• Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
permaculture forums growies critters building homesteading energy monies kitchen purity ungarbage community wilderness fiber arts art permaculture artisans regional education skip experiences global resources cider press projects digital market permies.com pie forums private forums all forums
this forum made possible by our volunteer staff, including ...
master stewards:
  • Carla Burke
  • Nancy Reading
  • John F Dean
  • paul wheaton
  • r ranson
  • Timothy Norton
  • Jay Angler
stewards:
  • Andrés Bernal
  • Pearl Sutton
  • Anne Miller
master gardeners:
  • Christopher Weeks
gardeners:
  • M Ljin
  • Jeremy VanGelder
  • thomas rubino

Have humans always needed to drink water in order to survive?

 
pollinator
Posts: 281
Location: Southern California, USA
113
homeschooling kids purity books cooking composting toilet
  • Likes 3
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
A Bible/health question I have had for a long time (possibly for creationists out there) do you think Adam and Eve needed to drink water in the garden of Eden or do you think their raw vegan diet options were so lush and filled with moisture that it wasn’t needed?

(Perhaps for non-creationists), do you think that water has been a necessity for humans to live since the beginning of their existence? How much water? What kind of water?

In addition to thinking about water…

Were humans carnivores or vegans since the beginning of their existence? How do these beliefs effect your permaculture philosophy and design? Have your beliefs changed over time?


I was raised vegetarian and have eaten vegan for a season… now I eat biblically kosher but I try to eat seasonal, local & organic when possible.

Religion, education, international living, budget, health challenges and allergies have all influenced my dietary decisions.

I have read lots of different books, including autobiographies, and interviewed many people about their health journeys (and permaculture journeys.)

Looking forward to hearing about yours,
Gifts-from-a-friend-s-organic-orchard-garden-.JPG
[Thumbnail for Gifts-from-a-friend-s-organic-orchard-garden-.JPG]
 
steward
Posts: 3514
Location: Maine, zone 5
2101
8
hugelkultur dog forest garden trees foraging food preservation cooking solar seed wood heat homestead
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Hi Alana.  I haven't ever lived on a raw fruititarian diet, but I've heard from multiple people that they don't need to drink water on that diet.
 
gardener
Posts: 1283
Location: Zone 5
623
ancestral skills forest garden foraging composting toilet fiber arts bike medical herbs seed writing ungarbage
  • Likes 5
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I do remember that Peace Pilgrim mentioned that on her travels through New England, she ate mostly wild berries and didn’t need to drink water.

Based on my own natural instincts, I find it unnatural to kill other animals and so I’m vegetarian. I see other people and they act like meat is a necessity. I don’t judge them and don’t mind people hunting because how could I judge them if I don’t judge coyotes, but it’s just against what my heart says in a very primal, visceral way. And so I’m guessing it is something that people have to learn and not our inherent divine nature. I also consider apples to be a kind of perfect food that in season is best eaten as the staple food. Many days in the fall I ate mostly apples, and then one time I ate only crabapples for a day. They are dense and nutritious in energy and water. I don’t think I drank water then but I don’t drink very much anyway. In my school days I would go the whole day without a drop of water, except some in the morning and then some herbal tea in the evening.
Edit: and paid with health issues and insomnia
 
pollinator
Posts: 410
Location: Western North Carolina - Zone 7B stoney
89
hugelkultur dog forest garden trees cooking bee wood heat homestead
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
No. It is written in The Bible that the mana provided everything to survive in the desert
 
M Ljin
gardener
Posts: 1283
Location: Zone 5
623
ancestral skills forest garden foraging composting toilet fiber arts bike medical herbs seed writing ungarbage
  • Likes 3
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
What about soup—is that a food or a drink? I think Adam and Eve would have eaten soup, probably.

I am not sure about not drinking or using water at this point in the year. I went on a walk the other day and ate lots of berries but still felt quite thirsty. But if I were to eat soup all the time I don’t think it would be necessary to drink water, separately from eating. Or does one drink the broth, and then eat the soup? It’s an odd thing to ponder.
 
steward & author
Posts: 43548
Location: Left Coast Canada
16533
9
art trees books chicken cooking fiber arts
  • Likes 4
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
the whole 8 cups of water started in the late 1800s, early 1910s with a few studies of what an active soldier needs to survive when working in desert conditions.  8 cups (smaller than what we use for a 1-cup measure, which is considerably smaller than the "glass" measurement we use to measure water today) was the minimum.  This can be obtained through food as well as through drinking.

Active working soldier.  That's a good 12 hours a day of doing physical stuff, outside, in exposed conditions, in that day and age.  

It wasn't until about 100 years later that people started studying this again with mixed results.  The focus was no longer on surviving in extreme conditions but "healthy".  The measurement of "healthy" determines the conclusion of the study.  

Generally, a traditional diet, with minimal salt, and all other nutrition balanced, no processed foods, very little water is needed even if moderately active.  A modern diet, yep, at least two liters of water seems to be required to prevent dehydration for a sedentary lifestyle.  

To put it another way

Most of human history, drinking water was a good way to die before reaching breeding age.  Most of human history we would drink "dehydrating" drinks like wine, beer, sake, broth, etc.  Fermented or salted liquids and get the rest of our moisture through the food we ate.  It didn't kill off the species (not as fast as "fresh" water did in some places).  So the modern "8 glasses a day" really goes well with "modern diet and lifestyle" and isn't a universal truth.  
 
M Ljin
gardener
Posts: 1283
Location: Zone 5
623
ancestral skills forest garden foraging composting toilet fiber arts bike medical herbs seed writing ungarbage
  • Likes 4
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Boiling is also one of the most practical ways of preparing food. If you drink the broth/water too—a soup—then you don’t need to treat other water separately or worry about it being unsanitary (as long as it is relatively clean already).
 
These aren't just sunglasses. They are a coolness prosthetic. For this tiny ad:
Learn Permaculture through a little hard work
https://wheaton-labs.com/bootcamp
    Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic