Nikita's Gift Persimmon -- I have some questions for people who have them

Does anyone have a Nikita's Gift? When do to you pick them? Do they have to be mushy to be ripe? I've only eaten two or three in past years. There's about ten on there now. It's a young tree and has a little too much shade.

Ken W Wilson wrote:Does anyone have a Nikita's Gift? When do to you pick them? Do they have to be mushy to be ripe? I've only eaten two or three in past years. There's about ten on there now. It's a young tree and has a little too much shade.

Nikitas Gift Persimmon Tree – Astringent American-Kaki Hybrid

From the Ukraine, Nikita’s Gift persimmon tree is a hybrid of Asian and American persimmons. The fruit have exceptionally sweet flavor when ripe (you’ll know when they fall off the tree). Bold red leaf color in the fall is an added bonus. Fruit ripens late October – November. Zones 6-9.

They were very mushy by the time they fell. Are they supposed to be? The tast was great but no texture.

Ken W Wilson wrote:They were very mushy by the time they fell. Are they supposed to be? The taste was great but no texture.

I'm actually looking into planting some Persimmon and what I've read the Astringent persimmons are like a ball of gue when you eat them.  The not astringent can be more like the texture of an apple depending on the variety but this is from reading I have no hands-on experience.  I posted asking about the top ten permaculture trees and some of the guys on that post have persimmons.    

I've eaten lots of american persimmons. They are drier than the Nakitas Gift. I actually prefer the better American astringent persimmons to the Nikita's on flavor and texture, but I think mine may have been overripe. They are huge, maybe 5 times an average American persimmon. They are also completely seedless. I've heard you can pick them while still hard and dry them. Since, I only have ten, I'd like to be able pick them at the right time and make the best use of them.

I would plant a variety of persimmons.  I have a grafted American persimmon but it's not producing yet.

My Nikita's Gift is setting it's first crop, 24 very hard, pink-orange fruits. I'll pick the first one that begins to soften. I'll pick the second one at a softer stage and the third one even softer. I'll know when to pick next year. What a carefree fruit tree. I'm going to try grafting and budding to the local wild persimmons.

Astringent persimmons probably should be mushy.  If firm, they will "set the mouth awry with much torment" (John Smith).  I suggest you dry them, as is done in Asia-->candy, and food preservation.  You could also make persimmon bread (same as banana bread, but different mushy fruit).

They seem to go from slightly soft and bitter to very soft over night. How do you like yours? I hope they did good for you.

Do you pick them while still firm to dehydrate? I still have about 8 hard fruits.

One out of two that I've eaten this year had two seeds. I started another thread about whether they could be viable or not.

I planted a Nikita's Gift a few years ago that wilted and died a few months after planting in the spring, it didn't even make it to its first winter. It didn't dry out, so I was puzzled as I've planted a number of persimmons and none of the others ever did that. Considering how others in the Ozarks in this thread have had success I may try another one.

In contrast, my Rosseyanka persimmon has done quite well. It produced its first crop in 2016. This year it had no fruit, but then there was close to zero fruit on any of the wild persimmons here too this year, something I haven't seen before. I believe it's because of the bad hailstorm we had in late April while they were in bloom, followed by a deluge and record flooding. The trees are far above the flood zone, but the wet weather following the hailstorm encouraged the wounds on the branches to start to get black spots like they were infected with some sort of fungus. They eventually healed so I hope the persimmons will be back to normal next year. The hail didn't knock off all the blossoms, but the rest fell later without setting fruit. I think the trees were stressed enough from the hail wounds that they had to skip fruiting for the year to heal themselves. Interestingly, there was little fireblight on apples and pears this spring, when I was very worried the hail wounds and the wet weather would cause it to spread like wildfire. It wasn't a good year for tree fruits in general though, but the bushes, brambles and strawberries did better.

I'm about half way through my NG fruit. I picked the first one when it was just a little softer than hard. It was slightly astringent, cruncy, sweet, and delicious. I'm tolerant of astringency, I eat raw aronia berries. The next one was slightly softer and only slightly astringent, still crunchy, and sweeter and more juicy. The rest have been about as soft as a ripe peach, mushy and sweet. There were a few seeds that were very thin and probably sterile. I ate some and picked most out.

Watch the fruit color change, a ripe persimmon will be purplish (this is when they fall to the ground and usually break open) and a just right for picking color is when they go orange with a tinge of the purple color starting to show up.

Redhawk

Bryant RedHawk wrote:Watch the fruit color change, a ripe persimmon will be purplish (this is when they fall to the ground and usually break open) and a just right for picking color is when they go orange with a tinge of the purple color starting to show up.

Redhawk

Are you talking about Nikita's Gift? Sounds like American persimmons. I have to pull my ripe NGs off and there's only a little purple where the fruit is damaged.

I have both varieties and just this year we got enough Nikita fruit to notice that they ripen almost the same, the American fruit turns purplish when ready to eat and goes "mushy" the day after the color change from orange to purple. The Nikita fruit turns orange and then starts to soften, the orange gets a slight purple tinge around the stem end when it is perfect for eating.  Both of our varieties crack open when they fall off the tree and quickly become ant food.

Did yours get freezing weather while ripening? I'm not sure if that made the riper ones mushy or not but the first ones went from hard to mushy over night. They were also sweeter than I liked.  I had some the year before last that were perfect though. They were slightly purple.

I had read that you could slice fairly hard fruits and dehydrate them. This worked pretty good. No bitterness at all. They are only slightly sweet. Not a very strong flavor, but good. Then I tried eating them with lightly salty peanuts. Perfect trail mix! The flavors really compliment each other.  I eat a lot of nuts, so this is very good. I hope they taste good with pecans and carpathian walnuts. Peanuts don't do to well here.

Next year I'll try to eat some at just the right stage and dry the rest. I'll try to dry some at different stages. A little riper would probably be sweeter and more flavor. They were very easy to dry, maybe 16 hours in the dehydrator. I've never made fruit leathers, but I think the very ripe ones would work great. I only had about 12 to work with this year.

I may be more sensitive to bitterness than most people. Beer is way too bitter for me.

Richard, want to trade some cuttings? I'd like to try Rosseyanka.

Ken,

I sent you a PM.

I have two properties on which I could plant persimmon. One has nearly infinite room and is zone 6a (maybe even zone 5b) the other is in a downtown core microclimate closer to 7a with very limited space. Planning to plant american persimmon on the larger zone 6 acreage. Is there a good chance of successfully ripening Nikitas or Rosseyanka in the zone 6 or would it be best to try and fit them on the 7a lot?

I’m 6b. The fruit can stand some pretty hard freezes. Mine are ready in late November usually. I like to pick them before they are sweet and mushy while the are still a little bitter. Dehydrating them takes the bitter away. Add nuts and they make good trail mix.

I forgot to mention that my tree is on the north side of a privacy fence. They are also in a thick patch of black raspberries, so the soil is completely shaded. I’m sure this makes them ripen later and may be the equivalent of a zone colder.

I have 4 non-astringent Asian Persimmons. When they are orange like a ripe pumpkin I pick them and eat them fresh.  If I pick too early they are only slightly sweet and when I pick when Ripe they are very sweet. Crunchy like apples.
I have started two American Persimmons that I will try to graft on my Asian ones.

Hello,
With regards to Nakitas Gift, I read on a commercial providers website the following description:
“ Nikita's Gift Persimmon is easy to grow and typically starts producing fruit in 2 to 3 years after planting. Naturally compact it is the perfect addition to the collectors garden or the novice orchardist as it is rarly bothered by pests and diseases. It is a high producer (over 50 lbs) of sweet, flavorful, reddish-orange fruit in the fall. Plus the green foliage turns a beautiful rainbow  or orange to yellow shades in the fall. Persimmons are widely planted across Asia because of they are delicious and easy to grow. Nikita's Gift is a cross between an Asian and an American persimmon. Although it is self-fruitful, a larger harvest is seen when planted near a male persimmon.”

What do you think is meant by the last sentence? Is this an typo error?  What type of male persimmon would be meant here?  

I have seen some growers say it’s seedless other say it has only a few small seeds. What can I expect, as I recently grafted this scion variety?
Thanks
Dennis
Kent, wa

I have seen this before.  Not a typo but maybe subject to interpretation.  
I found that my Jujube is also self fertile, but will experience larger crops (numerous fruit) when planted near another (different) variety.
I believe each Persimmon fruit gets a bit bigger since it is with seed.

I would much rather have less fruit with no seeds.  So no pollinator would be best.  Mine are seedless sometimes but usually have some small seeds. There are native trees fairly close that may pollinate them. I also have some younger american persimmon trees that bloomed this year.  I have read that some trees are both male and female.

The american persimmons have a lot more flavor.

I am new to this forum, but it looks very professional to me. Maybe you can help me with my questions?

I planted Nikita's Gift in the spring of 2017. I am in PA, zone 6B. In 2019 we had 22 fruits, the following year - nothing. This year, 2021, the tree is loaded with fruit - at least several hundred of them. It is October 29, most fruits are nicely colored, but they are still hard and astringent. When would be a good time to pick them from the tree? Some would be for fresh eating, some can be dried and some can be stored in the freezer. Do you slice the fruit for drying like apples?

I also have some doubt that my tree is Nikita's Gift. I do not recall leaves ever changing color to red in the fall. The branches have a tendency to bend down and stay that way - many of them are touching the ground. This year the tree could not support the fruit weight, one big branch broke off and took about 100 green fruits with it. I had to put supports under other branches after that. Does it sound like Nikita's Gift to you? I have attached several recent pictures - they are better than words.

I've not seen any hybrids that cross American with Asian types as being hardy past zone 6.  I would love to try a 'Nakita's Gift,' but I live in zone 5a Vermont. (Champlain Valley)  Has anyone had success or tried to grow them beyond zone 6, and if so, what were the results?  Thanks for any information! At present, I have six American persimmon trees growing, and I've had a heck of a time getting them started.  They are now three years old.  One has finally shot up a little and is over my five foot frame, but most are still very small--like only a foot or two.  Two of the trees had dieback, but then sprouted like an octopus below the graft (which died).  Am I wrong to just let them be?  They are located in the back yard by an old six foot diameter red maple stump, and planted with some dwarf mulberries, rhubarb and bush cherries.  I needed some shade restored there after the ancient red maple had to come down.  Thanks in advance for any info you can provide.  I am eager to taste my first fruits!

I have a six year old tree and live in zone 7 a.  I picked a ripe one today, usually all the leaves fall off and it is often in Mid November when they appear slightly translucent and soft like an overripe tomato. They should be ready. If they are astringent, the fruit isn’t ripe.

My Valeen Beauty, which is planted out front, just started to fruit this year. It is the only one of six to do so. It was planted in 2021, along with most of the others.  It wasn't loaded with fruit, but I certainly have a good number; I've probably gotten 75 fruit this year.  I'm hoping that the flavor gets better with time; it's not at all bad, but it doesn't have any of the deep, rich tones or really jammy consistency  that I was hoping for. I've read that the first year or so the fruit is still sorting it all out.

The fruit itself is quite large for an American, and it is flawless--no black spots, and best of all, it is seedless, so the whole thing is edible (except for the calyx!) and you're not having to spit out lots of seeds.  I'm hoping my other trees get with the program and start fruiting soon!  I read that this variety tends to be one of the later varieties, which is fine.  It's lovely to still be harvesting fresh fruit in November!  I can't wait till I have enough to actually freeze and dehydrate.  Without seeds, that will be a breeze.  When I have enough to play with, I'd like to try just cutting some in half and dehydrating them. One, because freezer space is at a premium and two, there is no added step of having to thaw before eating and three, I think that the concentrated sugars would be really good!

I have one Nikita on American persimmon rootstock. It's the only that is producing in my climate so far.
I had a few American persimmons and they all died within a few months due too excessive heat.
I also had 7 various persimmons on lotus rootstock, but they do not produce yet and suffer in the heat and 4 of them died.
I pick them when they are soft and very sweet.

Cristobal Cristo wrote:I have one Nikita on American persimmon rootstock. It's the only that is producing in my climate so far.
I had a few American persimmons and they all died within a few months due too excessive heat.W
I also had 7 various persimmons on lotus rootstock, but they do not produce yet and suffer in the heat and 4 of them died.
I pick them when they are soft and very sweet.

With the cost of fruit trees, I can sympathize.  That is tough.  I go out and shake my one fruiting persimmon, and whatever falls, I pick up.  Most are soft, but some are not.  I tried putting them in a paper bag with an apple...hard to say whether or not that made much of a difference.  I've also been sticking them in the fridge in a single layer on a plate.  Surprisingly, that seems to be the winning strategy. It also keeps fruit flies from exploding!

Barbara, shaking the tree and eating the soft ones that fall is a simple test. Sounds like soft is the answer for these.

Barbara, only one of six fruiting after a few years sounds about normal for persimmons, they seem to take their time. With that many trees going in over different years it's worth writing down which is which and when each one first flowered, I built leaftide.com for keeping that sort of record on my own fruit trees. Hope the Valeen Beauty gets jammier as it settles in.

Joao, I have a simple doc to keep everything straight.  As I enter new plants, I can insert a row and that way have it alphabetized for easy reference.  I refer to it regularly!  In the first column, I have the plant, 2nd column: when planted and when fruited and 3rd column tells me where I purchased it and where I planted it on the property.  I am growing over 50 kinds of fruit, many with lots of varieties, so it was rather necessary.  I have three pages in a Word doc.
Here are my persimmon listings (the spacing never transfers but I did what I could here! CH= Cricket Hill.

Persimmon Valeen Beauty                       ’21 (fruited ’26) CH—In front, most westerly.
Persimmon- Yates                               ‘21                        CH    In stump garden—north side
Persimmon-100-46/Lehman’s Delight  x2 ’21, ‘22                CH    In front, east from other one (VB)
Persimmon--Meader                               ’21, ‘22                CH    By east pool fence in line with filter.
Persimmon--Prok                                       ‘21                        CH    In Stump garden—South side

Even from the typing draft box to the posting box, the spacing got all messed up, but I think it's enough to get the idea.