Some places need to be wild
Eric Hanson wrote:Alex,
I am going to echo about half of what Lito told you. But first, what absolutely beautiful land! I realize this is only 3 pictures, but the land and scenery is stunning. Also, judging from your pictures and your specific comments, I personally don’t think you need an excavator for your drainage ditch. In my opinion (and this is only my opinion based on one picture, so if I am mistaken I apologize) you would be best served by a rear grader blade that has angle, tilt and offset functions. The angle function will help curl the material off to one side. The tilt function will let one side dig into the ground to dig the ditch. The offset function is a bit more rare and will set the blade off to one side and let the implement operate to the side of the tractor. I recently bought a grader blade that has all of these functions and the offset impresses me the most. With such a blade and a little practice you can lower your blade and move forward, digging out a ditch and moving the soil out of the way. It would take a few passes, but it could be done rather quickly.
I would think that the same task done with an excavator would be a slow process by comparison. Again, it could be done but it would be difficult. Alternatively you could use a box blade with one end tilted down and you would accomplish the same effect. At any rate, I suggest you get a good, solid tractor and add in some other implements as you need a them. There is a lot of very sound information here, and I am sure that as you get closer to making a decision, if you need additional input, this thread will continue to be source of sound information. And of course, if you have any questions, don’t hesitate to ask.
Eric
Doug Steffen wrote:I bought 140 acers last year and the first thing I did was buy a mini excavator. I have found it to be a great help . With a thumb & a blade you can get a lot of work done.
Nails are sold by the pound, that makes sense.
Soluna Garden Farm -- Flower CSA -- plants, and cut flowers at our Boston Public Market location, Boston, Massachusetts.
Alex Arn wrote:
Eric Hanson wrote:Alex,
I am going to echo about half of what Lito told you. But first, what absolutely beautiful land! I realize this is only 3 pictures, but the land and scenery is stunning. Also, judging from your pictures and your specific comments, I personally don’t think you need an excavator for your drainage ditch. In my opinion (and this is only my opinion based on one picture, so if I am mistaken I apologize) you would be best served by a rear grader blade that has angle, tilt and offset functions. The angle function will help curl the material off to one side. The tilt function will let one side dig into the ground to dig the ditch. The offset function is a bit more rare and will set the blade off to one side and let the implement operate to the side of the tractor. I recently bought a grader blade that has all of these functions and the offset impresses me the most. With such a blade and a little practice you can lower your blade and move forward, digging out a ditch and moving the soil out of the way. It would take a few passes, but it could be done rather quickly.
I would think that the same task done with an excavator would be a slow process by comparison. Again, it could be done but it would be difficult. Alternatively you could use a box blade with one end tilted down and you would accomplish the same effect. At any rate, I suggest you get a good, solid tractor and add in some other implements as you need a them. There is a lot of very sound information here, and I am sure that as you get closer to making a decision, if you need additional input, this thread will continue to be source of sound information. And of course, if you have any questions, don’t hesitate to ask.
Eric
It's hard to tell from the winter pictures but there is one specific area where an excavator is needed for the ditches. The low point on the land is currently a water/salt logged mess where the drainage is completely silted and the county installed an under road culvert higher than it should have. The general consensus for from everyone I have talked to is to dig out the "drainage ditch" to a 4-foot depth to allow the surrounding areas to drain enough so that a longer-term solution can be found (I'm leaning towards holding pond and wind/solar powered pump up to culvert height).
I'm getting bids to have it done by a professional familiar with the area and he is concerned even a treaded excavator will get stuck (it's basically one giant "slick" of sodic soil) and we may need to wait until next winter when the ground freezes or hope for a dry spring/summer and do it in the fall.
The rest of the areas I plan to see if I can get the old v-plow up and running and get a utility tractor.
'Theoretically this level of creeping Orwellian dynamics should ramp up our awareness, but what happens instead is that each alert becomes less and less effective because we're incredibly stupid.' - Jerry Holkins
Dillon Nichols wrote:
Yikes.
Wonder if you could start drying it out by digging out only the most accessible end of ditch and pumping from there to elsewhere, presumably the culvert?
Gordon Haverland wrote:Nice looking place to the original poster.
I'm a little north of you (I live where the Alaska Highway begins at 56N).
I didn't go to the trouble you seem to have done, but I have been back on the "family farm" (40 acres) for 4 years now, and just bought some equipment this year.
One of the predominant trees growing here is aspen, which is a colony tree. A single root system could have tens to tens of thousands of trunks. Any small tractor I buy wasn't going to be able to easily handle a problem involving aspen roots (which can be a long way away from where the trees are, as this land was only broken about 100 years ago). One of the problems I have, is that wild rose is growing across large expanses (for a 40 acre place).
My biggest concern in trying to make plans, is climate change. My family moved here in 1975, with me going into grade 10. The next year, I was told to disc up the two pastures as the land had been in hay for more than 30 years (which would put that seeding around WW-II, far before chemical fertilizers and pesticides). The land hadn't been worked since I did that (now 42 years). Based on the changes 1975-2018, I would guess that the reseeding was just after WW-II (still before fertilizer). When we moved here, this land was probably Zone 2. This land is now Zone 3b and possibly even into Zone 4 now. That said, we've had unexpected cold in winter (and a winter of 7 months) in the recent past; and this year has had little heat and rain almost constantly. This area is normally only 18 or so inches of precipitation per year. August is typically a drought, which prepares trees for winter. It has been raining all August, and if we get cold lots of trees could die as they are not being made dormant.
Not your problem. Just pointing at different concerns.
I was thinking that doing "keyline plowing" was going to be important. I know that I am going to be creating a lot of swales. I may build a beaver dam analog for temporary/leaky impounding of water.
Keyline plows never came anywhere near here, and I don't know if I would buy a new one. I am going to try and use a 1 bottom subsoiler as an alternative. And the nearest I could tell, I wanted to have about 50hp to pull such a subsoiler (probably deep - deeper than I have been).
I had gotten leads on a few older tractors, and few tractors where I am have 3 point hitch; which would always be a deal breaker. One tractor which might have worked; a person could never buy as the owner thought he was going to fix it.
I ran across a 1 year old Kubota MX-5200 with less than 100 hours on the engine. The owner had bought the tractor (with pallet forks and bucket), and then got access to a skid steer; and eventually decided the skid steer was what would work best for him. So, I bought the tractor (with the pallet forks as well). And along with the tractor I got a tilt/angle blade (all manual), a box blade and a 1 bottom subsoiler. The only "tractor" I had before, was a 27hp lawnmower (diesel) meant for doing fairways on golf courses (my lawn is 4.5 acre). It quit working last year (still not repaired - accident caused by a wasp attacking me when I went to start the mower). I have tried using that lawnmower in the "pasture", and it is tough slugging. The tractor engine wants to overheat, and so I have to take breaks. Just to cut paths, not for cutting large areas. I got an ultimatum on the lawn, and to try and get something useful to the farm and hopefully handle (most of) this lawn problem. And I found a brand new 7 foot sickle mower that was a year or two old. Which I bought. It will cut hay with wild rose in it, and it will cut small branches and even do hedges (90 degree cutting). Solving my lawn problem may mean building a buckrake to fit on the pallet forks.
I live about 5 miles downwind of a 130+ MW wind farm. We do get wind here. Being on the eastern slopes of the Rickies, I get Foehn winds (locally called chinooks). I don't have a single prevailing wind, I have 2 prevailing winds. One is mostly summer (from the west off the Gulf of Alaska) and the other is from the SW (the chinooks) which really can happen at any time of year (most people don't recognize the chinooks in summer). Deer (white tail, mule deer and moose) are a problem; and I am going to try the Osage Orange hedge for that (pre barbed wire on the Great Plains).
I had thought a 2 bottom plow would work for making swales, but I have switched my thinking to a 1 bottom plow. At some point, I may find/purchase one. While Permies.com has a thread on making swales with a tilt/angle blade; the blade I have is probably not strong enough to do that. Which is why I am looking to a plow solution. Sorry, no link to that thread; but the OP is a civil engineer describing what he did.
There were lots of mentions of skid steer in this thread. Skid steer is a preferred solution in North America. Lots of vaguely similar conditions in Europe, lead people to wheel loaders (small ones). While front end loaders on tractors are useful, they are not really meant for digging. A wheel loader can dig. And they typically will travel in transport mode much faster than a skid steer. You can find (small) wheel loaders with a drawbar, or even 3 point hitch. And in that direction, a person can get teleoperators meant to do digging, and can lift to heights beyond front end loaders or wheel loaders. And they can have 3 point hitch (or a drawbar).
Somebody was strongly in favour of beet juice as ballast in tires. I wouldn't be surprised if that is good enough in California; it won't work here. The typical salt for ballasting tires is calcium chloride.
On my shopping list are two forestry items; not yet purchased. One is a chipper/shredder and the other is a (skidder) winch. Both are 3 point hitch attachments. Chippers will chip branches. Chipper/shredders will also handle fine branches and leaves. For the size of my tractor, I am planning at some point to get a 4 inch chipper/shredder. The Internet is USA centric, and I am in Canada. But even so, looking at various forums; one Canadian brand kept getting mentioned by people in the USA: Walenstein. It is out of Ontario. Both of my local John Deere dealerships sell Wallenstein (with green paint) chippers (I don't know if I've seen a chipper shredder at either).
The other item is a winch. Or rather, how to put a skidder winch on a tractor. Again, Wallenstein comes up (from lots of people in the USA). One thread, sort of ended that a 50hp or so tractor , could use a 8500 pound pull skidding winch. You need to be very careful using a small ag tractor skidding trees. The pull must be straight, not sideways.
Some people need to clear the snow immediately, I don't. I can wait a day or so. I ended up getting an Ariens 36 inch snowblower, which can throw the snow 50 feet or so. I try to use itwhen the wind is coming from the west (preferably NW). If there is less than 6 inches of snow, it is not worth using the snow blower, which can lead to some unwanted icing problems later on. With the tilt/angle blade on the tractor (no cab), my plan is to windrow the snow and then use the snowblower to finish the job. Besides, it is good exercise to walk up a 7% slope in the winter.![]()
'Theoretically this level of creeping Orwellian dynamics should ramp up our awareness, but what happens instead is that each alert becomes less and less effective because we're incredibly stupid.' - Jerry Holkins
Standing on the shoulders of giants. Giants with dirt under their nails
Tj Jefferson wrote:Alex, I really like my skid steer, and it does an amazing job . I have a major problem in that our clay soils and any moisture mean I spend the time trying to get the machine unstuck all the time and I’m just going to sell it and rent a tracked machine for jobs since I have all the necessary implements. I’m working on plumbing in the hydraulics on my big tractor to run all the implements, but it’s 8gpm and the skid steer is 28, so it won’t be fast. When that hydraulic pump dies I will replace it with a 12gpm pump. I’m even looking at getting an old electric output from a broken skid steer to run implements but that’s a big job. I’d settle for the grapple. I can work on the tractor but the skid steer is a huge pain to work on. Dillon did a nice job of explaining where the skid steer excels. Really where the turning radius is critical.
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Some places need to be wild
Eric Hanson wrote:Elle,
I have tractor envy! Not so much for the tractor, but because you have the excavator. I actually have no need for an excavator, but I just love the idea. But I also have to say that you look like you have some extremely hard ground to dig through.
Eric
Come join me at www.peacockorchard.com
elle sagenev wrote:Ah ha, you're here, with me. Poor sucker!
ancient mini excavator which is the second love of my life, the man who bought it for me being the first. ;)
elle sagenev wrote:
Eric Hanson wrote:Elle,
I have tractor envy! Not so much for the tractor, but because you have the excavator. I actually have no need for an excavator, but I just love the idea. But I also have to say that you look like you have some extremely hard ground to dig through.
Eric
I'm not going to lie to you, I may rarely use the thing, but just owning it makes me happy. $6500 from a guy who used it to dig his basement. Best money we ever spent imo. My husband may think differently.
elle sagenev wrote:Ah ha, you're here, with me. Poor sucker!
Alex Arn wrote:
elle sagenev wrote:Ah ha, you're here, with me. Poor sucker!
Our newmoney-pithome site is on Diamond Basin road west of Cody, WY. Where are you guys at?
Come join me at www.peacockorchard.com
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