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Restoring a historic watermill in the Italian Alps and putting it back into action. Help welcome!

 
pollinator
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Yes, I spoke with a hydro designer today and he explained his personal micro hydro system is somewhere around 70% efficient but that it takes a LOT of tweaking the system to get such performance numbers. It took years to get it up to that level of performance.
Id be happy with any hydro then I’d want to start tweaking it to get it better. Speaking of which I’m going to tilt my solar panels now.
Ciao
 
steward
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is the wall that the river flows over man-made? is it a dam? what's above it?
 
pollinator
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Location: Massachusetts, Zone:6/7, AHS:4, Rainfall:48in even Soil:SandyLoam pH6 Flat
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Can you tell me the length of the span?
A 4inch steel pipe can self-support a span of 27ft, and a 12inch one can do 44ft.
http://www.piping-designer.com/index.php/datasheets/piping-layout-information/1669-allowable-pipe-span
I wonder what the cost is?

I wonder what the permit process is like to get a approval for taking water from the stream, and then secondarily what the electrical permit is like to install solar/wind/hydro.

 
pollinator
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tel jetson wrote:is the wall that the river flows over man-made? is it a dam? what's above it?



The wall is man-made. Just a concrete wall. It’s no dam, just intended to reinforce the original natural rock wall where the water used to fall from. You can still see part of the natural rock face that they didn’t reinforce. Above the wall is just a relatively flat plain where the creek runs a bit wider over. The only photo I have of this so far is the one attached. Hard to see though with all the foliage!
772FEA68-6C6F-4637-87B0-FF860B5B7E71.jpeg
[Thumbnail for 772FEA68-6C6F-4637-87B0-FF860B5B7E71.jpeg]
 
S. Bard
pollinator
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S Bengi wrote:
Can you tell me the length of the span?
A 4inch steel pipe can self-support a span of 27ft, and a 12inch one can do 44ft.
http://www.piping-designer.com/index.php/datasheets/piping-layout-information/1669-allowable-pipe-span
I wonder what the cost is?

I wonder what the permit process is like to get a approval for taking water from the stream, and then secondarily what the electrical permit is like to install solar/wind/hydro.



I’m not exactly sure as I didn’t take those measurements but if I had to guess I’d think around 45 feet from the waterfall directly to the top part of the property. If we could however get permission to divert the water over the original aquaduct, then we’d only have to span about 10 to 16 feet. Using steel pipes that can self-support sounds like a good idea, and would greatly reduce the need for scaffolding. 👍
 
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complimenti    per la  tua   intenzione di ripristinare      oggetti della storia passata,

la mia   opinione  , conoscendo  un po l e  energie  alternative, ( per grande  passione )    . sicuramente     2 Kw     li riesci a ottenere

io vedrei dei settori dentellati da incastrare (  inox  , tagliati a laser  )  , da poter  avvitare   sulla circonferenza    della ruota  , in modo  da  poter usare una catena   tipo moto   , pure inox
questo servitebbe   da moltiplica   per  essere collegata  a sua volta   alla puleggia dentata   del generatore    
supponiamo   che     la tua ruota     faccia    30  giri a vuoto , il suo punto   ottimale di lavoro si trova  tra il 60  e 80%
accettiamo che  la usi     a 20 giri al minuto   e il generatore     sia   un 600 giri    , quindi serve una moltiplicazione      1:30


corona dentata ruota  da 200 cm diametro    e   pignone  generatore   da 7 cm    diametro

ben felice  se posso esserti di aiuto   e   vediamo   se   c e  un parere    di altri lettori ,  in merito   al  tuo progetto

mi trovi  in diversi   post     se   cerchi  in mio nik

buona  fortuna

udos46


 
S. Bard
pollinator
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-- English translation below --

Ciao Bruno, grazie mille per la tua risposta! Tradurrò la mia risposta anche in inglese per gli altri lettori che non capiscono l'italiano.

Dove vivi in italia? Sei il primo italiano con cui posso parlare di energia idroelettrica e sono molto curioso di sapere se hai qualche esperienza con la creazione di energia idroelettrica. Attualmente sto cercando di esaminare quali permessi sarebbero necessari per poter deviare una parte di un fiume che scorre sulla nostra terra verso la nostra ruota in modo che possiamo usarla per produrre energia. Ne sai qualcosa? Sono un nuovo residente in Italia e non so quali autori devo contattare per farlo.

Inoltre: di che tipo di generatore stai parlando. Conosci luoghi in Italia dove si potrebbe comprare un tale generatore?
Grazie mille intanto!

----------

English:

Hi Bruno, thanks so much for your reply! I will translate my reply in English as well for the other readers who don't understand Italian.

Where in Italy do you live? You are the first Italian I can speak with about hydropower, and I am very curious to hear if you have any experience with creating hydropower yourself. I am currently trying to look into what permits one would need to be able to divert a part of a river running on our land to our wheel so we  can use it to produce energy. Do you know anything about this? I'm a new resident in Italy and I don't know which authoroties I need to contact to get this done.

Also: what kind of generator are you talking about. Do you know places in Italy where one could buy such a generator?
Thanks so much!

 
bruno motta
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Hello
I write you this email for info:
I am a retiree who has done so much for solar and water generators
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w16StyKLkvA&t=197s you can see a video of a brushless generator complete with elc for three-phase 230 volt 2.5 Kw at 600 rpm

if you are interested i am in switzerland (lugano)



ahttps://www.energeticambiente.it/idroelettrico/14776724-valutazione-impianto-mini-idro.html#post119953473


Design calculations for no-head, low-head waterwheels - Backwoods Home Magazine


best regards  

udos46
 
S. Bard
pollinator
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Hi Bruno,

I would be interested in your help. I don’t have much technical knowledge myself (although I’m trying to learn as much as I can).
Do you install these hydro-installations yourself as well, or do you mainly help with the planning/ calculating?
Do you ever visit the Belluno regio in Italy? It would be great to get your advice on planning our site.
Also: do you know good places to buy generators/ turbines in Europe/ Italy?

Thanks so much!
 
Jeremy Baker
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How’s it progressing? Have you gleaned any more information from the locals about doing micro hydro? Is there another micro hydro system nearby you can visit?
 
S. Bard
pollinator
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Hi Jeremy,

We are currently playing the waiting game while our contractor is getting in touch with someone he knows who could be of help. Also discussing the possibilities of the waterwheel to do some small scale hydropower with Bruno. He might also know someone from the region who can help, so I hope to be able to get in touch with that person soon.

I’m sorry if this all doesn’t sound terribly exciting right now. We’ve been swamped with work and the project for the house, so the hydropower research is sizzling a bit on the slow burner right now.
 
pollinator
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Just dropping my own comment here so I don't lose track of the thread.

I have absolutely nothing to offer on the subject; but I have much appreciation for your photos.
 
S. Bard
pollinator
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Ruth Meyers wrote:Just dropping my own comment here so I don't lose track of the thread.

I have absolutely nothing to offer on the subject; but I have much appreciation for your photos.



Haha, no worries, I’m glad you enjoy the photos!
 
S. Bard
pollinator
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bruno motta wrote:un breve video    per    tenere su il morale
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lH3al5cQ4OY&feature=em-uploademail



Thank you Bruno! What lovely photos.
Unfortunately I haven’t been able to take the measurements of the diameter of the wheel to give them to you. Because of the coronavirus lockdown in Italy I am no longer allowed to visit the property until at least the 3of April, but more likely it will be the 30th of April
 
gardener
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Oh My Yes!  Those were great  pictures!   Thank You Bruno!
S ; I'm glad you found a local expert , who may be able to help you develop your water wheel.
Stay safe for the next few months and when your able to work on your home again, please keep us informed.
 
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