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Hobbit Home Progress.

 
Jay Angler
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Dave Lotte wrote:
Todays poll is concerning the sanding and verethaning of the wooden beams and decking INSIDE the home.
Leave them O'naturàæl  or sand em all down and seal em ?

I don' do F...B...k, so I'll reply here.
I would no longer use varathane - too toxic to make and use. I would consider using boiled linseed oil if the decision is to seal them. I don't know enough about wood to know if sealing is the better option or not. For example, they don't seal the underside of wood in attics. My sister's attic was built in the late 1950's out of wood panels, so similar to what you have used, and there is no seal on them of any sort (ask me how I know.... I'm visiting for Christmas and the roof sprang a leak and they've come twice to try and fix it and I've had to crawl through the attic multiple times to empty the bucket...)

If you're doing it just for appearances, something that keeps the ceiling "light reflecting" has benefits.

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Dave Lotte
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For a proof of concept, not bad.
Another 5 hours in, and my mini round door test build is encouraging.
Now to do some welding.
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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Test results are in !

Been waiting for a 1 degree F. night, and it finally happened.  Dropped down to -18 C ( 1 degree F. ) last night.
The temperature inside the Hobbit Home dropped 1 degree Fahrenheit, down too 38.8
I have a small ceramic cube heater right in front of the back door, to prevent any frost in that area.
Lowest heat setting of 3 with the thermostat set as low as it will go, so it hardly comes on at all.
Went out at 10 AM. - kinda want to keep the house at 40 degrees Fahrenheit- so i turned the thermostat up to 50 %.
Still on the lowest setting, and by the time i left for work ? The house was back up too 40 degrees.
Nice !
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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Another -16 C night, and the main house dropped to 38.8 F ( 5 C. ) again, back room is holding at 41 degrees.
Turned the mini heater to setting # 2 with a fan in the door to circulate the warmth.
Another -20 night tonite, will see how it goes.
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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First attempt 10 inch thick, mini round door test build - failed.

Quick, build - not very pretty - to see if it would even open - added double shims too the bearings, and 3 on each side for stability.

Second attempt will include a door threshold for easier installation and alignment ( totally round is a pain in the a$$ to align) and larger steps between layers to increase door clearances.

Main goal right now ?  To get it to open.
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Jay Angler
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Lord of the Rings makes it look so easy! That hinge is going to be taking how much weight again?

Have you considered making a thinner round door that opens outward, and a sliding, well insulated door on the inside? It would solve some of the interference/clearance issues you're currently trying to overcome.

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Dave Lotte
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Jay Angler wrote: That hinge is going to be taking how much weight again?

Have you considered....



Not too worried about the weight, as the full sized hinge can be up to 3 feet wide with tons of bearings.

Thought about making a thinner R15 door - same as the one i built for the shed.
Going to keep tinkering and playing on this line of thought - only way to learn.

Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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Wow.
Did a search for standard R values for doors.
Pitifull.
Even if i scrap the R42 door idea, a thinner R15 door is still more than double the standard.

No wonder we have global warming - billions of homes heating the outside.
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Jay Angler
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Dave Lotte wrote:Even if i scrap the R42 door idea, a thinner R15 door is still more than double the standard.


Wall insulation:"Typical recommendations for exterior walls are R-13 to R-23", so your R42 door idea is almost double the best wall G---le suggested!  (blamed the US dept of energy for the recommendation - is that a conflict of interest?)

My sister lives in a 1950's house with clay bricks on the outside, a layer of concrete blocks (breeze blocks is one name - there are several similar critters), and a layer of plaster and lath. Zero insulation, and no easy way to add any. She over doubled the insulation in the attic when she moved in, and she added that silver bubble-wrap stuff to any basement walls she could easily access. It's R3, but it's the first R3, so it is better than R0 as the benefits from more insulation is a diminishing returns curve.

But you're aiming for a home that doesn't require outside inputs to maintain a livable temperature. You're taking a "build it once and it will last my lifetime" approach. Both of those do call for going above and beyond.

You also seem to like the challenge - challenges are good for the brain. However, thinking up good alternatives is a different sort of challenge, and you've got it there as back-up if the current one doesn't live up to expectations.

Thinking...thinking...thinking... from the crazy idea department, part of "insulation" is stopping air from moving. Could you replace some of the rigid foam insulation with something like a rubber inner-tube which inflates when the door is closed, but deflates when the door is swinging open? How often will this door open and close?

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Andy Ze
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I guess the door would need to be cone-shaped. Looks like you're on the path to figuring that out already! Maybe some compressible foam around the edges.
 
Pete Podurgiel
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Quite the engineering challange you have going on with that door hinge.

Looking at it from a mechanical-design perspective:  for a door that opens inward, I envision the hinge being mounted to a hinge-plate that would then be mounted to two horizontal rails, allowing the hinge/door assembly to slide in&out before allowing the hinge to pivot open. The hinge plate could even be outfitted with a "power-assist" perhaps in the form of a spring, something along the lines of those "soft-close" drawer sliders but MUCH beefier ...or perhaps an electro-mechanical actuator that would open the door automatically, though it would be advisible to integrate some kind of emergency override/backup in the event of failure.

A rail system woudl also allow you to recess the door somewhat making for a thinner door which will be easier to get past once swung open.

<insert munching-popcorn emoji here>
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Om is where the heart is.

 
Hans Quistorff
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Hans Quistorff wrote:Have you considered that a door that thick will need to pull strait out.  It will be almost impossible to get clearance to swing by hinges on one side. In the Hobbit door thread I pointed out that this problem is solved by having a pivot top and bottom in the center of the door and a bar above and below the door to the hinge pivot at the side. This allows for a central door knob to operate a latch on each side and push or pull the   door open.


I encourage you to try this on your modal and see how it works.

Hans Albert Quistorff, LMT projects on permies Hans Massage Qberry Farm magnet therapy gmail hquistorff

 
Dave Lotte
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Jay Angler wrote:

Dave Lotte wrote:Even if i scrap the R42 door idea, a thinner R15 door is still more than double the standard.



You also seem to like the challenge - challenges are good for the brain.



Thank you for all the suggestions everyone.  I will be trying the same type of door again, but instead of using 3/4 inch thick boards for the frame, i will be using 1.5 inch boards ( 2x4...)
Once i am sure that this idea will not work as intended, i will try other approaches.

Mainly for the reason that using this method, i can add double weather stripping for a good tight seal air.

Not done yet, still playin. 😁

Build it because they say you can't.
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Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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1/25/24

With the rise in water levels caused by the warm temps, melting snow and rain.
Thought i would go out and check on the house.

All week it has been a steady 70 % humidity @ 44 degress F. Inside the home.

For that 1 week of -20 cold temps, i had pulled back the plastic sheeting on the floor of the back porch - setting the electric heater on bare gravel - nothing within 4 feet - making it as safe as possible.
Today, Pulled the plug on the little cube heater, and covered the floor with plastic again, see if the humidity and temps change at all.

As for being "flooded out" ?  Both 60 gallon drums are dry - the one in the main house has the dehumidifier dripping in it.
4 feet below my house - no water ( bottom of barrels )
Cool !
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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Hopefully, the extra 3 inches won't be so noticable on an 84 inch door.
Time to do a little cutting.
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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Came home from work today, and after about 500 curf cuts, ready to start assembly on mini door test #2.
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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1st layer glued and clamped.  Now we wait.
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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Just posted a video on my Utube channel - " you can do it dave".
For some reason you have to use quotations to find it.

38 degrees in the house, and my dehumidifier iced up on me.
Not enough air flow - guess you shouldn't saw wood when its running beside you 😁😁.
Posted a video on how to blow the dust out of it.  Works good now.
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Jay Angler
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The combination of low temp and high humidity does that - even without clogging the poor thing up with sawdust! I used to have to run our old one on a heavy duty timer that ran it for a half hour, then let is sit for a while for the ice to melt.

Rule number one for blowing things out with air compressors - do it outside!

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Dave Lotte
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Sandbags have arrived....
Gotta take the picture quick before ....
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Build it because they say you can't.
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Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
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Second and third layer drying on the wedding cake door. 😁
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Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
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In an effort too share the good things about this house, i have installed a dual thermometer- for when it is 35 degrees outside, and 10 degrees inside.

See how it works.
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Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
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Kinda glad it snowed a bit ...
-5 out for 3 nights, and the Hobbit Home hit the lowest temp yet of 37.9 degrees - no snow on the roof.
Had to go out and turn up the ceramic heater to setting #2 - 50 % thermostat.
After it snowed, with 2 inches of snow on the roof, it is now a steady 40 degrees and holding.
R1 for each inch of light fluffy snow - so R 2 over a 1,500 square foot roof adds up.

Just waiting for the day i install the R44 roof insulation.  Then comes the R32 floor insulation.
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Build it because they say you can't.
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Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
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Have not posted in a while, as i do not like to heat up the Hobbit Home work shop, just too let the heat go up through the un-insulated roof.  Especially, on the -10 C days we have been having.  So i am waiting for spring.

This post is for those of you who like the numbers....

First two pictures are from my "KILL A WATT" meter.  If you want to find out what any of your 120 volt gadgets are using in power, get one of these meters.  For me, it is the cube heater in the Hobbit Home.

This meter has been plugged in for 202 hours ( 8.41 days) and in that time the heater has used 176 KWH of electricity.  5 days ago, it snowed and put 4 inches of snow on the roof - before that the little heater was slowly dropping temperature - it could not keep up. Almost had to turn it to the high (#3) setting.
Third picture, puts the heater ( yellow arrow) almost in the center of the room - heating the entire 1200 sqft main house - plus the back porch ( total of 1500 sqft ).  With 4 inches of snow on top - holding a steady 4.5 C even on the -10 degree nights.
Next two pictures shows the temps at the time i took the pictures, with the previous 3 or 4 days having overnight temps between -5 and  -10 C.
Little cube heater is set on #2 heat setting, built in thermostat set 50 % ..... so it uses 1011 watts an hour @ 8.65 Amps, when it runs full out, non-stop.

I will admit, heating the old house with the ground sourced heat pump, and the new house with the cube heater - first time EVER getting a 180 $ heating bill in a month.  But i am heating 2 houses....

Told ya.  This one is for the number lovers. 😁



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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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And so the fun begins....

Must be Canadian.  Maple tree sap pails fit the sand bags nicely.
Warmer weather is here, its a balmy 5 degrees C outside, time to go to work.
Only have 100 bags to fill now, going too have to order another 4 or 500.
Tested 1 pail,  then picked up 4 more.  Now i can fill 5 at a time.
Workin off the winter chocolates.
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Jay Angler
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I've forgotten - what exactly are you using the sand bags for?
Any pictures of them in place yet?
Assuming that eventually they will be covered with something?

Visit Redhawk's soil series: https://permies.com/wiki/redhawk-soil
How permies.com works: https://permies.com/wiki/34193/permies-works-links-threads

 
Dave Lotte
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Jay Angler wrote:I've forgotten - what exactly are you using the sand bags for?



Your memory is still good.
Have not posted this information yet, as it is still a work in progress.
The sand pile is in the way of the next step, so i am using it up by filling the bags.
More updates to come ! 😁

Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Jay Angler
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Location: Pacific Wet Coast
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Phew! I trust you plan on keeping them well covered, as UV will deteriorate them from what I've read and on one occasion seen for myself.

Visit Redhawk's soil series: https://permies.com/wiki/redhawk-soil
How permies.com works: https://permies.com/wiki/34193/permies-works-links-threads

 
Tk Gillman
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Just for fun, here is a YT video of Hobbiton in New Zealand: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M10HrcYjjuc
The hot water for the bath looks like a Rocket Mass Heater and it has a composting toilet.

There are 100,000 bacteria on every square centimeter of our skin and 100 trillion microbes of at least 400 types in our digestive system. We are ecosystems.

 
Dave Lotte
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Jay Angler wrote:Phew! I trust you plan on keeping them well covered, as UV will deteriorate them from what I've read and on one occasion seen for myself.



Yup.  Covered up and ready for when i need em....

After 3 hours of shovelin, the sand pile has been moved out of the way.
Bag by bag.
More to come.
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Very full sandbags with some waiting to be filled in maple sugar buckets
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Well-filled sandbags in a stack

Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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For the next phase of construction, i had to make some serious decisions.
Pay 500 $ a day - evey weekend all summer, or buy my own.

I have a new helper for my earth sheltered home, after changing all the fluids, time to rewire my net metered solar system that was cut off during the backfilling of the house.

Its small, but powerfull.  Will be posting videos on YouTube- "you can do it dave"
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Jay Angler
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Nice toy! I'd say, "nice wheels" but those seem in short supply! Tracks are great for some tasks, and your project looks like the type where that toy tool will get a good workout!

Seriously jealous. Our little tractor seems to *always* have the chipper shredder on the back, and there are some things I'd like to try doing with the little backhoe attachment, but I think Hubby doesn't trust me with it...  I won't learn if I don't use it enough to have carryover!

Visit Redhawk's soil series: https://permies.com/wiki/redhawk-soil
How permies.com works: https://permies.com/wiki/34193/permies-works-links-threads

 
Dave Lotte
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Jay Angler wrote:your project looks like the type where that toy tool will get a good workout!



Yup. Its one of those things where its one way or the other.

One way, you can rent these mini x machines, they do have them, but you have to book a month in advance ( popular machine), schedule everything, and hope everything goes right the first time.  Always keeping in mind you only have the machine for so many hours....

Then there is the option of get it and have it on site for good.

When i back filled my house, the only machine i could get was 8 feet wide - nice long reach and hydraulic thumb, but almost too wide to fit around the house.

This one will fit inside the house if i really wanted it too.

Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Jay Angler
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Location: Pacific Wet Coast
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Dave Lotte wrote:Then there is the option of get it and have it on site for good.

However, that adds responsibility also - these things can be a pain to keep greased. I could ask Hubby how many grease fittings there are on the back-hoe attachment of our tractor, but enough that he whines about it! (in all fairness, for some bizarre reason, they used a mix of standards, so he needs 2 different grease guns and I think that's also where he decided to replace 2 fittings with a type that sticks out and has a bend so that he didn't have to take several parts off just to fit the grease gun in there??? Engineers... sometimes I wonder... if they occasionally loose track that the trees have to coexist with the whole forest.)
We have a neighbour with a healthy collection of similar equipment, and he will happily tell you, "there's no such thing as too much grease. Grease is cheap, broken machines take time away from the job and time to fix!"

Visit Redhawk's soil series: https://permies.com/wiki/redhawk-soil
How permies.com works: https://permies.com/wiki/34193/permies-works-links-threads

 
Dave Lotte
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Jay Angler wrote: I think that's also where he decided to replace 2 fittings with a type that sticks out and has a bend so that he didn't have to take several parts off just to fit the grease gun in there???


Have too be carefull doing that though....
I was going to replace the flat round grease fittings on the front blade of this machine, until i realized that 1 good big rock would smash or shear it off.
The flat round ones will not get sheared off by a chunk of concrete --- or far less likely too. 😁

Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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Tk Gillman wrote:Just for fun, here is a YT video of Hobbiton..... and it has a composting toilet.



I would like to go composting, but by law, i have to be connected to the sewer.  So even if i bought the 1,000 $ toilet, i would still be paying the 40 $ a month for sewer.
Sucks, but i won't save any money.

Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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Here is a small side project that i am working on, that my followers may enjoy ....

L.O.T.R themed licence plates for the machinery.  3D printed, each section a different colour.

Background - white
Large letters - brown
Top - bottom - blue
Date of purchase - red
One ring - gold.

Printer filament is in, now to find the 12 hours to print them.
More to come.
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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Location: Ontario Canada
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Switched too a two colour layout.  Licence plates are done.

Weather is warming up.  More to come.
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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Location: Ontario Canada
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Still a bit cool to work outside, but i did  mange to get 22 tons of sand delivered.
400 sandbags ordered and on the way.
20240325_155719.jpg
22 tons of sand in a pile in front of a house with a tree and a fence next to it

Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
Dave Lotte
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Location: Ontario Canada
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Friday, 30 bags filled...
Saturday, 32 bags filled....
Used up the 100 bags on hand, now to wait for the 400 that are on order.

62 - 50 pound bags ( 3,100 pounds ) makes a small dent in 48,500 pounds ( 22 tons ) of sand - but it did make a dent !
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Build it because they say you can't.
18 different architect's that said " you can't do that "
Google " undergroundandlovinit "

 
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