Search...
Home Subscribe
Pie
Home Subscribe
Recent topics Flagged topics Hot topics Best topics
Search...
Search within berries Search permies
Advanced search Google search
Register / Login
rocket mass heater dvd
  • Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic
permaculture forums growies critters building homesteading energy monies kitchen purity ungarbage community wilderness fiber arts art permaculture artisans regional education skip experiences global resources cider press projects digital market permies.com pie forums private forums all forums
bootcamp permaculture chockens Sepp Holzer Desert or Paradise Documentary Free heat movie PDC ATC vids
this forum made possible by our volunteer staff, including ...
master stewards:
  • Carla Burke
  • Nancy Reading
  • John F Dean
  • r ransom
  • paul wheaton
  • Jay Angler
  • Timothy Norton
stewards:
  • Pearl Sutton
  • Tereza Okava
  • Nicole Alderman
master gardeners:
  • Christopher Weeks
gardeners:
  • M Ljin
  • Megan Palmer
  • Pete Podurgiel

What do blackberries tell us?

 
R Scott
pollinator
Posts: 4307
Location: Tennessee 7b
372
posted 11 years ago
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Everybody knows dandelions mean compaction, and legumes mean nitrogen deficiency. But what do blackberry brambles mean? They don't seem the progress out. Is there a simple way to disfavor them? Changing pH or adding a mineral to favor something else. They will overtake pastures here and few animals will venture in.

"You must be the change you want to see in the world." "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." --Mahatma Gandhi
"Preach the Gospel always, and if necessary, use words." --Francis of Assisi.
"Family farms work when the whole family works the farm." -- Adam Klaus

 
Meryt Helmer
Posts: 395
Location: west marin, bay area california. sandy loam, well drained, acidic soil and lots of shade
23
2
posted 11 years ago
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I know they like acidic soil but I don't know of making the soil more neutral or alkaline will make them that unhappy. very good question. I have wild blackberry brambles all over the place.
 
Rhys Firth
Posts: 120
6
posted 11 years ago
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Blackberries tell you it is time to make jam.

Either that or it is time to bring in a few goats.


In my experience, even liming heavily doesn't discourage them once established and flourishing, but it does minimize the establishment of new bushes.
 
Meryt Helmer
Posts: 395
Location: west marin, bay area california. sandy loam, well drained, acidic soil and lots of shade
23
2
posted 11 years ago
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
mine are native and in the forest they just wander along the forest floor but almost never go up high enough to make fruit. they are the one reason I need gloves. once I plant an area with my own stuff the blackberries are no longer an issue in that part of my garden.
 
Burra Maluca
out to pasture
Posts: 13429
Location: Portugal
4654
I like...
goat dog duck forest garden books wofati bee solar rocket stoves greening the desert
posted 11 years ago
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
They tell you that the land is trying to convert to forest, and that you aren't feeding the pigs there.

Plus they are telling you 'Please don't get the pigs to dig us out. Here - have some of the most amazing berries you ever tasted!'

You need plenty of volunteers to pick them for you though...

How permies.com works
What is a Mother Tree ?

 
R Scott
pollinator
Posts: 4307
Location: Tennessee 7b
372
posted 11 years ago
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Goats nip the buds and berries and somewhat slow the spread, but they don't control the brambles. Pigs don't help, either, unless you lock them in and make them really unhappy. Having pigs has too many other downsides here, not doing that again even if it means I have to do the pig's work.

"You must be the change you want to see in the world." "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." --Mahatma Gandhi
"Preach the Gospel always, and if necessary, use words." --Francis of Assisi.
"Family farms work when the whole family works the farm." -- Adam Klaus

 
Michael Cox
pollinator
Posts: 3949
Location: Kent, UK - Zone 8
754
I like...
books composting toilet bee rocket stoves wood heat homestead
posted 11 years ago
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
You can increase the yield of berries and do a reasonable job of controlling their growth by passing through a couple of times per season with a pair of secateurs and gloves.

The long rapidly growing tendrils will bear fruit on their tips in the following year. If you top these back to about 2ft long before they grow too large then the fruit will be at a nice manageable height and the overall patch won't grow to wild. If you don't top them then those tendrils will eventually touch the ground and root (spreading the patch by 6ft or more per year!) which stops them fruiting on that tip.

Moderator, Treatment Free Beekeepers group on Facebook.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/treatmentfreebeekeepers/

 
Patrick Mann
Posts: 310
Location: Seattle, WA, USA
7
posted 11 years ago
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

spreading the patch by 6ft or more per year!


Ha ha ha ... here in Seattle the Himalayan blackberries grow up to 30 ft in a season. We do enjoy a bounty of berries though.

http://thirteenvegetables.wordpress.com

 
R Scott
pollinator
Posts: 4307
Location: Tennessee 7b
372
posted 11 years ago
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
And when you can start measuring the patches in acres, you have a problem bigger than hand pruning.

"You must be the change you want to see in the world." "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." --Mahatma Gandhi
"Preach the Gospel always, and if necessary, use words." --Francis of Assisi.
"Family farms work when the whole family works the farm." -- Adam Klaus

 
Dale Hodgins
Posts: 9002
Location: Victoria British Columbia-Canada
711
posted 11 years ago
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
These things can be difficult to quantify, if you have to remove plants that become invasive.

In Victoria, I advertise mowing of an acre of Himalaya black berries on difficult terrain, for $1500. Total eradication of English Ivy will cost you $50,000 for an acre that is completely engulfed.
 
Michael Cox
pollinator
Posts: 3949
Location: Kent, UK - Zone 8
754
I like...
books composting toilet bee rocket stoves wood heat homestead
posted 11 years ago
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Wow Dale - how does one even go about eradicating ivy? I've never tried to kill it with any determination, but it seems pretty tough. Start with goats to reduce the mass?

Moderator, Treatment Free Beekeepers group on Facebook.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/treatmentfreebeekeepers/

 
Joan Fassler
Posts: 17
posted 11 years ago
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Blackberries tell you the soil is very acid, moist but, well drained. Not compacted. Moss usually accompanies the black berries in shadier areas.
 
R Scott
pollinator
Posts: 4307
Location: Tennessee 7b
372
posted 11 years ago
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Joan Fassler wrote:Blackberries tell you the soil is very acid, moist but, well drained. Not compacted. Moss usually accompanies the black berries in shadier areas.



Thank you.

"You must be the change you want to see in the world." "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." --Mahatma Gandhi
"Preach the Gospel always, and if necessary, use words." --Francis of Assisi.
"Family farms work when the whole family works the farm." -- Adam Klaus

 
Dale Hodgins
Posts: 9002
Location: Victoria British Columbia-Canada
711
posted 11 years ago
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Eradication of English Ivy in an urban environment usually doesn't include grazing animals.

I cut it and gather everything up to the thickness of a pencil. A potato fork or cultivator is dragged through the soil from every angle. Roots are gathered. Wait a month, do it again.
Wait a month, do it again.
Wait a month, do it again.
Wait a month, do it again. ...

Don't plant ivy.

 
Pia Jensen
Posts: 218
4
posted 11 years ago
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
blackberries love regular water sources

they can be great for cutting out (tunneling) interior protective spaces for critters and secret garden plants (Rick Austin) that tolerate similar conditions and lots of water and filtered/low light conditions (like in shade bordering sandy banks near rivers)
 
Dawn Hoff
pollinator
Posts: 533
Location: Andalucía, Spain
81
I like...
trees rabbit books chicken bee greening the desert
posted 11 years ago
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Here in southern Spain they always live near a Spring, along with oleander. So if I see them growing I know there is water. I like them a lot better than Oleander. How about planting trees to shade them out?

soloenespana.wordpress.com

 
Eric Hammond
Posts: 401
Location: SW Missouri
88
I like...
hugelkultur duck trees chicken pig bee solar wood heat
posted 11 years ago
  • Likes 3
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
    Send
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Here is Missouri,blackberries and other thorny plants are an edge species. They try to close off light so that forest can emerge and spread. You hardly find them in thick woods unless the light is breaking the canopy. Eliminate or reduce edge to control them. I've often wondered if planting a thornless variety would fill the niche of the thorny plants and cause them not to germinate...?
 
permaculture is giving a gift to your future self. After reading this tiny ad:
Rocket mass heaters in greenhouses can be tricky - these plans make them easy: Wet Tolerant Rocket Mass Heater in a Greenhouse Plans
reply
reply
    Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic
Boost this thread!
Similar Threads
More...