How can I approach a GERD diagnosis more naturally?

My wife and I are both GERDy. GERD is short for gastroesophageal reflux disease. We've both been diagnosed in the last two years and have had upper endoscopies to rule out serious issues. Currently, Cathy is taking prescription Protonix and I'm taking OTC Prilosec. They are both working marvelously. But neither of us loves the idea of taking daily meds for the rest of our lives. Maybe we just need to recalibrate our expectations as we age, but maybe there are other options. (We're obviously not as opposed to conventional medicine as the hard-liners here.)

So, what do (or would) you do for this condition?

I see some useful information here: https://permies.com/t/133771/Zantac-type-products-recalled-possibly

My wife has GERD, and whenever it flares up, she chews a couple of peppermint Altoids.  Goes away in seconds.

I had persistant GERD symptoms for years that started triggering nightly asthma attacks. Weeks of no sleep and my already shaky health started spiralling.

Nothing worked until I started experimenting with chlorine dioxide (information you can find floating about the web). After a few days of oral treatment I mixed up about an ounce of the concentrated stuff and added it to a hot bath.

Anyway that cleared the reflux right up almost immediately. I think it came back once or twice but more ClO2 treatments had the same effect, and then I was fine for years. Best guess was that a persistent bacterial infection of my esophageal sphincter was causing it to spasm and allowing the acid reflux. ClO2 would theoretically deal with that, and getting it through my skin and muscle seemed to work very well.

(Interesting note: our big weird black cat came and drank about half a cup right out of the tub. Still steaming hot. Never done anything like that before or since. He seemed a lot healthier afterwards, too.)

But the tale is not done! After years of relatively fine health, one of the late COVID variants blasted through our community and left me with long symptoms that brought the GERD/Asthma attacks back. I guess the sphincter had been damaged by the original infection (or whatever) and systemic inflammation caused a relapse.

More flaky web research suggested I try nicotine replacement therapy to dislodge the COVID, and that worked a treat! (Full disclosure: I am too cheap for gum, so I carefully chewed and smoked some of our local home grown tobacco.)

The upshot is that my symptoms dropped off immediately, and after experimenting with dosage they remain drastically reduced after several weeks, although I still have to watch what I eat (i.e., nightshades often trigger mild asthma)

The causes of acid reflux are many so relief is often very specific to the cause.

One of the most common treatments is an antacid. However, GERD and LPR (laryngopharyngeal reflux) occurs about 50% of the time in people with NOT ENOUGH acid in their stomachs. Without the proper test for acid levels, antacids, while they may make you feel better, may also cause improper digestion and even further reduced acid in the stomach over time impairing normal digestion greatly.

GERD and LPR are not the same. Acid reflux has to be diagnosed correctly to be successfully treated as in LPR, acids move so far up the esophagus, it leaves pepsin behind which eats away at the esophageal walls as they have no specialized cell lining that can handle those acids. In this case, common treatments such as "alkalizing the stomach" by taking lemon juice or vinegar can actually cause irreparable harm to the esophagus as the acid may well alkalize the stomach, but it also activates the dormant pepsin in a part of the body that has no protection from a constant and increased presence of acid. Instead of alkalizing the stomach, alkalize the esophagus by 1) drinking small sips and gargling with a bit of bicarb in water and letting it trickle down the esophagus and 2) using Gaviscon with sodium alginate after meals (or making the homemade version as the US brand does not contain sodium alginate) to prevent acids from rising into the esophagus, can both be very helpful, 3) avoiding acid foods and drink.

Having an endoscopy to determine the scope of damage is helpful, but make sure to also have a manometry to measure the pressure of the esophageal sphincter and have a swallow test done that looks much lower at the juncture of the esophagus and the stomach to watch the peristalsis of the esophagus. Often GERD and LPR are accompanied by low pressure which allows the food to rise back into the esophagus more easily and/or little to no movement in the esophagus which leaves food inside the esophagus after swallowing as it is never pushed into the stomach causing damage and discomfort.

Sinus and allergies can cause GERD and LPR, so constant post-nasal drip irritating the esophagus and esophageal sphincter can be held by using an antihistamine and nasal spray decongestant, natural or pharmaceutical.

In the end, a diagnosis is only as good as knowing the cause of the diagnosis. Being told you have GERD is not enough. You have to know if it's GERD or LPR. You have to know the cause (sinus, smoking, types of foods, low sphincter pressure, etc.) if you want to make any success of treatments and actually stop the GERD or LPR from progressing rather than just being masked by temporary relief from antacids.

In homeopathy, we use these medicines to treat Acid Reflux:

Iris ver 200 + Lycopodium 200 twice a day until very much better.

If needed, one may add in Nat phos 3x before meals.

S Windlass wrote:In homeopathy, we use these medicines to treat Acid Reflux:

Iris ver 200 + Lycopodium 200 twice a day until very much better.

If needed, one may add in Nat phos 3x before meals.

What kind of reflux? Low acid? High acid? GERD? LPR? Does it help increase sphincter pressure or prevent food and acid from rising back up? How does it work?

Stopping (well, maybe just drastically decreasing …) caffeine helped my GERD tremendously.


Also, more anecdotal, but I think since I started making and eating a lot of yogurt my GERD has been much better too…. Hard to say. Might be just less stress in my life too. But getting rid of coffee / caffeine definitely helped a ton

One thing that springs to mind is that sometimes I used to eat a small spoonful of miso when my stomach got sour, but it didn't seem like a treatment or cure -- more like eating an antacid tablet, just a temporary relief.

For me it was caused my stress, shift work, and most importantly, diet. I have been able to change aspects of my life to reduce stress and not have to do shift work. Diet is one of those that I go back and forth on. I know that coffee, tomatoes, citrus, chocolate, and spicy food will possibly give me heartburn; however, I enjoy all those things.  So I will often enjoy them knowing that I might pay for it later. Junk food and many processed foods will affect me as well, but I try to minimize those as much as possible.

A cup of peppermint tea often helps mitigate my symptoms.

I found that the medication my doctor prescribed was much more than I needed. At first I found that I could shift my dosage from daily to just once every two or three days. I don't have my prescription anymore, but I have a stockpile of meds, so if my symptoms really flare up I will just take one dose and be fine. I'm working on finding more non-medication solutions like the peppermint tea/water so that when I eventually run out I won't need the medications anymore.

I have recently started making sauerkraut. I'm curious if it'll help kind of like the miso does.

When my stress levels rise or my sleep schedule is disrupted (e.g., screaming children in the middle of the night), I find that my symptoms really flare up. If I then relax with some chocolate, well...

PPIs  (Prilosec, Protonix...) have been shown to cause gastric cancer, as well as gut dysbiosis.

As someone who researched this and tried different things I got you. Many things can be helpful but here's the 2 big game changers for me. 18 hour intermittent fasting 2 days a week, you can do your own research on how the body reacts to fasting during different stages but you have to fast for long enough for the gut reset part to do its thing which is why I say 18 hours. The other one is the herb Anise or sometimes called Anise-seed, it's excellent for gut health and makes a noticeable difference.

I suffered from GERD/Acid Reflux for a great many years before I even realized that was what it was. I was given similar medicines by a Western Doctor. Later, I went to an ND who was also an herbalist. That was the best decision I ever made.

I completely agree with the people saying that most of the people with heartburn is caused by too little acid. You need to confirm this, in order to treat it properly. In my case, I had too little acid, which caused my food to digest more slowly and less completely, which meant my stomach would get too full too often and squeeze the acid up into my esophagus. This also caused all sort of other deficiencies because I was not digesting food properly. Those deficiencies caused all sorts of other things. So... while heartburn may seem like a small thing at first, it can lead to bigger problems.

Once I confirmed with the ND, that it was too little acid, he had me try Apple Cider Vinegar with any large or heavy meals. Take 2tbsp in about 8oz of water. Boy did that take me a while to get used to, but I eventually got to where I liked it, and still add some ACV to my water on a regular basis. He also started me on a mix he made himself, (a large part was slippery elm). Oh boy was that nasty tasting. We tried a couple different mixes, but eventually he found a commercial natural mix that I could stomach. I will put a link to that mix below. The goal was to calm the stomach immediately, but it also helped create a barrier in the esophagus while it was healing. He gave the example if you pour vinegar on your hand, it doesn't hurt. If you have a cut and pour vinegar over it, it will hurt like the dickens. If acid in your esophagus is hurting you, then there is damage. This mix helped to heal and protect and take away the pain. He also mentioned that you have to keep taking it after the pain is gone, because it still needs time to heal.

Innate's GI Response

To the people talking about how too little acid in the stomach can cause reflux: in our cases, eating acidic foods -- tomato, pickles, shrub, pop, beer, makes it obviously worse. And the PPIs we're taking make things obviously better. Is that enough to dismiss the too-little acid option as applying to us?

I would not assume anything. I was on a PPI for 8 months. It would help the symptom of pain in my throat, but it was not lasting. I had the same problem that pepperoni, and things with cayenne pepper in them, caused really bad heartburn symptoms. I was getting symptoms 3 or 4 times a week. Nowadays it might be 3 or 4 months between any sort of symptoms... and when I do get it now, it's generally when I have been overeating at a party or something.

The natural path was not fast... it took probably a year to where I would consider myself better. But I think it was more permanent.

I doubt its very accurate, but some people say you can drink baking soda and water (I don't recall the amounts) and see how long it takes to burp. The theory is that the baking soda will react with your stomach acid and cause gas. If this happens too fast you have too much acid. If it happens too slow you have too little. My ND mentioned a scientific test for stomach acid, but it was expensive. So I opted to begin treatment as if I had too little acid, and see what happened. And it helped.

Christopher Weeks wrote:To the people talking about how too little acid in the stomach can cause reflux: in our cases, eating acidic foods -- tomato, pickles, shrub, pop, beer, makes it obviously worse. And the PPIs we're taking make things obviously better. Is that enough to dismiss the too-little acid option as applying to us?

The reason those foods irritate you may have nothing to do with their acidity, and all to do with their other constituents. Tomatoes have lectins, pop is sugary and bad for you, and so on.
According to this article, these foods are triggers, not causes
https://nutritionbyerin.com/acid-reflux-relief-mythbusters-do-acidic-foods-cause-acid-reflux/

And some info on hypochlorhydria.
https://www.optimaldx.com/research-blog/hypochlorhydria-signs-symptoms-and-consequences

Someone PMed me related to a post in another thread with a link to this video. I thought I'd come back and hang it here for anyone who might benefit from it:



(For me personally, this man's misuse of "proof", "prove", and "know" when interpreting the results of a single small study make me extremely skeptical of his level of scientific literacy, but that also doesn't mean he's wrong, just that I'd take his own advice with a grain of salt.)

Good time for an update. Last December, my doc said I should try to titrate off the Prilosec and onto the weaker Zantac/Pepsid -- apparently they're less likely to spawn off negative consequences. So I followed her protocol but hurt my back while in the middle of it badly enough that I went to urgent care and went on muscle relaxers, steroids, and Advil. Those drugs kill my tummy so it booched up the whole thing and I failed back onto my daily Prilosec to try and survive the back meds. But there were so many conflicting variables that I couldn't be sure what was causing what. So last July, I just stopped taking it. Two months into that, I hurt my back again (for the fourth time in twelve months...it's been rough!), went on the same drugs, and thought they were boring a hole through my esophagus. After the Prednisone was done, I stopped taking everything and am just trying PT and chiro to get it done and back to normal. Anyway, it's been 2.5 months without any reflux drugs!

This thread was helpful! I've been thinking a great deal about what I'm feeling and I think there are two things going on. One is that my stomach fills up and is emptying too slowly. I know there are drugs and disease both that cause that but none of them fit. Maybe I'm just on that end of the normal spectrum. So obviously, if your stomach is full, anything else has to go somewhere, and up the esophagus is where it goes for me. Other times, I have reflux from my stomach being too empty. (And actually, another thread here on intermittent fasting caused me to try that it's what started off this whole years-long cascade of problems. So anyway, I eat 2-5 Tums each week to control the not-full stomach reflux, and I drink water with ACV (thanks, Matt!) when it feels like the crap in my stomach is backing up into the esophagus. This is working pretty well for me.

I'll discuss the situation again with my doc in December.

Christopher Weeks wrote:... So anyway, I eat 2-5 Tums each week to control the not-full stomach reflux, and I drink water with ACV (thanks, Matt!) when it feels like the crap in my stomach is backing up into the esophagus. This is working pretty well for me.

I'll discuss the situation again with my doc in December.

So glad to hear that you are doing better over all. I'm glad you found something that is working instead of the PPI. One caution I will mention about tums (and rolaids and similar) is that there is quite a bit of calcium in them. Too much calcium can cause problems digesting iron properly. My wife was eating tums like candy, and ended up anemic. The Doc thinks it was caused by her excessive used of tums. She was taking far more than you are talking about. Just something to keep in the back of your head.

Dear hubbyt had a prescription for famotidine which had problems getting during Covid so he now takes OTC famotidine.  Have you tried this one?

Anne Miller wrote:Dear hubbyt had a prescription for famotidine which had problems getting during Covid so he now takes OTC famotidine.  Have you tried this one?

Famotidine is the active ingredient in Pepsid and modern Zantac. I took that for a couple years before graduating to Prilosec. For now, I’m happier on almost nothing but we’ll see how things progress. I’m not opposed to industrial medicine but I have a “take as much as you need and as little as possible” mindset.

Christopher, I understand not wanting to take prescription meds.

Though, as the doctor explain to me, dear hubby needed that due to the prescription meds he was taking ... to protect his stomach.

Is it possible you are taking a prescription med that is upsetting your stomach, esaaphogus, etc.

Right now, I'm not taking anything -- just how I like it. :)

I am by no means a doctor so take what I say with a giant salt lick block.

I personally used to have slight acid reflux which went away completely when I went on the keto diet. I was not eating highly inflammatory seed oils, starches, gluten, sugar etc... I also was consuming a good amount of fermented foods which really helps your gut health.

I would give it a try if you already haven't. It's a pretty simple diet to stick to and it's really not all that limiting. Increasing fat consumption and reducing carb intake (preferably completely) is the most important aspect, but you can still eat a whole variety of foods. As long as you stick to the program, you are not limited to how much you consume per day.

I'm not sure how many of the benefits ascribed to a keto diet require actual entry and maintenance of ketogenesis, but it complicates things that I choose to eat a vegetarian diet. There are articles like this on vegetarian keto: https://www.eatingwell.com/article/291617/what-can-you-eat-on-a-vegetarian-keto-diet/ and looking through that, my diet resembles the one they're advocating except that I eat a lot of beans and 1-5 servings of brown rice per week.