• Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic

Saving the World

 
Amit Enventres
Posts: 328
Location: Ohio, USA
21
fish food preservation forest garden
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
So, now that I've achieved or close enough to throw a stone at, my current goals that lasted 6 years, I'm trying to set my next big horizon. So, I went to good old holistic farm planning stuff from college. A cheesy but useful class.

The thing is, I now see the world as totally manipulatable, with enough time, and me being part of that world being also able to be manipulated by others. So, now being I'm one of a whole, I keep running on circles as to what is the goal.

I am prone to saying I'm saving the world, but really, earth will exist even if nucs go off and life will regenerate eventually, probably, without people. So it's not the earth I'm saving.

I don't like the current system of life I live in. I find it enslaving, though but the worst thing ever. But, it's not the current system.

So it's some other ideal I want to impinge on others, which makes me a selfish a-hole. So, that's no good. Therefore, I think it's time I start brain storming with others as to what everyone's goals for the world are, their ideals of what it should be, and then I can see how to set a goal where I won't be a complete a-hole, at least not unintentionally. So, I know I'm opening a can of worms here (sorry Paul and team, kill it if you must), and I figure it will be a biased can of worms, but I want to start some where.

So, what is your ideal world? Please everyone be nice!

Thanks!!!
 
Travis Johnson
pollinator
Posts: 687
57
books cat chicken duck rabbit transportation trees woodworking
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
If everyone loved God with all their hearts...

Treating others as if they would treat themselves.

That would go a VERY long ways.
 
Amit Enventres
Posts: 328
Location: Ohio, USA
21
fish food preservation forest garden
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
That's good, very nice thoughts. But, I want to stretch them a bit. But first, my ideal is a world without species destruction, people are free to live as they choose with subsistence available, communally run, but technology available and growing.

So, do unto others as you want done unto yourself, good rule, but let's expound. Does that mean if I like getting fish flavored ice cream, I should give some to you?

As for a permaculture world with people living in gardens, what if someone doesn't want to live in a garden? Does the "do unto others " trump that?

Not trying to be difficult.

Thanks!
 
Bryant RedHawk
gardener
Posts: 1978
Location: Vilonia, Arkansas - Zone 7B/8A stoney, sandy loam soil pH 6.5
151
chicken dog forest garden hugelkultur hunting toxin-ectomy
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Wow Amit, rather heavy subject but also timely I think.

These are my thoughts on this subject.

1) there never has been nor ever will be a Eutopia. The best we can hope for is for all people to accept that they are different but at the same time all One People.
    Even that is nearly impossible to achieve given the nature of the human beast.

2) Our Earth Mother will be here millennia after humans have died out, she will be better off for that extinction given the current way humans treat her.

3) Nothing here (on Earth) is permanent, change is constant.  Humans and all other living things are only able to stay around as long as they can adapt. (the cockroach is perhaps the most adaptable critter on the planet and will be here long after the last human ceases to exist)

4) We are the care takers, so it is our responsibility to help mother earth rather than destroy her, regardless of our greedy nature, otherwise we will no longer be able to adapt and thus go extinct. (humans for the most part do not understand this and that will be their doom)

5) Even though most (if not all) religions tell the followers that they should take care of others less fortunate than themselves, few if any do so.

I have no goals for the world, I have goals for how I can help the earth mother live and thrive. I have goals for how to best live with as little negative impact both on the earth mother and other humans as possible.
I have no religion, I am a spiritual person as are my people, we have always understood our role and responsibility to the earth mother and all living things, animal, plant, rock, water, fire, sky, all are living spirits.


 
Travis Johnson
pollinator
Posts: 687
57
books cat chicken duck rabbit transportation trees woodworking
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Amit Enventres wrote:That's good, very nice thoughts. But, I want to stretch them a bit. But first, my ideal is a world without species destruction, people are free to live as they choose with subsistence available, communally run, but technology available and growing.

So, do unto others as you want done unto yourself, good rule, but let's expound. Does that mean if I like getting fish flavored ice cream, I should give some to you?

As for a permaculture world with people living in gardens, what if someone doesn't want to live in a garden? Does the "do unto others " trump that?

Not trying to be difficult.

Thanks!


The simplicity of it all is what makes the statement brilliant.

As for the fish flavored ice cream, if you truly loved it, then don't you think you owe it to your friends and neighbors to offer that insight to them? Of course they have the right to refuse, of which the statement means you don't try and cram it down their throat, but you do politely offer your suggestion of trying it; or better,  a bowl full, etc. Isn't that what we do with Permiculture; offer an alternative to others? I remember hearing about bacon flavored ice cream, two unlike things, but the brilliance of it all: BACON and ICE CREAM.

As for your garden question, I fail to see the relevance. It is all about checking your ego at the door. It does not mean at every opportunity you roll over and get walked on because...if everyone was abiding by this mantra, they would not want to stomp all over you because that is not how THEY would want to be treated.

Peace will never happen, there will always be conflict in the world, but the more I try and apply this in my own life, the easier life is. It is against the general nature of mans will, but when I bristle inside and attempt to get MY WAY, conflict inevitably erupts. But then again, this is circular, because at that moment, I am not exactly abiding by rule number one am I?



 
Tyler Ludens
pollinator
Posts: 9409
Location: Central Texas USA Latitude 30 Zone 8
160
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
The reason I deleted my previous posts is because I realised I did not understand the purpose of this thread.  The question is "what is your ideal world?"  So I tried to answer and then was questioned as if the original question had been "What is the ideal world for everyone?"

I can't answer the question "What is the ideal world for everyone?" Only the ideal world for me, as I understand things.  And maybe I am still not understanding the purpose of this thread, so I do not know how to respond to it.  Could the OP clarify what is the purpose?  What information they are trying to obtain?  Thanks.

Here's a talk by toby hemenway with which I agree:

Toby Hemenway - How Permaculture Can Save Humanity and the Earth, but Not Civilization

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nLKHYHmPbo&t=180s
 
Joseph Lofthouse
garden master
Posts: 1979
Location: Cache Valley, zone 4b, Irrigated, 9" rain in badlands.
365
bee chicken food preservation fungi greening the desert
  • Likes 3
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Save the world eh? I gave up on that decades ago. These days I'm content to be a primate. To enjoy the movements, foods, smells, sensations, sights, emotions, comradery, and touches that primates enjoy. My intent is to live for an indeterminate amount of time, and then to die and feed the animals and microbes. In the meantime, I'll nourish plenty of microbes, and grow some food to feed humans and other animals. I have been disintermediating my life for decades, and I expect that trend will continue, and that I'll get better at it as I go along. My highest spiritual and physical aspiration is to "Leave other people the hell alone." My definition of people includes my non-human and non-animate kin.

And grow some squash.



grow-squash.jpg
[Thumbnail for grow-squash.jpg]
Primate pleasures...
 
Amit Enventres
Posts: 328
Location: Ohio, USA
21
fish food preservation forest garden
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Thanks all!
The topic is what's your ideal world. I am compiling what I find from as many people as I can to see what people want. It's pretty interesting and you are welcome to also compile and share if you ask others the question too. Kids answers count. I have become infatuated now that I've started doing this. So many interesting answers.

What I'm reading, I will try to summarize to this point, please correct me if I get it wrong. 

Love God. Is this God as each person describes God or a particular view of God?

Some are most interested in Do unto others the kindnesses you want done to yourself, but don't do unto others as you don't want done unto yourself. I.e. respect eachother's free will. One said conflict is okay, as long as there's also this basic principle.

Protect/grow mother earth. Live in a permaculture garden.

Live life as a human being.

I have to watch that one of Hemingway's video, then I will try to summarize that too.

What I compiled today from people I talked to is:
-shorter work week, more weekend.
-subsistence socialism so people can feel more free to do a job they want or atleast stay out of the way of those trying to do their job and reduce workplace stress.
-Live in the wild, like Tarzan.
-Live with modern conveniences in a hut in the wild, but with people understanding and respecting eachother's uniqueness.
-No more wars x2.
-People praying more.
- living in a garden of Eden.

 
Joseph Lofthouse
garden master
Posts: 1979
Location: Cache Valley, zone 4b, Irrigated, 9" rain in badlands.
365
bee chicken food preservation fungi greening the desert
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Amit Enventres wrote:Live life as a human being.


I had meant to convey the meaning, "Live life as an animal, that happens to also be a primate."

 
David Livingston
master steward
Posts: 2987
Location: Anjou ,France
140
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
What's my ideal world ?
About 100m outside my front door after that it starts going less than optimum

David

As for what I do to make the world better -I help out on Permies
 
They weren't very bright, but they were very, very big. Ad contrast:
2017 Permaculture Design Course and Appropriate Technology Course at Wheaton Labs
http://richsoil.com/pdc
  • Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic
Boost this thread!