Sepp Holzer | 5 Day Intensive | Whitehall, Montana

Chompin at the bit to see more photos! Is that a crater garden or an actual crater??

A huge thanks to everyone who helped make this happen. We now have what I think is the largest Crater Garden in North America, a beautiful spiral snail shell into the earth. It took a tremendous amount of work from everyone involved, and we still have a long way to go, but all of the major earth moving is complete and all of the bare ground has been mulched. We're finally getting some well timed rains just as everything is starting to sprout. Here's a photo of the Crater Garden and the new driveway up to Sage Mountain Center.



Everything went off without a hitch and there was a tremendous amount of learning, information sharing, and connection building happening throughout the workshop. Before an electric fence went up the deer started browsing the nice desert bowl we had just made, so we wiped up some Bone Sauce. It was my third time making it with by far the best results. Since we've applied there has been no deer browse what so ever, even though I have watched them walk by the garden a number of times since. Here is what the bones looked like after the fire.



This is one of my favorite photos from the workshop, Tony pondering the Crater Garden mid construction (while also learning how to operate the loader from a far).



And the group photo from the workshop group, thanks to everyone who helped make it happen!

Here is a photo update from about a week ago after a snow storm and frost. When we say we have a really short growing season up here we really mean it! It should be a good test for the Crater Garden. So far everything has been thriving despite the sleeting rains, snow and frost. Even the frost sensitive plants only show a very minor amount of tissue damage. The Crater seems to be trapping enough heat to stabilize the dramatic conditions. The rocks do a great job of trapping the heat with the way they are burred. Even late at night when it is cold you can feel how warm they are. Everything around the stones is noticeably lusher.





We've had some pretty good Algae blooms going on (as I anticipated) but now the ecosystem is starting to develop more and the water is clearing up up. The Bone Sauce is still working great, and everything is popping up well with the recent rainstorms. The small pond makes some nice dew each morning, sometimes things are so moist it seems as though it must have rained even when it hasn't. All in all very pleased with the installation and looking forward to observing and learning from the system or spiral terraces. I'll keep this thread updated with photos as the project progresses.



Sage Mountain Center, the off-grid demonstration site that hosted the workshop, just launched a fundraiser to complete the project. They have some great incentives, please spread the link around if you can. The video has some really nice footage of the Crater Garden under construction.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuYb9QockxY/[/youtube]

For more on their Healing Waters campaign you can

click here

I go and speak at a lot of events and it seems like there are always five or six video cameras rolling. And then it seems like they rarely get posted. In this case, Raleigh Latham sent me the video and invited me to post it anywhere I wanted.

Here is Raleigh's youtube channel:
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/user/1MonthNoRegrets/videos[/youtube]

The beginning of this video shows Sepp Holzer giving me an award for .... I dunno, doing whatever it is that I do. At the very end of the video that part is continued a little bit as we sorta joke about this nutty award.

Sepp was at Sage Mountain Center in Montana. About three hours from me. And I was told to come out as Sepp wanted to have dinner with me. And they asked if I could give a talk for about an hour. There was some debate on what I should talk about, and I asked if it could just be some Q&A.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_NIpYQsDWU[/youtube]

Zach tells me they are currently doing a bit of fund raising


CLICK HERE

Delightful! laughed till I cried. Got me inspired to look more into the financial aspects of getting independent also. Thanks for making me smile!

YEAH!!! Thank you. I spent almost 30 years in corporate America paying my dues & saving every bloody nickle I could, so that someday (which is now today) I could leave it behind. Our farm is Certified Organic, which personally I think is little more than complete BS; I grow via permaculture with some biodynamic processes for good measure. The ONLY reason I have the USDA blessing is for the fiscal spread above conventional grown stuff. I bust my ass and won't apologize for my "someday I'll make plenty of money" off of our land and our hard work. Never have in the past and don't intend to start. I have learned so very much from your site, all of your podcasts and all of the others that are here to guide, question and inspire.
Cheers!!!

Hey Paul,
Please smack me with "The Duke" round and make me smart ;o) That's great stuff in the Q & A.
Greg Mann

So, is it curmudgeonly to ask... if a fundraising campaign is required to fund this, how is it a demonstration that is anything more than something for people to come and look at? Who could afford to do this? Will the food produced from it ever justify the cost of installation?

Maybe a little bit, Sue! (Watch out for that "Duke" tree round!! Whooosh! Missed ya )

Still, to address your question, I think beginnings are always hard, and when you are innovating, you are traveling uphill. It's much easier to get a loan from a bank for a $100,000 combine to harvest GMO grains, but if you are WAY outside the mainstream, your startup money has to come from like minded individuals.

I liked the video, it's too bad the videographer seemed to suddenly run out of tape in the middle of Paul's sentence about wofati. Great to see the video of Paul getting his award. You really do need to visit Austria, dude.

I think it's a good question, and from what I know, Sepp Holzer's work is all about productivity (in balance with nature). He's a farmer, not a theorist.

This points to the value in making fundraising videos specific in telling what will be produced, in giving some numbers and orienting it in the big picture.

Will the food produced from it ever justify the cost of installation?

I think that this same question could be asked of BigAg.
Millions of square miles of prairie grasses were plowed under so that more people-centric grasses could be planted in their place. Each year, millions of yards of topsoil get washed into the Gulf of Mexico. Today, these are inert soils that need to be boosted artificially to grow a crop in them - our nation's 'bread-basket' is essentially a giant hydroponics garden - growing food in inert soils. What is the true cost of that?

I don't think that the question "Who can afford this?" really addresses the problem. To me, the question should be "Can we afford not to do this?".

In part I ask because I see these things and large hugels and keyline dams and such then I look out at our 140 acres of quite steep hill country and then I look at the bank account and I don't THINK we can afford it but maybe there is a reasonable payback period. It did occur to me after asking the question that maybe the payback is over generations and that since it operates passively once done, maybe that is ok. I don't think a comparison with industrial ag is relevant...it's certainly not the benchmark I was thinking of in asking the question. I was thinking more in terms of, are there othe sustainable options that cost less? Also, scraping off the topsoil then replacing it takes years to recover from...I know, we've done it in forming a track and resulting terraces that we garden on.

I think growing, reestablishing the earth that you are a steward of, is the biggest exercise in patience I've even encountered. We've had this land for 16 years - 100 acres. For the 1st decade, we amended less than 2 acres which included building our house on part of it. We also took that time to save $. We got to know this land, its ebbs & flows and took time to explore approaches & educate ourselves. For the past 6 years we crawled. A kitchen garden, a pond and further exploration. Then, a acre of terraces, greenhouse and a couple rain catchment & irrigation small ponds. Then came an orchard and then we knew we were good enough to extend an offer for interns/wwoofers to join us. A cottage for them to stay in and then came the implementation of a food forest within the orchard. After 16 years of sweat, saving and a lot of patience & more observation & self education we expanded our gardens to include 15 acres. It's raw dirt/clay that's been covered with seeds and this fall will be planted with a huge variety of trees and berry bushes etc that we've been propagating for a few years. I doubt Sepp will ever come to our homestead to direct and entice participants in any project, but we will continue. The place where this video was shot and the crater garden it now houses has been in the works for many years. They had a plan, a vision, patience and a goal. That, I think is how you succeed. There's a description of the life of a sapling that is also true for this quest: 1st - it sleeps, then it creeps then & only then, it leaps. Best of luck in your quest!
Marianne

Completely agree Marianne. We've ownedthis propery for 21 yrs, Iived on it for 7 1/2, lived in a new house 3 1/2 and been hosting wwoofers for 2 1/2.

I think the point with these innovations is not that everyone has to do everything. We all can try to add as many innovations as we can. As we start going, we learn how to work in cooperation with other people to make it happen. If we have seen demonstrations, we can work with others, and start. Maybe large coop groups will do them later. On many occasions, I have suggested some possibility and it really got the ball rolling for others. That's good permaculture karma, people.

I never thought I would do hugulkultur, but then I had some extra wood, then I put it in a pile and put dirt over it. It was ok but there were some problems. I supported Paul's kickstarter, not because I thought I would ever do another hugulkultur, but because I thought it was a good thing for everyone. After watching the videos, I'm going to do another one, and on this one, I'm actually going to do it right. (Imagine!)

Well I met a guy about a year ago who is starting a permaculture farm and I might help him if he tries something like this. Also maybe my wife and I will go WOOFING when we retire. Also I have to cut back some branches on my autumn olive and Pauls' video just gave me an idea of what to do with them.

and who knows what other great ideas people will offer me in the future if I keep growing like this.

Many of the things I can do now are because 20 , or 15 , or 10, or 5 years ago, I tried an experiment with something like this, I read or watched a video and tried something new.
John S
PDX OR

Thanks for the responses, they all bring out really good points. I am still, however, interested in the economics of a big earthmoving project like this. I live in a pretty moderate climate with plenty of rainfall and there probably isn't any great benefit in us doing this but I am interested to know whether there are places where it would make economic sense for a nonexternally funded individual person or family to do this.

By the way, I showed the photos to my husband who manages public gardens. He's planning to install a sunken garden accessed through a tunnel and has been pondering its construction. He liked what he saw.

Video Update on the Crater Garden at Sage Mountain Center

Nice to see the progress. Thanks.

It is great to see the fruits of our labor coming to life. Thanks for the update, Zach. Thanks for the great cinematography, Raleigh.

Thanks. Beautiful video and informative presentation.

How much food security does it offer--how many pounds of food, how many calorie-rich foods, how many days would it sustain 5 people say? Thanks!

It is wonderful to see the techniques emphasized in how to optimize what you're doing in your climate, which is quite different than mine.
THanks,
John S
PDX OR

Did you have to get a permit for the crater garden? I have been in contact with our water agency and this is the reply I got:

"You have the honor of being the first to ask if a crater garden needs a SEO permit and I don't have the answer. I have referred this on to my Administrator for his opinion and will get back with you as soon as I can."

I'm trying to lead them toward a big fat NO PERMIT and it would be awesome if I could say Montana doesn't require them.

Elle, like everything where the government is concerned it is best to be on the up and up so that you don't run into problems later. We have not needed any permit for any of the 4 Crater Gardens I have built so far, but we did need approval from one home owner's association and we always asked to confirm that no permit was needed before starting the project.

The biggest thing is what water source you are using. If you are just using rainwater or water that you otherwise own it is no problem in Montana. If you are trying to use a well to fill the Crater Garden then you should really consider a different plan, as that is not what nature wants to facilitate in that place.

It is always important to have accurate drawings that explain the process and final result, this makes educating people about them much easier. Once people understand what we are trying to do and why we are trying to do it they so far have never had any problems with it, wish us well and send us on our way. I would recommend bringing them nice detailed to scale drawings of what you are planning and then it should be no problem to get them on board.