can whey make bread collapse?

I baked some bread yesterday, using whey from an earlier cheesemaking project in place of water. Most everything went as usual, except slightly faster fermentation, up until it went in the oven.

It seemed a lot more moist the whole way through the baking process, and then it collapsed a little, like a fallen souffle`. It might be some other problem, but I wonder if somehow the milk protein interfered, either with proper drying or with the formation of gluten.

Any thoughts? Have you guys had bread unexpectedly collapse?

It's still edible and all, I just would like to know I can use up whey without harming the quality of the bread I make.

Joel Hollingsworth wrote:
I baked some bread yesterday, using whey from an earlier cheesemaking project in place of water. Most everything went as usual, except slightly faster fermentation, up until it went in the oven.

What kind of cheese? Basicly there are only a few differences that matter.... Many kinds of cheese include adding some kind of live biology (unless it is straight acid cheese) so it could have the effect of having too much yeast. I have used kefer instead of yeast or starter with complete success. So if you are making a normal kneaded bread I would use no more than 30 to 40% whey in the water.... for no knead bread less than 6%. You might also decrease the amount of yeast or starter used.

It seemed a lot more moist the whole way through the baking process, and then it collapsed a little, like a fallen souffle`. It might be some other problem, but I wonder if somehow the milk protein interfered, either with proper drying or with the formation of gluten.

Two thoughts here...
  1) if it feels too wet, add flour till it feels right.
  2) I assumed above the whey was pre salt addition... if you also gathered whey after you added salt, then your salt percentage could be out too.

There shouldn't be much protein in the whey, the casein in the milk is what makes cheese "gooey".
And as I said above, I have used kefer with all the protein still in it no problem.

Any thoughts? Have you guys had bread unexpectedly collapse?

It's still edible and all, I just would like to know I can use up whey without harming the quality of the bread I make.

My main problems have had more to do with not getting it to rise at all.... One more thought though, you mentioned that your bread rose more than normal.... maybe faster too? It could be you rose it too long before cooking, I have heard that can happen.

Thats what I can pick from my brain. I like to experiment, but I expect my bread to fail once in a while too

I've read that bread dough with a high concentration of bacteria relative to yeast can collapse or just not rise to the same height as doughs with a predominately yeasty population.  I guess yeasts exhale a lot more CO2 than do bacteria, which is why sourdoughs need to be carefully managed to control the bacteria/yeast ratios.  Because whey is such a concentrated source of bacteria, perhaps they overwhelmed the yeasts and this contributed to the collapse? 

Pure speculation.  Interesting idea, using whey for bread, not something I've heard of before.  Sorry it didn't work out! 

Could you use the whey to water plants?  Is it too acidic?  I think most all of the calcium in milk ends up in the whey, and that could be really beneficial for certain plants. 

I use whey all the time for baking bread, so I know it can be done. The only time I have collapses in loaf structure is when the dough is too soft.

I haven't made cheese in a while so I have no recent experience, but I often used whey instead of water.
I have three possible explanations:
The dough absorbs the whey in a different manner, thus resulting in a wetter dough.
The whey still contains some amount of lactose and overfeeds the bacteria in a shorter time.
Or the whey is on the acidic side and harms the gluten bonds.

Not sure about the last one because I have a recipe where the liquid is almost 100% buttermilk. It rises extremely slow (in my case) and often only makes the final "leap" in the oven.

In any case, close observing in order to avoid overproofing seems to be a good way to avoid this problem, and/or adding a bit more flour and stretch&fold cycles.