Food Forest's and variety-density of species

Hi. I have just started my journey on transforming my land into a food forest. I was thinking about starting with planting Hazel, pears, apples and plums. And maybe some willows and sumac's. should I grow many varieties of the same specie in my food forest garden? like 6 varieties of hazel, Instead of 2?

Eivind Ter wrote:Hi. I have just started my journey on transforming my land into a food forest. I was thinking about starting with planting Hazel, pears, apples and plums. And maybe some willows and sumac's. should I grow many varieties of the same specie in my food forest garden? like 6 varieties of hazel, Instead of 2?

I would.  You may find that some varieties thrive on your land and some may not do well.

Eivind, welcome to the forum!

I like the idea of having several of each variety.  The more the merrier if you have room.

What are you planning for your shrub layer?

with things like apples and pears, multiple varieties helps insure better pollination (but do a little research and make sure the various varieties’ bloom time matches up). in general, having more diversity is a better plan, as not all varieties will do the same under pressures of weather, disease, etc…diversity helps hedge our bets.

Thank you everyone for answering🙌😄
Im excited to be here😊

Anne Miller wrote:Eivind, welcome to the forum!

I like the idea of having several of each variety.  The more the merrier if you have room.

What are you planning for your shrub layer?

I was planning to begin with planting buckthorn, serviceberries, currants, rosemary, razberries and lavender!😊

Hello Eivind. I read your post and was trying to figure out the general area where you live based on your plant choices. So far, Buckthorn tells me that you don't live in Minnesota or Michigan, Hazel tells me you probably live in the Northern Hemisphere, willows and sumac suggest a moist climate, rosemary and lavender could place you in a dryer climate within growing zones 7 - 10, currants could mean that you're in zone 3-5. Of course with micro-climates, anything is possible. Would you give us a hint; where in the world do you live?

Eivind Ter wrote:Thank you everyone for answering🙌😄
Im excited to be here😊

Anne Miller wrote:Eivind, welcome to the forum!

I like the idea of having several of each variety.  The more the merrier if you have room.

What are you planning for your shrub layer?

I was planning to begin with planting buckthorn, serviceberries, currants, rosemary, razberries and lavender!😊

I'm all for people doing whatever they like, but why buckthorn?  I find that plant to be terrible.  People here will do almost anything to eradicate it.

Amy Gardener wrote:Hello Eivind. I read your post and was trying to figure out the general area where you live based on your plant choices. So far, Buckthorn tells me that you don't live in Minnesota or Michigan, Hazel tells me you probably live in the Northern Hemisphere, willows and sumac suggest a moist climate, rosemary and lavender could place you in a dryer climate within growing zones 7 - 10, currants could mean that you're in zone 3-5. Of course with micro-climates, anything is possible. Would you give us a hint; where in the world do you live?

I live in the south of Norway, so I have a pretty niche climate, being in Norway. And so, the Northern hemisphere is correct 😊  I can grow apricots here as well^^

The property I have has plenty of space where area's contain wetland's with boggy anaerobic soil, forest's with humus-rich soil"with a lot of wild blueberries!" and sandy soil.
And I have windbreaks from Northern side! So yes, alot of room for microclimates.

Trace Oswals wrote:


I'm all for people doing whatever they like, but why buckthorn?  I find that plant to be terrible.  People here will do almost anything to eradicate it.

I was tginking of planting it because a youtuber I follow called Canadian Permaculture Legacy speaks warmly about the plant.
Why does it have so bad of a reputation in the place you live in?

sea buckthorn, Hippophae rhamnoides, is the well-regarded permaculture plant. true buckthorn, Rhamnus spp, is a hard-to-eradicate invasive in the northern u.s…chances are, sea buckthorn is what Eivind is referring to - we should maybe check with that youtuber to be clear.

Eivind Ter wrote:

Trace Oswals wrote:


I'm all for people doing whatever they like, but why buckthorn?  I find that plant to be terrible.  People here will do almost anything to eradicate it.

I was tginking of planting it because a youtuber I follow called Canadian Permaculture Legacy speaks warmly about the plant.
Why does it have so bad of a reputation in the place you live in?

There’s a plant called “common buckthorn”, & maybe some other names like European buckthorn (can’t remember exactly), that is inedible and considered by many to be an invasive weed. The plant known as “sea berry” or “sea buckthorn” is a different plant altogether. However, the species in the wild  have been known to spread significantly in certain biomes as well. I think it might be considered invasive in the northern sand dunes of Alberta.

I’m guessing you’ll be fine with sea buckthorn in your area in a sunny spot. I’m trying to nurse along a couple of cultivars in 5+ hours of sunlight and coastal wind, and they are doing mediocre.

greg mosser wrote:sea buckthorn, Hippophae rhamnoides, is the well-regarded permaculture plant. true buckthorn, Rhamnus spp, is a hard-to-eradicate invasive in the northern u.s…chances are, sea buckthorn is what Eivind is referring to - we should maybe check with that youtuber to be clear.

Eon MacNeill wrote:

Hippophae rhamnoides It is ^^
Good to know! So I don't get the wrong one, Thanksto both of you!🤗

Definitely plant more varieties! I wouldn't double up on any one variety unless you've been growing several for a few years and know what works best. But even then, I personally wouldn't because I'm a plant hoarder and always want to try out a new variety! 😂

Benefits:

Better pollination. A lot of varieties do better when they are cross pollinated, even those that don't need to be cross pollinated.

Extended harvest- I pick blueberries, strawberries, and raspberries from June to September because I have different varieties with different ripening times. I also get a couple months of apples and I'm looking to do the same with plums.

Insurance! With multiple varieties, you have a better chance of withstanding disease and pests. If you plant only a couple varieties, they could end up being susceptible to something and dying and you just lost all your plants. I've had plums, apples and pears die but only one variety usually dies while the others end up being immune or resistant. Also with slightly offset bloom times, when the weather gets weird you have a better chance of not losing a whole growing season to a late snow or frost.

I would also go with different varieties, with the main argument being different ripening times.
Usually people here do not want all of their fruits at once, but more evenly distributed over the season.
So make sure to get early and late varieties...this way they also don't compete for the same nutrients at the same time.

Eivind Ter wrote: should I grow many varieties of the same specie in my food forest garden? like 6 varieties of hazel, Instead of 2?

How about grafting? This is using the most fit varieties as the base, then grafting all the varieties you like in these base trees.
In cold climates you might use spaliered trees too, to take advantage of warm walls.