am not sure about the keifer when they suggest getting a grafted one for 'human consumption'.  I guess because they don't want to be liable if one from seed is not true to type?

Thanks Steve! good man If you start selling them facebook me - (rob sutcliffe, ginger guy) I'll buy a bunch. I've already planted 14 grafted ones around my town this year for people to eat, want lots of natural ones too!

The plan is to cover the whole town in apple trees! hundreds of em

rob sutcliffe wrote:Thanks Steve! good man If you start selling them facebook me - (rob sutcliffe, ginger guy) I'll buy a bunch. I've already planted 14 grafted ones around my town this year for people to eat, want lots of natural ones too!

The plan is to cover the whole town in apple trees! hundreds of em

Johnny Appleseed

Judith Browning wrote:I was just looking for 'non grafted' keifer pears and found this site https://morsenursery.com/product/kieffer-pear-non-grafted-1-year-containerized/
Looks like the only non grafted apple they have is  chestnut crab apple

I've never ordered from them and am not sure about the keifer when they suggest getting a grafted one for 'human consumption'.  I guess because they don't want to be liable if one from seed is not true to type?

Since the Kieffer Pear is from a specific pear tree that was found by Peter Kieffer in the 1860s, there are two possible things that non-grafted pear tree could be (assuming the original tree is long dead). First,  since Kieffer pears are self fertile, it could be an inbred tree where both parents are Kieffers. In that case, the tree would likely be quite similar to a Keifer although not actually a Keifer. Thinking back to genetics class, there's about a 25% chance that any "Aa" trait in Kieffer gets expressed as "aa" in a seed sired by two Keifers. Since they say on the website "Note: Grafted Selection recommended if purchasing for human consumption as the taste can’t be relied upon from seedlings" it looks like these are just trees that are probably sired by two Keiffers.

The second option would be that they propagated the tree vie a non-grafting method such as using rooting hormone or air-layering. This methods would be quite advanced for a pear tree, so it's unlikely that they would be selling air-layered trees for less than traditional grafted ones.

With that in mind, Rob have your considered growing an air-layered tree or one made using rooting hormone?

I will do now John, thanks! I'll look into it

I have been on this exact journey this year.
Can anyone shed some light four years later??

If those Kazak apples/genetics were successful, what  was your result??
I must know!
Has anyone made inroads on this topic since the original post??

Rebecca Norman wrote:You can grow it from a seed! I've done  it, and many others on this site have done it.  

Four years later, I still have three seed-grown apple trees but they haven't produced fruit yet. I also have 4 grafted apple trees. None have fruited yet.

Rebecca Norman wrote:

Rebecca Norman wrote:You can grow it from a seed! I've done  it, and many others on this site have done it.  

Four years later, I still have three seed-grown apple trees but they haven't produced fruit yet. I also have 4 grafted apple trees. None have fruited yet.

What do you suppose your limiting factor is? Are they slow growing, in poor soils, not much light?? Please tell us more.
High altitude gardening is something most may never experience. I love to gain all types of knowledge . . .

Demitrios Pitas wrote:
What do you suppose your limiting factor is? Are they slow growing, in poor soils, not much light?? Please tell us more.
High altitude gardening is something most may never experience. I love to gain all types of knowledge . . .

Poor soil and short cool summers. They have abundant light. I was told many times, and sometimes experienced, that you should not improve the soil while planting trees, so I planted these out in barren desert soil.

I've heard that planting appletrees from seed means it takes several years for them to fruit, sometimes five or six years?  Any other knowledge about this?