Fractals in Orcharding?

Hi to all,

This is question about fractals, which occur in nature (also pseudo-fractals) from crystals to broccolli, mountain and riverine estuaries, I was wondering if anyone could comment on the idea of using fractal patterns for orchard or poly-food production. Should one bother? Benefits? Any super good or bad reasons to or not to?

Thanks, its been on my mind

..Mike

I've seen a ton of "outside the box" thinking on planting but never anything that involves fractals.
Since all plants are natural fractals, I really can't think of any benefits to designing a planting situation that way too (aside from just looking cool.) There are too many other design elements that take precedent IMO.
If you think about one property of fractals, maximum edge area, we're naturally doing that with guilds and polycultures already.  

Wonder how companion planting and or square-foot gardening might be incooporated...

I was thinking that the vase shape of a pruned tree is a fractal.
John S
PDX OR

Thanks Matt, Todd and John, was just wondering about it. Upon meditation it did seem to me that there might be some effect on wind, but since in nature plant communities dont really grow in fractals theres no great reason to do it.  The only thing I can imagine is that if you think of the fractal as 3 dimensional, like  a snail shell pressed into the ground, you might be able to spiral rainwater down through a particular planting. Perhaps that would be a good idea for a moss garden?

I designed my food forest based on clusters that have high concentrations in the middle and radiate outward. Is that what you mean by fractal?

Fractals are infinitely complex patterns that are self-similar across different scales. They are created by repeating a simple process over and over in an ongoing feedback loop. ... Abstract fractals – such as the Mandelbrot Set – can be generated by a computer calculating a simple equation over and over.

Hello,

I assume that the Fractals mentioned are dendritic fractals,
Looking like trees,

This is common in water sheds and lightning and trees,

Dendritic fractals are naturally occurring and the most effective natural way of transporting water and minerals!

So fractals are the best at moving not storing!

Note: Look up nutrient cycles!

Question: how does the information on the fractals scale down to just an orchard!

Note: Neal spackman associated with Geoff lawton and several greening of the deserts, appears to be a person who may have information about this concept!

Thoughts: Potential use in catching and storing water and minerals, which could be pumped back into the system even used to house fish and other organisms to enrich the orchard, huge potential in design, but also higher risks.

Harvesting may be harder because of design!

Maybe a double fractal. with a huge valley and in the centre a collecting point. which means that light is reflect back up at the trees, and more land for growing but then boomerang swales around each tree wound be needed and around the pond filtering species would be needed.
But this could also be good because you could add ducks to the system and this would help with cover cropping the orchard and keeping down pests.
I also think that this sort of design could help reduce wind damage to trees.

Conclusion, this is a good thing to think about! thank you!

Michael Littlejohn wrote: I was wondering if anyone could comment on the idea of using fractal patterns for orchard or poly-food production. Should one bother? Benefits? Any super good or bad reasons to or not to?

I like learning about new words, concepts, etc.

Michael, could you give me your definition of "fractals"?

I like the way mother nature plants her trees though this is probably not a sensible way to plant an orchard because it would take way too much time and expense to maintain. Not to mention trying to harvest.

Might be a great concept for a forest garden or a food forest.

Yes, Ann,

I had to look up a definition for fractals and there are pages on it. I am weak in mathematics but this one struck me as workable:

"irregular geometric structure that cannot be described by classical geometry because magnification of the structure reveals repeated patterns of similarly irregular, but progressively smaller, dimensions: fractals are especially apparent in natural forms and phenomena because the geometric properties of the physical world are largely abstract, as with clouds, crystals, tree bark, or the path of lightning.

The fractals that are most striking in nature, to my eyes are snail shells, ammonites, nautilus, brocolli florets, but also snowflakes and ice crystaline structures. Blood vessles, capillaries and coastlines are also said to be types of fractals.

I love the idea a a fractal food forest. However, having put in several hundred trees on a steep property this past year, I can say from experience that any pattern one tries to apply rigidly on uneven terrain will quickly fall apart or drive you nuts! It reminded me of trying to reside an non-level house.

And root competition, changes in soil density, the presence of underground water and a host of other unseen factors will "tell" you where trees should go. Mother Nature will have the last word in it all.

Yes, I think that roots can also represent a fractal.  Not necessarily a mirror of the branches, but a fractal nonetheless.
John S
PDX OR

Michael, I love that idea! If it were me, I would try to plant using the golden ratio. That ratio can be found all over nature. More about that here:
https://www.treehugger.com/how-golden-ratio-manifests-nature-4869736