Forum:

organic

vinegar as herbicide

Posts: 2603

posted 16 years ago

1
Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

would vinegar work for weeds in walkways? I'm afraid that the weeds creeping through a stone walk way will eventually break out the grout and bust up the path. I'm hoping that it would create an inhospitable enviroment by acidifying the bit of soil in the cracks.

[img]http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n52/havlik1/permie%20pics2/permiepotrait3pdd.jpg[/img]

"One cannot help an involuntary process. The point is not to disturb it. - Dr. Michel Odent

paul wheaton

author and steward

Posts: 55408

Location: missoula, montana (zone 4)

∞

I like...

posted 16 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

Yes - it will work. Although you need to make sure it is full strength vinegar. Apparently, most vinegar is a bit diluted.

Gwen Lynn

Posts: 736

posted 16 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

Yep, there's places that sell full strength vinegar. Paul James the gardener guy has talked about it on his show a bazillion times. You can also pour boiling water on weeds to kill them. This works well on weeds between stones, bricks, etc.

Kathleen Sanderson

pollinator

Posts: 1565

Location: Zone 6b

211

I like...

posted 16 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

I've used regular store-bought vinegar, and it works. Might have to repeat the application in two or three years, but it's better than using Round-up (and a lot less expensive!).

Kathleen

Susan Monroe

Posts: 1093

Location: Western WA

posted 16 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

I've only used regular 5% grocery vinegar, and it works fine for weeds with shallow roots. It doesn't work on weeds with deep tap roots like dandelions that I've found, but multiple applications applied less randomly than I've done

may have better results. But I've never tested to see if young dandelions are more susceptible, which they may well be.

And the effect might be better when the soil is dry, if that is an option.

The stronger 18% vinegar is used for pickling, so that may lead you to a source.

It is said that regular white vinegar shows the best results.

Sue

Leah Sattler

Posts: 2603

posted 16 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

thanks! I will give the regular stuff a shot since I have several gallons already and see if it works.

[img]http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n52/havlik1/permie%20pics2/permiepotrait3pdd.jpg[/img]

"One cannot help an involuntary process. The point is not to disturb it. - Dr. Michel Odent

Posts: 16

Location: MASSACHUSETTS 35 MI W OF BOSTON

posted 16 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

I USED STORE BOUGHT WHITE VINEGAR, TOOK A 3/4 INCH METAL POST, WENT UP TO THE NASTY DANDELIONS, THE NASTY ONES ARE THE ONES I AM NOT GOING TO JUICE, POKED A HOLE DOWN THE CENTER , AND POURED A BIT OF VINEGAR, MAYBE 1/2 CUP OR LESS, IN ONE DAY THEY SHOWED BURN, WE THEN HAD A LOUSY WEEK, I WORK OUTDOORS AND WAS IN NO MOOD TO CHECK THEM AFTER BEING COLD AND WET ALL DAY.... ANYWAY 6 DAYS LATER THEY ARE COMPLETELY ERRADICATED. BROWN, DEAD, GONE..... EASY AS CAN BE.DANDELION B GONE A SLIGHT OVERPOUR HALO OF BROWN GRASS , IS EVIDENT. SO NEXT TIME I WILL USE A DIFFERENT METHOD OF APPLICATION. TO BE MORE PRECISE.

TRAPPED IN 2 WORLDS

Brenda Groth

pollinator

Posts: 4437

Location: North Central Michigan

posted 16 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

the boiling water will also work for the ants living in the cracks of your walkway..but i'm not sure about the vinegar?

Brenda

Bloom where you are planted.
http://restfultrailsfoodforestgarden.blogspot.com/

Posts: 16

Location: MASSACHUSETTS 35 MI W OF BOSTON

posted 16 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

Brenda Groth wrote:
the boiling water will also work for the ants living in the cracks of your walkway..but i'm not sure about the vinegar?

I ACTUALLY SAW THE SUGGESTION FOR DANDELIONS, NOT ANTS....IN MY HOME I WAS INVADED WITH LARGE BLACK ANTS, AT NIGHT IT WAS A TWILIGHT ZONE SHOW, I WOULD CREEP DOWN THE STAIRS AND THE WATERMELON RIND WOULD BE CRAWLING BLACK,,,,YUCK, AFTER MUCH TRIAL AND ERROR, I CLEANED ALL CABINETS AND SURFACED WITH A NATURAL CLEANER, "MIRACLE TWO SOAP" YOU CAN BRUSH YOUR TEETH WITH IT .... NON TOXIC... IT REMOVED ALL THE CHEM TRAILS , SUCH THAT THE ANTS COULD NOT FIND THEIR WAY BACK., I THEN LINED ALL CABINETS WITH GROUND CINNAMON TRAILS, NEVER HAD ANTS AGAIN,,,, THAT WAS FOUR OR FIVE YEARS AGO. I STILL USE THAT MIRACLE TWO AS MY ONLY HOME CLEANSER, AND THE CINAMON HAS LONG SINCE BEEN VACUUMED OUT...

TRAPPED IN 2 WORLDS

Leah Sattler

Posts: 2603

posted 16 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

cinnamon! cool idea! does it kill them or do they just find it noxious? I fiugre I ought to wait for a day without rain before I try the vinegar thing. looks like we might get a break tommorrow.

[img]http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n52/havlik1/permie%20pics2/permiepotrait3pdd.jpg[/img]

"One cannot help an involuntary process. The point is not to disturb it. - Dr. Michel Odent

Posts: 16

Location: MASSACHUSETTS 35 MI W OF BOSTON

posted 16 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

THEY FIND THE CINNAMON NOXIOUS, WITH THE CHEM TRAILS GONE THEY JUST FIND ANOTHER HOME, IT WAS ACTUALLY AMAZING AS PRIOR TO THIS APPROACH I HAD HAD THE HOUSE SPRAYED, NOT BY CHOICE, BY EX HUSBAND, SO WHEN THIS WORKED I WAS ECSTATIC,..... THE VINEGAR WORKED, WE HAD RAIN THE VERY NEXT DAY I APPLIED IT. I DONT THINK IT WAS AN ISSUE, THE PH LEVEL JUST DID IT......

TRAPPED IN 2 WORLDS

Travis Philp

gardener

Posts: 965

Location: ZONE 5a Lindsay Ontario Canada

posted 15 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

I can attest to storebought vinegar working as a herbicide. I diluted it to about 60% vinegar and 40% water but in future I would go for 70/30 because though the vinegar had visible burn, it didn't get all the foliage.

Oh, and for application method I used a backpack sprayer. Make sure to do it on a wind-less day.

I've heard a good thing to do before applying to tall plants is to flatten them for a few hours to a day with cardboard or wooden boards to be able to hit more plant surface area. I suppose plants growing in cracks don't get that high but I thought I'd throw that out there for others benefit.

http://www.greenshireecofarms.com
Zone 5a in Central Ontario, Canada

Travis Philp

gardener

Posts: 965

Location: ZONE 5a Lindsay Ontario Canada

posted 15 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

I've also used vinegar to deter ants.

A few years ago I lived in a camping trailer and we had ants crawling in the ceiling, with a regular path across one of the skylights.

So I sprayed vinegar a few times over the course of a couple of days in the skylight, as well as all other places I'd seen them and they stopped showing their anty faces around after that.

http://www.greenshireecofarms.com
Zone 5a in Central Ontario, Canada

paul wheaton

author and steward

Posts: 55408

Location: missoula, montana (zone 4)

∞

I like...

posted 15 years ago

1
Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

I think vinegar is one of those things where I just can't help but get the feeling that I'm going about it all wrong.

It's like that whole thing about what is the difference between permaculture and organic.

organic: If you normally think of spraying roundup, then organic is what you use instead of roundup.

permaculture: if you improve your diversity, the weeds go away.

Travis Philp

gardener

Posts: 965

Location: ZONE 5a Lindsay Ontario Canada

posted 15 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

For me the method was an experiment for broad-ish scale no-till bed prep and planting of beans without having to sheet mulch. My other controls were cardboard and sheet metal 'tractors'. These were laid down for several days until weeds were at or near death and then moved. Then the bean seeds were planted and the area was mulched with hay.

The sheet metal worked best but the cardboard held down by rocks works about as well, it just doesn't warme the ground like the sheet metal does.

http://www.greenshireecofarms.com
Zone 5a in Central Ontario, Canada

Joel Hollingsworth

pollinator

Posts: 2103

Location: Oakland, CA

posted 15 years ago

1
Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

paul wheaton wrote:permaculture: if you improve your diversity, the weeds go away.

It's possible to propagate moss by pureeing it in a blender with skim milk or buttermilk. A quick search found this:

Cover rocks and bricks with moss using a buttermilk-moss milk shake. A soft green moss veneer adds an air of antiquity, permanence, and beauty to walls, walks, or woodland rock gardens. You can wait a few years for moss to naturally creep into moist and shady places, or you can encourage a quicker appearance. Gather local cushion-forming mosses, the kinds that thrive in your climate, and find a garden location similar to where they naturally grow. Mix the moss with buttermilk in a blender and pour the concoction onto the appropriate rocks or bricks in your garden. Let it dry thoroughly. Keep the area moist, but not so wet that the milk shake washes off the bricks or stones. New moss will soon make an appearance.

here http://home.howstuffworks.com/how-to-design-gardens4.htm

Might that compete with any new weeds, once the old ones are dead?

"the qualities of these bacteria, like the heat of the sun, electricity, or the qualities of metals, are part of the storehouse of knowledge of all men. They are manifestations of the laws of nature, free to all men and reserved exclusively to none." SCOTUS, Funk Bros. Seed Co. v. Kale Inoculant Co.

Travis Philp

gardener

Posts: 965

Location: ZONE 5a Lindsay Ontario Canada

posted 15 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

Joel Hollingsworth wrote:
Might that compete with any new weeds, once the old ones are dead?

I worked at a farm near here a few years ago...We had success with moss growing naturally between rows of baby cut-and-come-again lettuce. The moss was very good at keeping out other 'weeds'.

http://www.greenshireecofarms.com
Zone 5a in Central Ontario, Canada

Scott Reil

Posts: 179

Location: Colchester, CT

posted 15 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

The other thing to keep in mind is that weeds can be indicators of low nutrient levels; dandelions are indicators for low calcium and pH, and likely high potassium. The chapter on weeds in my good friend Paul Tukey's "Organic Lawn Care Manual" is titled "Listening To Your Weeds" and helps not only with ID and organic treatment, but what they are trying to tell us. Understanding this language can be a great benefit to any gardener... f'rinstance, moss suggests compaction, low fertility and excess moisture...

HG

Connecticut Accredited Nurseryperson
Accredited Organic Land Care Professional (NOFA)

Travis Philp

gardener

Posts: 965

Location: ZONE 5a Lindsay Ontario Canada

posted 15 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

There was definitly some mild compaction and excess moisture in our mossy lettuce beds but the lettuce grew at a good rate and was healthy. The area was a chicken tractor area the year before so those two pieces of evidence tell me that the nutrient level was alright, at least for lettuce.

http://www.greenshireecofarms.com
Zone 5a in Central Ontario, Canada

Scott Reil

Posts: 179

Location: Colchester, CT

posted 15 years ago

Number of slices to send:

Optional 'thank-you' note:

Send

Yeah, Travis, moss is not really plant competitive, so not so much an issue (even in lawn I have no problem with it).

Dandelions, not so much...

Connecticut Accredited Nurseryperson
Accredited Organic Land Care Professional (NOFA)

Clean With Cleaners You Can Eat by Raven Ranson

will be released to subscribers in: soon!

click here for details