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ducks and geese

Moveable duck pond, or duck pool, which liner?

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I want to have a moveable duck pond, as I cannot dig any pond here, and would need several.
The use of kiddie pools is not an option, as the local legislation requires the ducks to have 3 m3 of swimmable water available.

I thought of using a structure, onto which I put a pond liner. However I am not sure which pond liner is:

a) resistant to the claws of muscovy ducks
b) does not contain too many nasty chemicals leaching into the water

I was first thinking of using old truck tarps, they seem quite sturdy and would reduce the production of plastic as it is recycling. However, what about the leaching?

What else could I use? What thickness withstands the claws of the muscovy ducks?

hans muster

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It looks like some other people are interested in the topic, as it got some upvotes.
I therefore reply to the post again to give it some more visibility...

Carla Burke

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I think most of the people who need to keep their ducks moving around, go with smaller, easier to move wash tubs, pans, etc. I can't think of a single other way to bring all of those needs together. I can tell you our muskovies, in more than a year, had access to a decent (roughly 1/3acre) sized pond, but never once used it. They generally preferred the wash tubs, only getting into the bigger tubs for washing, on occasion. I have no idea how to accommodate those laws, and still keep it portable.

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Anne Miller

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What is the penalty for not having a 3m x 3m pond?

By US standards that is roughly 10 x 10 feet.

So by legislation, a person is not allowed to have ducks without this pond?

That is quite a large moveable structure.

Our hunters' truck tarp had some sort of backing that came loose with lots of fiber that would not be good for ducks.

You might look into the billboard vinyl like is used for roofs on wofatis.

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Jay Angler

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Hans does, "3 m3" mean "three meters cubed" or "three meters by three meters surface area". What depth do they expect?

Muscovy claws are really sharp - they're wood ducks that use those claws for climbing trees and hanging on to them! We use rubber bins in the summer, and have a winter creek that they do enjoy in the winter, but they aren't really an open- water duck. Carla's 1/3 acre pond may well have been too intimidating to her ducks. Depending on your weather, some sort of meandering creek bed with an artificial wetland at the end, that you can divide into paddocks might work, but you'd need some sort of water supply and some check-dams to keep the water where you want it for short periods.

I will say this much, Muscovy *much* prefer CLEAN water - they will ignore dirty water, then the second I dump and refill their bins, they're in there often before I've even got the hose out!

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Matt McSpadden

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Hi Hans,
Can you confirm the wording of the ordinance about how much water they are required to have? If it just means total, then you could combine several smaller kiddie pools to meet the requirement. If they mean in a single body of water, could you consider building 2 or 3 semi-permanent pools? Not digging them in, but building them out of wood and pond liner with a way to drain them easily for cleaning? Then you don't move the pools around, just the ducks?

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hans muster

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Hi, my mistake, I meant to write 3 m2, meaning 3 square meters, which 2 meters by 1.5 meters. (or about 6 feet by 5 feet). Or to take a round shape, 2 m diameter (6 and a half feet diameter). It has to be at least 0.4 m deep, (almost one and a half foot deep).

I know about the sharp claws of the muscovies, had some scratches some time ago.

Anne Miller, you talk about billboard vinyl, also called PVC: I was thinking of it, but am hesitating due to it being the largest source of dioxine. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyvinyl_chloride

Anne Miller

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I am not sure which is worse the billboard vinyl or the truck tarp. The truck tarp is made of vinyl or PVC-coated polyester.

I only mentioned it as an alternative to the truck tarp you mentioned as billboard vinyl might not have those fibers that would not be good for ducks.

After reading all the discussions here about duck claws I would suggest that a kiddie pool or digging a pond is the only alternative.

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Matt McSpadden

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Hi Hans,
They are not cheap, but what about some kind of stock tank? This one would qualify. I'm not sure how easy it would be to move with just human strength, but it would be moveable at least by tractor or 4-wheeler. I would want to add some sort of drain valve of course.

https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/countyline-galvanized-round-stock-tank-8-ft-x-2-ft

**Edit - Apparently it already has a drain plug.

Jay Angler

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Wow, Matt, that's a really nice tank, but as you say, not cheap!

I have something smaller that I move around and I place it where the drain water will benefit plants. The ducks do love it, but the water has to be cleaned every 2-3 days.

I have an old ABS canoe that was abandoned on my farm and it would come close to meeting the requirements. I wonder if you could find an old boat cheaply enough and use it?

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Matt McSpadden

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Hi Jay,
I like your idea of a boat. Leave the boat on the trailer, and fill with water. It should be pretty easy to move around. I wonder if you should build some kind of ramp, so as to not encourage the ducks to fly (and possibly get ideas about escaping)?

Jay Angler

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Matt McSpadden wrote: I like your idea of a boat. Leave the boat on the trailer, and fill with water. It should be pretty easy to move around. I wonder if you should build some kind of ramp, so as to not encourage the ducks to fly (and possibly get ideas about escaping)?

I'd be careful about leaving it on the trailer - water is *really* heavy. Most boat trailers aren't designed for that much extra weight. I was thinking you'd actually have to make some sort of a boat-shaped hole for it to sit in while it's full of water, so the sides have some support.

I made ramps for my stock tanks - the Muscovy didn't need them, but the khakis and geese used them. A few rocks or tree trunk bits would be enough if the tank/boat is going repeatedly back to the same spot in a rotation. Much depends on the height of the side wall.

However, for the Khakis, I had to put a rock in the bottom at one end to make it shallow enough for them to get out after they'd splashed 1/4 of the water out. Getting out is an important consideration to design into the system!

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hans muster

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Nice ideas with these tanks, even if quite heavy and not possible to transport in a bicycle cart.

On tarps, I was thinking of rubber tarps, some of which are used for fish apparently, but cannot find good info on them. If thick enough, or if there is a way to protect them from the claws of the flat-beaked dinosaurs, it could potentially work.

Jay Angler

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hans muster wrote:On tarps, I was thinking of rubber tarps, some of which are used for fish apparently, but cannot find good info on them. If thick enough, or if there is a way to protect them from the claws of the flat-beaked dinosaurs, it could potentially work.

We have some heavy rubber pond liner that a former owner left abandoned on what is now our land. Yes - it's tough, thick and heavy if you get the really thick version. EPDM is considered a roofing material, so searching for that might get you better hits: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EPDM_rubber

It comes in different thicknesses, and I think the thickest version would survive Muscovy claws. That said, are you going to line a dip in the ground, or make something? Are you going to try to move it around, or leave it in one spot?

If I was going to leave it in one spot, I think I'd still use boards to protect any areas that they'd be climbing in and out. I'd also plan into the project a way to dump, clean and refill it regularly.

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Anne Miller

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EPDM is considered a roofing material, so searching for that might get you better hits: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EPDM_rubber

I thought of this last night. Rubber roofs are readily available.

They are used in the Recreation vehicle industry and also by roofing companies for protection while doing a roofing job on a house.

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Michael Cox

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What about the bottom 1ft of a IBC container?

The cages are great for loose stacking firewood while it dries as well. They sometimes come up free/cheap if they are damaged. The plastic is food safe and very stable.

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hans muster

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Thanks for your replies.
Anne, the keyword EPDM is helpful. However, some of the roofing materials are treated with fungicides and other cides which may kill fish, therefore I would not use it for in a place I intend to eat from. See https://drjohnson.com/i-have-built-a-new-pond-using-rubber-roofing-material-as-a-liner-is-this-safe-for-fish/

Michael, regarding the IBC containers: I was thinking of it, but the size is too small, even if I put it on the side and cut it. What I was wondering however, was if I could cut it and melt it together, as it is PE, a thermoplast. I have however never done it, and would not know how to start.

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