Rice beer?

Has anyone out there had experience making rice beer? Or is that best left to people who are already skilled in the art of fermentation?

Well, it must be possible, since Budweiser is mostly rice beer with saturation marketing. Seriously, people who are somewhat gluten intolerant (not celiac) can often tolerate Bud. If only it was priced for what's in the can, and tasted better, I would buy it. But alas ...

It depends on what we mean by rice beer.  Do we mean malting the rice, toasting it, then adding yeast like we do when making barley beer?  It's possible, but difficult to get right because rice doesn't make the same kind of sugar as barley, rye, oats, wheat do when processed in this way.

However, the Asian method of cooking the rice, fermenting it with a mould called koji, then processing it into wine or beer works great.  I've done this quite a few times and (um, I hear) the local Korean store sells something under the counter that doesn't have any English on it, but very quickly makes a sparkly alcoholic drink from cooked rice that can be put in bottles to be more fizzy like beer.  

I too snubbed bud for their use of rice in their grain. AND although I do not drink bud, rice does actually have it's place in craft beer, if you're going for a lighter crisper beer. I plan to try it out someday when I can design my own craft beer recipes.

I too make and drink the heavy yoghurt style Korean rice ferment, I want to try Japanese style sake one day if I can ever find the proper recipe again.

Fermenting rice needs enzymes of some kind to release the starches and sugars from the grain. That's why barley is malted, or specialty bacteria are used to digest the grain. You could malt rice, that's how brown rice vinegar was traditionally made in Asia, but it's not preferred for wine making, maybe there's a reason. Another very ancient way was to chew on the rice and spit it into a vessel, our saliva has enzymes that will break down starches. I wouldn't try that for obvious reasons, but if it's only for your own consumption I guess you could...

The question is, why specifically rice beer? If it's a gluten issue there are gluten free/gluten-light beer recipes out there apparently...

Right. I used to brew beer, before I had REAL hobbies (like working on my daughters car, or hanging out in my crawlspace pretending to be a plumber...) and I do remember hearing many times that Budweiser may taste like ass but it's really hard to brew with rice like that.

Actually Bud is my favorite of the American "beer seltzers". At least it tastes like SOMETHING.

I have used the Chinese Rice Wine balls.  As best I understand, they are koji and yeast made from the lees/dregs of a previous batch.  I haven't come up with a really good recipe yet that isn't too sweet or too sour.  I also haven't tried to bottle carbonate it.  

Rice beer... First thing that came to mind was amazake as stated...

Sake is just rice wine. It's pretty much rice beer but a bit higher alcohol, so the US classifies it as wine and it's legal to make at home. I still have some packets of various koji strains in the freezer. I have 50lbs+ of organic soybeans finally so I'm going to make something soon. Not sure what. My shoyu is still very cloudy after almost a year so I'm not sure if it was a success. I'm scared to taste it... lol.

Edit: just tasted it after the smell seemingly stabilized... I think it worked! Totally amazed. About to put it outside near some sunlight because I read that darkens it.

In my youth I traveled a bit in Asia.  Drank a lot of Sapporro, Asahi, San Miguel, and others.  Found that rice based beer gives me a headache and a hung over feeling (even after very few beers.) the next day.  Found that Budwiser will do the same, so won't drink it.

It can be very good beer.  Make sure it sits right with your system.  Not all grains are the same.

Thanks, All!  This has been an education. First, I no longer feel alone in thinking that Budweiser is a terrible thing to do to water. Second, it somehow never occurred to me that rice beer is essentially weak sake. Third, it sounds like it'd be a lot easier to limit rice fermentation to amazake. Update to come...

Beer and sake type rice ferments are really only similar in that they are both fermented alcoholic beverages, the microorganisms used are different and the resulting flavors are worlds different.

If you want a beer type beverage and flavor, you'd want to malt your rice and use hops, and practice with other additions until you get something tasty.

Aspergillus/sake type drinks are also really good and some are even easier than beer:

If you want a light, sweet rice "punch" amazake or Korean sikhye are only about 1% alcohol and really refreshing. It's not carbonated or fizzy.

Korean makgeolli is very easy to make, it's thicker and usually lightly shaken to disperse the sediment from the bottom. It's about 5% and lightly carbonated because it's consumed raw, but you can also prime it with a bit of sugar and allow it to build up CO2 for a fizzier drink, and stronger alcohol. Makgeolli is sweet and tart, it reminds me of a drinking yoghurts, full of probiotics and vitamins, and a hearty drink. Commercial makgeolli is back sweetened with aspartame, if you find your home brew too strong you can dilute it right before drinking with sugar water.

Japanese fine sake is an art in itself, cool brewing temps, ultra polished white rice, complicated brewing stages, racking and aging produce a fine clear wine nearing 20% alcohol. It's also not carbonated.

Why not try making one gallon batches of each, and see which one you like brewing and drinking the best?

Judson Carroll wrote:I have used the Chinese Rice Wine balls.  As best I understand, they are koji and yeast made from the lees/dregs of a previous batch.  I haven't come up with a really good recipe yet that isn't too sweet or too sour.  I also haven't tried to bottle carbonate it.  

the converting of the starches into sugars/sugars into alcohol/alcohol into vinegar is continuous in these environments, so finding the right balance between sweet and sour is a timing thing - you just need to keep tasting regularly until the taste is where you want it…or in the case of bottle carbonation, i guess you need to know what level of residual sweetness is right to cue you to bottle, knowing that in the process of carbonation, some of that sugar will get eaten.

i like those yeast balls. lots of room to play.

greg mosser wrote:

Judson Carroll wrote:I have used the Chinese Rice Wine balls.  As best I understand, they are koji and yeast made from the lees/dregs of a previous batch.  I haven't come up with a really good recipe yet that isn't too sweet or too sour.  I also haven't tried to bottle carbonate it.  

the converting of the starches into sugars/sugars into alcohol/alcohol into vinegar is continuous in these environments, so finding the right balance between sweet and sour is a timing thing - you just need to keep tasting regularly until the taste is where you want it…or in the case of bottle carbonation, i guess you need to know what level of residual sweetness is right to cue you to bottle, knowing that in the process of carbonation, some of that sugar will get eaten.

i like those yeast balls. lots of room to play.

Especially true in hot regions and the tropics. The only beer you can really make here without refrigeration is a high fermentation temp sour beer, saison, and you can make mead here but without some temp control it'd be rough.

Of course rum does fantastically here as shown by history.

Koji ferments like sake tend to actually be milder in temperature so you could probably get them done at room temperature indoors. Not sure if in Japan they would wait for Winter to near or what, interesting nonetheless.

K Kat wrote:Beer and sake type rice ferments are really only similar in that they are both fermented alcoholic beverages, the microorganisms used are different and the resulting flavors are worlds different.

If you want a beer type beverage and flavor, you'd want to malt your rice and use hops, and practice with other additions until you get something tasty.

Aspergillus/sake type drinks are also really good and some are even easier than beer:

If you want a light, sweet rice "punch" amazake or Korean sikhye are only about 1% alcohol and really refreshing. It's not carbonated or fizzy.

Korean makgeolli is very easy to make, it's thicker and usually lightly shaken to disperse the sediment from the bottom. It's about 5% and lightly carbonated because it's consumed raw, but you can also prime it with a bit of sugar and allow it to build up CO2 for a fizzier drink, and stronger alcohol. Makgeolli is sweet and tart, it reminds me of a drinking yoghurts, full of probiotics and vitamins, and a hearty drink. Commercial makgeolli is back sweetened with aspartame, if you find your home brew too strong you can dilute it right before drinking with sugar water.

Japanese fine sake is an art in itself, cool brewing temps, ultra polished white rice, complicated brewing stages, racking and aging produce a fine clear wine nearing 20% alcohol. It's also not carbonated.

Why not try making one gallon batches of each, and see which one you like brewing and drinking the best?

Thanks K Kat!  This seems like a wonderful homework assignment.