Fire retardants used on local forest fire - safe to eat wild food and garden vegi's?

Hi,

We just had a big forest fire and they used lots and lots of fire retardants - the red stuff dropped from planes. We are just planting our gardens now.  Should we plant our gardens or will the vegi's be toxic?  What about foraging for wild mushrooms in the burn area? Is it safe to eat?  Some gardens were doused with it but others are just near by.  Does it travel in the smoke and ash? Anybody know?  Thanks very much, Maria in New Brunswick Canada

My initial reaction was, no don't eat it.

But I think the safest, best thing to do is ask the County Ag. Agent, and the fire dept. what they sprayed.
Another thing you can do that might give an indication as to what it is, is to collect some of it and see what it does in a glass of water. Does it disperse or separate. And smell it. Does it smell chemically or like a petroleum product?
I suppose I would be surprised if the Environmental Protection Agency would allow use of something toxic. But then again, they are government. ~~~And not in a good way.

My last reaction is, "They ain't spraying water. So whatever (chemical) they are using can't be all that good."

Hopefully it's as innocuous as it sounds here.

Jim Fry wrote:But I think the safest, best thing to do is ask the County Ag. Agent, and the fire dept. what they sprayed.

I agree -- ask! Be patient. You may get bounced around before you get the right department. But I'm sure they'll tell you what retardant they dropped, and advise about any health cautions.

Howdy,

"As for the color, that comes from iron oxide (aka rust) and is added to make it clear to firefighters which areas have been treated. Sometimes the mixture includes fertilizer to help spur plant growth as well. The “red stuff” is a fire retardant rather than extinguisher and is designed to slow the progress of the fire so that firefighters on the ground have time to reach the area. The red does stain any houses in its path, but it washes off."

Here in Oregon, this is what I was told in wildland firefighting classes.  

When working on urban interface boundaries, rural homes/forest land, lots of people wanted to know about this.

Might be safer than what my neighbor is spraying on his "garden.

Randal is correct. That stuff is fertilizer so it is not too bad a risk.

While it may not be a better than organic fertilizer.

Here are some articles that explains what it is:

https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2020-10-01/phos-chek-red-fire-retardant-dropped-from-planes

https://rdrtechnologies.com/blog/fire-retardant-dropped-planes

Here is what I have found out so far.  It is ammonia based fertilizer mixed with water and some proprietary chemicals that make it sticky. It is recommended that you not eat any fruits or vegetables that have been sprayed.  I also read that it concentrates nitrites in the soil and that you shouldn't eat any brassica plants as they accumulate these nitrites.  But I don't know how long this is a problem for.  Can't find any info on eating mushrooms from burned forests that were sprayed.  Anyone know something more?  Thanks

Maria Recchia wrote:Here is what I have found out so far.   and some proprietary chemicals that make it sticky. It is recommended that you not eat any fruits or vegetables that have been sprayed.  I also read that it concentrates nitrites in the soil and that you shouldn't eat any brassica plants as they accumulate these nitrites.  But I don't know how long this is a problem for.  Can't find any info on eating mushrooms from burned forests that were sprayed.  Anyone know something more?  Thanks

Very good,  you see the previous ... now you see from yourself, very good

Try searching for a product name, take that name and search it. Try to look for manufacturer, go there, if they are searchable and look specifically for that product, it should have a MSDS sheet.

That's where you witl find the "other chemicals "the red stuff contains... now AND  they take that product and mix it with "the other chemicals" read about it from different sites etc.

the other chemicals is completely different from the red stuff label or msds

Start asking the search engine you use questions. search like "sticky agent used with fire retardant"  OR "Arial fire retardant materials" OR "Chemicals used in Sticky agent with fire retardant" OR " What makes fire retardants sticky"

When companies etc. don't want to disclose ingredients they are using they label it "proprietary", maybe some innocent reasons maybe not.

The fire retardant itself will have an MSDS if and when you find a manufacturer, look the information about it the process etc. You may find something that says , commonly used with or i conjunction with for fire suppressants retardants etc

Keep in mind that companies governments protect themselves from liability in many ways. NDA's are one of them, obscuring substances as proprietary is another. Telling people they are sending out in it "oh it's ok" is another. Don't believe any news paper or news article or person. And don't let any flac from above or below deter you from your search. Rely on you.
Realize that what you have already discovered is called "disclosure".... Literally telling you and provides somewhat liability protection for that company etc.

I wish you well and I would seriously consider not eating anything until you know exactly what you are dealing with and the damage if any it could possibly cause.

Howdy,


https://www.oregonlive.com/news/2023/07/california-debates-wildfire-retardant-as-fire-season-begins.html

Howdy,


https://www.kdrv.com/news/waterwatch/oregon-ramps-up-pfas-testing-in-a-regulatory-vacuum/article_c849e9a2-3ecb-5650-bb83-6b04d624b39c.html

I once met a guy in the woods who said his crop (the kind of crop you grow secretly in the woods) got borate bombed. (This story is from the 90's and that's what we called the tankers when I was a kid). He was asking me and my buddy if we thought he could wash it off and sell it hahaha. We told him not to be an asshole but who knows?

As far as eating it,  I would avoid it but I would also eat it if I was hungry. And I washed it. No way it's worse than what comes on industrial ag's fruit and veggies! Nothing Dawn(tm) can't do!

I think it depends on your local, but a more commonly used product name is Phos-Check. It is made in California. I have not read up on the SDS but it is more earth 'friendly' than older style systems.