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tinkering with this site

why 'tinkering' with labels on my photos?

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Location: Ozarks zone 7 alluvial, clay/loam with few rocks 50" yearly rain

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posted 3 years ago

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I'm finding added (sometimes inaccurate) text under my pictures in this thread https://permies.com/t/130945/mushrooms-lichens-ID-hikes-home
I would rather add my own text at my own pace. I've been labeling as I find the correct ID.

This is the second time I've had to go through all of my attachments and remove text.

I want to decorate my own thread please

If the reason is google, I think my accurate genus and species labels are working and just a generic or inaccurate label will defeat the purpose.

"We're all just walking each other home." -Ram Dass
"Be a lamp, or a lifeboat, or a ladder."-Rumi

r ranson

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posted 3 years ago

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There's a new feature to improve googlelove that we are testing.

The theory is that google loves photos with captions and file names... and other complex stuff.

Most photos are posted without these things so the system is supposed to seek them out and add relevant text (it's more complex than that).

But in theory, if you've added a caption to the text, it should that. If it's not, then there's something weird going on.

Can you upload one here with a caption and one without and we can test some stuff?

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Judith Browning

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Location: Ozarks zone 7 alluvial, clay/loam with few rocks 50" yearly rain

1933

posted 3 years ago

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These were ones I had not labeled yet...and I removed the added labels as at least half of them were inaccurate as they were the time before also.

I expect to label these myself with accurate genus and species as I gather the information. I don't see where any of those labels I removed would have helped google...they would have only added to the abundance of mislabeled photos out there on the internet.

The ones that have added labels seem to be attachments so I'll have to start up my pc where the photos are stored.
Be back in a bit.

"We're all just walking each other home." -Ram Dass
"Be a lamp, or a lifeboat, or a ladder."-Rumi

r ranson

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posted 3 years ago

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I don't know how long it will take to perfect the system, but we value the feedback. I can see it is frustrating (the system got some of my photos too).

I suspect the stopgap solution, for now, is to add a caption to the photo when you upload so that the system doesn't choose one at random. Even if it's just a placeholder like "unknown lichen".

But, I'm glad you started this thread. The staff are looking into this and we'll see what can be done. But it is also the holiday season, so things are going a bit slower than normal.

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Judith Browning

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Location: Ozarks zone 7 alluvial, clay/loam with few rocks 50" yearly rain

1933

posted 3 years ago

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Can you upload one here with a caption and one without and we can test some stuff?

I'll add some attachments...one unlabeled and one labeled.

I am almost positive about this ID Bearded Lichen (Usnea longissima Ach.), old man's beard, and could probably go ahead and label.
One of the computer generated labels called it a 'moss tree'....it is not a moss, it is a lichen. That would have given the wrong information to google...not helpful.

IMG_8837-(2).JPG

IMG_8836-(3).JPG

"We're all just walking each other home." -Ram Dass
"Be a lamp, or a lifeboat, or a ladder."-Rumi

Judith Browning

Posts: 8251

Location: Ozarks zone 7 alluvial, clay/loam with few rocks 50" yearly rain

1933

posted 3 years ago

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I am imagining the computer generated text is something like facebook uses to describe an image...it will say something like 'an image showing a rock, people and a dog' or 'an image showing a sunset and a beer' or something.

I think first, it might have been helpful to encourage everyone to go in and label for themselves with fair warning that it is going to be done for us if we don't do it ourselves.

If anything, this is going to discourage me from adding more pictures.

"We're all just walking each other home." -Ram Dass
"Be a lamp, or a lifeboat, or a ladder."-Rumi

Judith Browning

Posts: 8251

Location: Ozarks zone 7 alluvial, clay/loam with few rocks 50" yearly rain

1933

posted 3 years ago

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I have labeled many pictures in the past...but not all and with just a spot check it looks like I have a lot of work to do correcting this new labeling on some of my more extensive threads....I think I'm gonna cry

"We're all just walking each other home." -Ram Dass
"Be a lamp, or a lifeboat, or a ladder."-Rumi

r ranson

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posted 3 years ago

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Thanks.
I can see what's going on. I don't know if I have the ability to stop the system but I can see it isn't behaving in the way we had hoped.

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Joseph Lofthouse

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posted 3 years ago

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Judith: I feel your pain. I have felt pretty upset about changes that were made to my photos.

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r ranson

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posted 3 years ago

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I'm in a meeting with Paul and some other staff right now. We're looking at the issue.

We agree things went wrong.

We thank you for letting us know.

Now we are looking for possible solutions.

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paul wheaton

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posted 3 years ago

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Yeah. What raven said. I'm in the same meeting and we are brainstorming solutions.

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r ranson

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posted 3 years ago

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So, we thought of some solutions. I think they sound pretty good.

Some of the solutions we can actuate now, but most of them require changes to the code that makes permies go, so these will take longer.

I'm not sure how we can get through the interim. Older photos are still at risk of being changed by the system until we can get some code done. But new photos, it should reduce the damage if you can put a description when you upload a new photo - even if it's a place holder.

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Judith Browning

Posts: 8251

Location: Ozarks zone 7 alluvial, clay/loam with few rocks 50" yearly rain

1933

posted 3 years ago

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That sounds good and thanks for all of the effort!

That will work for the 'description' below a photo when adding an attachment.

I'm wondering what to do about my file name getting changed above many of the attached photos? I am noticing more and more of my file numbers have been replaced with words. Those were consecutive numbers for identification in my pc photo storage.

The change appears to be either one or the other...the 'description' I can deal with. I didn't see any way for me to fix my file name?

"We're all just walking each other home." -Ram Dass
"Be a lamp, or a lifeboat, or a ladder."-Rumi

r ranson

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posted 3 years ago

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noted.
not sure of an immediate fix for the file names, but we're working on that.

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Kc Simmons

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posted 3 years ago

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Judith, I'm glad you posted this; as I have noticed several of my photos having descriptions added that aren't always accurate.

Hans Quistorff

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I try to give my pictures a meaningful name when I save them. Then when I post them the file name at the top is useful to the reader then the description can give more details that help the reader digest the image.

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Judith Browning

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Location: Ozarks zone 7 alluvial, clay/loam with few rocks 50" yearly rain

1933

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Hans Quistorff wrote:I try to give my pictures a meaningful name when I save them. Then when I post them the file name at the top is useful to the reader then the description can give more details that help the reader digest the image.

I'll definitely keep this in mind now...my camera setting saves them in a folder for each day (with each file/photo having consecutive numbers from when I began years ago to save them), then I upload the folders of pictures to my pc and eventually change the folder name to the date with some few words indicator of whats in it but I rarely change individual file/photo names because I usually go back and crop and stuff and just never get around to that step.

For the future though, I wonder if there could be something set up so that when we post photos they just won't post without a description? not the file name but the fill in the blank description part when we are first attaching them?
That might help going forward?

"We're all just walking each other home." -Ram Dass
"Be a lamp, or a lifeboat, or a ladder."-Rumi

r ranson

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Posts: 31887

Location: Left Coast Canada

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posted 3 years ago

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Still working on the issue. It's going to take time.

One thing I noticed is that if the image is small enough, the system doesn't 'see' it.

I tried scaling the image down to 600 or 700 pixels on the long edge and this avoids the system trying to change the data.

how permies works
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Judith Browning

Posts: 8251

Location: Ozarks zone 7 alluvial, clay/loam with few rocks 50" yearly rain

1933

posted 3 years ago

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Thanks for the update...

I guess I thought our photos were being scaled down automatically now when we post? I would have to add that step while my photos are still on my camera and then I would lose pixels for later cropping so I would like to avoid having to do that.

I'll make sure that I add my own description to any new attached pictures and slowly do my old ones and in addition hope that my file name/number does not get caught in the 'system' any more and changed.

"We're all just walking each other home." -Ram Dass
"Be a lamp, or a lifeboat, or a ladder."-Rumi

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