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Wasp condo for cabbage moth control?

Pearl Sutton

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posted 3 years ago

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I have a pretty serious cabbage moth problem. Lost a bunch of plants last year to them. The mud dauber wasps are really into harvesting the caterpillars. I'm trying to figure out how to assist them.

Seems to me if they didn't have to fly so far back and forth to their nests, they could work more efficiently. I have no issues with them, I don't start fights with them, and they don't start with me.

So if I took a bunch of soup cans, screwed them to a board, and hung it in the garden, can openings down, would the mud daubers build nests in them? Would they want more of a roof? What do they want out of life that I can arrange? Besides all the bugs they can eat....

Anyone ever built a wasp condo? If I build it, will they come? Or snub it for some reason?

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Abe Coley

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posted 3 years ago

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That sounds like it might work. I would look around your place and try to find what sort of materials or surfaces they already are making nests on, and then make your wasp condo out of that.

Around here we have these wasps that eat grasshoppers, and they nest in hot dry places like up under the eaves of tin roofs on sheds. I bet your wasp condo idea would work for those!

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craig howard

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posted 3 years ago

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My brassicas were next to the grape trellis last year.
I found a paper wasp nest in a big metal funnel in my shed and moved over under the grapes
so they could protect the cabbage and broccoli.

My grapes were covered in wasps come fall.

I think an A frame roof type thing would work great to protect them
or a metal cone or bucket,..
just don't put it near the grapes, ha.

Heather Sharpe

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posted 3 years ago

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What a great idea, Pearl! In addition to a place to build their nests, it would probably help to make sure they have a good place to harvest mud nearby too. Not sure exactly what the best way to do that would be. I imagine it would involve digging around looking for a spot of suitable soil nearby and keeping it damp or maybe you could mix some mud and leave it there. I know the last time I dug a trench and there was rain, it was full of solitary bees and wasps collecting mud. So the first option would probably work fine, if there's suitable soil in the area.

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Pearl Sutton

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posted 3 years ago

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craig howard wrote:My brassicas were next to the grape trellis last year.
I found a paper wasp nest in a big metal funnel in my shed and moved over under the grapes
so they could protect the cabbage and broccoli.

Did it work? Did they keep the caterpillars down?

Pearl Sutton

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posted 3 years ago

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Heather Sharpe wrote:What a great idea, Pearl! In addition to a place to build their nests, it would probably help to make sure they have a good place to harvest mud nearby too. Not sure exactly what the best way to do that would be. I imagine it would involve digging around looking for a spot of suitable soil nearby and keeping it damp or maybe you could mix some mud and leave it there. I know the last time I dug a trench and there was rain, it was full of solitary bees and wasps collecting mud. So the first option would probably work fine, if there's suitable soil in the area.

Now that's a good thought! The soil around here tends to be lumpy clay or rocky, and I keep the bare dirt covered with mulch. I'll sift a batch and put it in a wet spot. The wet spots tend to be rocky, due to eroding off any fine soil. Good point!!
Provide construction material for the type of wasps I want to encourage!

Heather Sharpe

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I wonder if they have strong preferences about what direction(s) sun does or doesn't hit their nest from? If I recall when reading about setting up nests for solitary bees, it was preferable to orient them so they got sun from the East or South-East, but not the hotter South or West sun. Of course, this might not hold true for the wasps. Once, we had some kind of wasp that kept coming into our house and building a nest inside a plastic fife I had hung on the wall. I tried everything I could to dissuade them, but they were super determined and kept sneaking back in. The spot in the house they picked got no direct sun and was quite cool, but was close to a window with South sun, for whatever that is worth.

Mike Barkley

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posted 3 years ago

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Wonder if moving some existing mud dauber nests closer to the garden would encourage them to build more???

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Pearl Sutton

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posted 3 years ago

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Mike Barkley wrote:Wonder if moving some existing mud dauber nests closer to the garden would encourage them to build more???

I wondered the same thing, but they build new every year, they don't reuse the old ones.
And the old ones are attached firmly to where they are, can't be removed without breaking them, so I can't figure out the logistics of moving them and having them look real to a wasp. :D

Mk Neal

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posted 3 years ago

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Mud daubers absolutely love to nest in our window frames. We have very old wooden window frames, and they nest in there small gap btw frame & the outer window case. They like both north and south exposure.

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J. Juniper

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posted 3 years ago

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Plant something special for them such as Sweet Fennel, Queen Annes Lace, Yarrow or Spearmint. So exciting!

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Pearl Sutton

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posted 2 years ago

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I have a wasp condo! If it gets lots of residents, I can add more.
Being uncertain of their likes, but knowing some places I have seen them nest, I made this...

Installed on the tree:

Ok wasps, come and see! Open house week for wasps!
We saw one nosing around the patio couple of days ago, it's time to give her a place to nest that I approve of, instead of inside the porch light.

:D

Pearl Sutton

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posted 2 years ago

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I have a resident!! One can has paper wasp nest being built in it.

Lots of wasps around the yard. Not many cabbage moths BUT we had a warm spell, then a cold snap, then a LOT of rain, not seeing many bugs at all. Think they all got knocked back, including the good ones.

Mark Reed

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posted 2 years ago

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Wrens can help with that a bit too. I have five wren houses in my garden and it's fun to see them hopping around under the leaves looking for the worms. Not sure what kind of wrens I have. They are quite small and never ever stop singing.

They don't like neighbors of any kind so if you put up more than one nest box, or small flowerpot, or coffee can, or old boot just keep them several feet apart and so the entrances don't face each other. *If you hang your work pants on the fence, don't leave them there long or you'll have pants wrens.

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Pearl Sutton

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posted 2 years ago

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Mark Reed wrote:Wrens can help with that a bit too.

Yeah, I'm trying that too, and so far it's failing... see https://permies.com/t/177016/Bird-duplexes

So far no takers, of any species in the duplexes.
A wren built a nest on the porch and abandoned it, a robin laid eggs in it, hatched babies, then they were just gone. Someone wise told me it looked like a snake got them.

This is all pretty puzzling.
At least some wasps have moved in! Better than my bird houses.

:D

Pearl Sutton

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posted 2 years ago

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An update! The wasps are KICKING ASS!! The cabbage moth population is very low,I see one or two flying, the only caterpillars I found on the kale were under curly parts of leaves here it's hard to dig them out. I watched a wasp come to the kale, go under a leaf, a few secs later it left with a caterpillar.
YAY WASPS!! Get them!!

Some data points for anyone else considering this:
I'm seeing both paper wasps and mud daubers. You can't really pick which you'd prefer. I have no hornets or yellowjackets, no clue what to do with those.

I still only have a nest in one of those cans, that might not be the best way to house them. I'll check in the fall how many got used.
I have nests in all kinds of places (you know how wasps are) I have only removed one that was in a bad spot, the rest are being left alone.

I don't start problems with the wasps, I don't swat at them, startle them, I am careful to not disturb them if they are working an area, I work someplace else. I put out good energy at them, tell them they are awesome, don't send out irritated or hostile vibes. I don't know if any of that helps, but it certainly doesn't hurt. At minimum it keeps me calm and friendly around them so they don't feel threatened.

I have not been stung. I ALWAYS HAVE easy to access stuff for stings!! I always have homeopathic Apis Mellifica which is for bee stings in my work pouch when I'm out working. Within 100 feet of where I'm working I always have generic liquid children's Benadryl, so I can dose how much I need, and because I'm badly reactive to the sedating properties of it, I have instant coffee crystals with it, I always have water, and can mix up something I don't like (not a coffee drinker) that will negate the sedative effects. I have heard that the liquid Benadryl can be applied topically, if I am stung, I plan to test that. Hoping not to find out :D

It's working!! YAY WASPS!!

Casie Becker

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posted 2 years ago

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Most people around here pull their kale in the summer because it gets so heat stressed the insects destroy it. We don't eat it much in summer because of the bug damage is unappealing but we have had lacinto kale plants survive through 3 productive winters. This summer even the curly leaf kale is still alive. Very, very heavy wasp presence in our yard. I wonder if our kale wouldn't struggle through the summer without them.

Pearl Sutton

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posted 2 years ago

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I have no luck at all with any other greens here. This year I see two volunteer chard! WOOT! After planting massive amounts of seeds every year for zero results. Chard was an invasive weed at my last home, I miss it.
So I try to keep the kale at least, going. One type doesn't seem to mind the heat much, but the bugs get it, cabbage moths, and new this year, Harlequin Stink Beetles.

Casie Becker

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posted 2 years ago

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Chard grows great here. In our garden all greens, except sweet potato and malabar spinach do better in the shade of a deciduous tree. I am trying my luck with a katuk bush this year. It's a true tropical plant so it has a very sheltered location and I will try to root backup cuttings in the fall. Sometimes tropical plants will survive the winter here.

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