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paul wheaton
master steward
Posts: 22337
Location: missoula, montana (zone 4)
bee chicken hugelkultur trees wofati woodworking
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The mission is multifaceted. But at the forefront is to change the world for the better. My idea of better. To create examples of different flavors of better. Again, my idea of better.

To prove the value and economy of the wofati as a home. To prove the wofati freezer concept. To prove the wofati root cellar concepts.

To prove that 20 people can live under one roof without stabbing each other.

To prove that we can grow a lemon tree, outdoors, in montana. To prove tefa.

To set a record for most food produced per acre in montana. To set a record for most income derived per acre in montana.

To have people with illness come to the land and mysteriously become healthy.

To prove some ideas about better poop management.

To prove better food production and better food flavor using permaculture techniques without irrigation, fertilizer or pest control.

To prove that we can change the world in our backyards. Cutting energy use while still living luxuriously reduces war, pollution (thus, illness) and other environmental degradation. Reducing toxins in the home while still living luxuriously reduces illness. Growing food without irrigation, fertilizer and pesticides, reduces pollution (thus, illness), feeds the world and helps to move farming from a poverty lifestyle to a profession. All of these together gives hope to young folks that they can live a rich life without having to enter into the wage slave world.

I think it can be summed up by this video showing children with cancer. When I see this video I feel bad for the kids. Because they have cancer for the sake of icky industry to profit. And so much of the world is so ignorant of this, that hospital they are in is riddled with carcinogens. In 1950 there was one pediatric oncology ward. Now there are over 200.



I want to build a better world rather than being angry at bad guys.
 
Br. Curt Beardsley
Posts: 8
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Being rather new to Premies, I have been trying to read up from past postings in order to get a good idea of what the overall mission is for buying land and forming a community. Being in a community is something I have wanted for quite some time but have not been able to find one that isn't out to get your money. And, they are not truly interested in any real kind of mission. Many remind me of the 60's and the Hippie era where everyone was in to free love and all sorts of drug. Nothing really to do with reality. I was a very young teenager then who wanted to be a hippie but my parents would have none of it and I couldn't even wear a pair of bell bottoms!!

I like much of what you have stated about the mission . In fact, I like all of it except for 20 people living under one roof. I could not survive that! Not because I don't like people but because I am a retired priest (don't hold that against me, I'm not the typical Christian.) and monk, so prefer the solitude for times of meditation and prayer. So, I guess one question would be: Will people be able to live in their own tiny house?

I don't know much about Missoula or Montana for that matter--that is except for pictures and videos. When the land is purchased I would be interested in flying out for a visit.

I'll close this post for now. And, I'll keep reading. A lot of interesting folks here.
 
Greta Fields
Posts: 218
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Thanks for thinking of the children.
The children in my communty were frequently born hydroencephalic, headless, backless, as siamese twins, as piles of tissue, without brains etc. My father, who reated the water, thought it was stuff in water, like drycleaning chemicals, Xray chemicals from the same hoispitals delivering the two-headed kids, oil, gasoline, battery acid...and especially, ta-dum, coal silt. My mom worked at a hospital where deformed kids seemed to be very frequent. At that time, we had a drought, and people were drinking concentraed coal filth from their wells, creeks etc. My father would literally beg service stations not to dump stuff in the creeks. It's a wonder I was born normal.
 
paul wheaton
master steward
Posts: 22337
Location: missoula, montana (zone 4)
bee chicken hugelkultur trees wofati woodworking
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In another thread somebody said:

Paul is asking people to sign up for hard labor for education, fun, and the heck of it.


When I left the 80 acres on mount spokane, I wanted to find a place to continue my projects. I had lots of things I just had to do. I felt like a painter that could not find a canvas. I did try a couple of places to settle down, but they each ended up having crazy preventing me from doing what i needed to do.

I was willing to pay a healthy amount to have a canvas I could nurture. At first, I was looking for a four year canvas and I actually moved in somewhere and once settled started getting all sorts of crazy (raised beds? nobody gardens on raised beds. that's crazy. And it is not allowed here.) Then I decided that I would make a strong push in the missoula area. Only now i wanted a 15 year lease. I visited a lot of properties and visited with a lot of property owners. No takers.

I choose to believe that there are other people in a similar boat. There are projects that they need to do. To prove what is in their head - or at least try.

A friend went with me to TL yesterday. He's very savvy on a lot of my topics and has listened to a lot of my podcasts. When i dropped him off, I pointed out that for all of the things he does within the city limits of Missoula, there is an army of people that would proclaim themselves "eco", "environmentalist" or "master gardener" that would hold him back from his projects. He will have to fight to see his vision become a reality. But on TL, he won't have to fight to move forward - the other artisans will pull him forward. His forward momentum will have a jet pack.

I think that with 20 like minded folks on TL, my velocity will be improved by more than 100 times. And that just seems delicious.

So, I have a lot of paintings to paint. And out of 7 billion people, there are about a dozen that will be like I was: in need of a place to express their art - and their art fits easily within my comfort zone.

And, yes, there will also be some folks that aren't quite ready for their own canvas, but they want to start dabbling a bit ....


 
Chris Kott
Posts: 821
Location: Toronto, Ontario
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Br. Curt, the term "typical christian" is kind of like saying "typical monotheist," "typical spiritual person," "typical human," or "typical carbon-based life-form." There is no average measure to be applied. I would personally be open to a discussion of spirituality and religion, but it might require a different thread, or a private conversation.

I have seen some monasteries where 20 or more people live under one roof, and historically there were larger, and yet most of them were provided a cell with a cot, desk, chair, and very little else. Not spacious, but private, and much closer to what Paul's talking about than what is considered the "norm" even in large family dwellings.

As to being able to live in a tiny house all by oneself, I think that on two hundred acres, with the option of keeping livestock and moving them around in mobile paddocks to keep them in fresh grazing and to improve soil fertility, if one were to lead that train of mobile paddocks with a tiny trailer house (I don't remember what others call them, I'm just talking about the tiny houses built on 10'x10' trailer frames, usually with a tiny kitchenette, thai-style bathroom (toilet area gets closed off with watertight windows and becomes a shower stall) and a loft area with a bed), well the specifics would have to be worked out, but I think it's an idea Paul might entertain.

Oh, and for the record, I am quoted above, and to provide context, I was just voicing the opinion that anyone who passes the most of Paul's rules needs to be a person with a strong work ethic and vision, and as such probably wouldn't have the deformations of character that make them the variety of drunk/drug addict or even simple rabble rouser that Paul wants to avoid, whatever they happen to drink or smoke on their own time. Strong work ethic and enthusiasm are their own character filter.

I was wondering if there was a more general plan happening as to how the land will be changed on the large scale. As in, whole-property microclimate engineering; lets say citrus is to be grown at the center of the 200 acres. Would it not be easier to start with windbreaks/wind diversion over water for increased humidity, and suntraps to store solar energy in the earth, in the same way that land will be shaped in large ways for waterworks and land texturing? Are measures to be taken to raise the relative hardiness zone on the property as a whole?

-CK
 
paul wheaton
master steward
Posts: 22337
Location: missoula, montana (zone 4)
bee chicken hugelkultur trees wofati woodworking
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Would it not be easier to start with windbreaks/wind diversion over water for increased humidity, and suntraps to store solar energy in the earth, in the same way that land will be shaped in large ways for waterworks and land texturing? Are measures to be taken to raise the relative hardiness zone on the property as a whole?


There is a huge mix of strategies. And it is going to depend on how many people are there and the level of expertise. I don't want to do earthworks faster than the new stuff can be seeded.

As for raising the hardiness zone for the property as a whole - I think I can do that. But is it going to be that 3% of the land is going to be 30 degrees warmer in the winter, or is it that the whole land will be 10 degrees warmer? Or both? I think there is a lot of experimenting to be done.

 
Zach Weiss
pollinator
Posts: 296
Location: Montana
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I am 100% down with this mission.

I would love to help build the first wofati. Even more so the design/build of the wofati freezer. If they did it in the 19th century why on earth is it so hard for us to figure out today?!

It does nobody any good to be angry, let's start SHOWING people the solution in the physical reality so that things start getting a lot simpler.

This is HUGE. I think the empire just started the next chapter... the empire strikes back

I've got a trailer full of tools, experience with growthouses, timber framing (from stump to joinery), straw bale, earthbag, and "standard" (degenerative) carpentry skills from foundation to finish, a young back and serious drive.

I can operate excavators, tractors, loaders, chippers, but my favorite is the shovel with a plant in the other hand.

I can't rip out my roots, just as they're starting to take off, but I would like to help as much as I feasibly am able. I want to be there when the earth is flying!

If you end up buying a track-hoe, and I can use it for whatever I want, with no land restrictions... that's an incredible opportunity. So many possibilities for your own slice of the empire...

What's the approach on TL about celebration and gatherings, hosting convergences, etc?
 
Enrique Garcia
Posts: 86
Location: Las Vegas, NV
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What is TL ?

I love the ideas I've read .. about husp & having a community where people can choose how much to be a part of the whole .. they can have privacy but still be neighbors who can learn & rec'v help from others ... people I know are looking into that kind of thing .. some even have $$ !!
 
Julia Winter
steward
Posts: 2082
Location: Moved from south central WI to Portland, OR
181
bee bike chicken food preservation hugelkultur urban
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TL stands for "The Land," it's another shortcut for wheaton laboratories, the big parcel of land with only recently built structures on it like the first wofati, the wofati 0.8 (currently under construction), the pooper(s) and the tipi with a rocket mass heater in it.

Oh! and a pond (? right? is there a pond now?) and a bunch of hugelkultur beds. There is also a hugelkultur by the house at Base Camp.
 
Enrique Garcia
Posts: 86
Location: Las Vegas, NV
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Thanks Julia. you are appreciated. are there pictures of this land ? Or videos on the YouTube ? It all sounds so awesome .. i have looked into wofati's b4
 
Julia Winter
steward
Posts: 2082
Location: Moved from south central WI to Portland, OR
181
bee bike chicken food preservation hugelkultur urban
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LOTS of pictures. Check out some of the other threads in this sub-forum (Wheaton Laboratories - there's a link at the bottom of the page). Kristie's photo thread has probably hundreds of photos. (And, yes, after the first few she got a camera that didn't feed them to the web sideways, so you don't need to offer advice about that.)

I got to visit TL last August, when my daughters and I were traveling from Wisconsin to Oregon. They were just starting to build the first wofati then. Check out the thread on Wofati 0.8, lots of step by step photos of the process thus far.
 
paul wheaton
master steward
Posts: 22337
Location: missoula, montana (zone 4)
bee chicken hugelkultur trees wofati woodworking
 
Diego de la Vega
Posts: 39
Location: Central Virginia, USA
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paul wheaton wrote:


I love this. That cabin needs a back porch with a screen and it would be perfect. I just realized that this thought could potentially place me in the "type of people" you are trying to get away from category. But, depending on the location and local moisture/standing water, I am totally right on this one ;0).

Diego
 
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