Chainsaw decision

My 15 year old  52 cc chainsaw has died.   So, I am exploring the possibilities.   My present goto is a 36v Makita.  But, I admit to appreciating the power of the Stihl when putting up multiple cords of firewood.   So, do I need a new 52 cc which will cost in the $400 range?  Will a 30cc do for $200? Or, should I consider a more powerful battery operated saw?  If so, what brand and size?

My main saw is a 54cc Dolmar, and I think it's a pretty good average size. I have an 18" electric one, and it's nice to have, but it just isn't up to a gasoline powered one. My smallest saw is a 009 Stihl and I am pleased with how much power it has for its size. I would have expected it to be less than 30cc, but I looked it up and it's actually 40cc, which is impressive for a saw that can be wielded with one hand. But then, maybe the engines back then (or at least a worn one) were that much less efficient that it would be like a 30cc today.  It is true that a small saw can cut twice it's bar length, but I would buy a big saw with a 36" bar if I found one at a good enough price. When the bar doesn't go all the way through the log, it becomes several times harder to cut it, not to mention the time having to make two cuts from both sides. If a chain becomes slightly dull, which they do at the most inopportune times, it becomes extremely difficult to push that round nose through the cut, whereas if the tip is all the way through the other side, it is only slightly more difficult than normal. But I'm strong enough to carry a big saw; for some that may be an issue. I used a 045 Stihl even as a teenager, though I think I could handle one bigger.

I would say a small saw would be ok as long as it is a quality one. But then a small saw will be working harder to do the same work and may fail that much sooner.  But a small saw may be much easier on the user. Or maybe a small saw would be so much slower that it would actually be harder on the user in the long run. Clear as mud. I guess that's why I'm a big proponent of "the right tool for the job." As long as I can afford it, I will have multiple tools for different circumstances.

John F Dean wrote:I admit to appreciating the power of the Stihl when putting up multiple cords of firewood.... should I consider a more powerful battery operated saw?

I use a 58-V Jonsered saw with three 5.2 Ah batteries, and when spending the day clearing small trees and brush, my arms and back will run out of juice before the batteries do. That being said, when cutting multiple cords of firewood, gas is going to be the better option.

The Stihl will cost 500 to replace.  I am looking closely at an 80v Kolbalt.

John, I have the 40v Kobalt chainsaw.  It is….adequate.  It cuts wood, actually fairly well, and it has bucking spikes which I like.

Unfortunately it does not have a variable speed trigger.  It is simply a switch.  Maybe the 80v version is better.  Personally I have my eye set on the Greenworks 80v as it has some better features, including larger battery options.

I will be interested to hear your decision.

Eric

Thanks for the heads up.  GW wasn’t even on my list.   I looked it up, and it seems interesting enough.   One frustration I have …. As I am sure everyone else ….is the cost of those 80v batteries.

I have the makita 36v saw. It's the first chainsaw I've owned, but I've used some gas ones and also recently a stihl battery powered one.

Before the makita I was felling many trees with a 14" aggressive tooth hand saw and only cutting what was necessary to move the dead trees off the path etc.. I wasn't cutting firewood for the stove though. Then we had a crazy storm this spring that knocked a bunch more trees down and I figured it was time to save myself some time.  

I have 2- 3ah and 2- 4 ah batteries, and one single battery charger. I recently cut up a 14" poplar and it drained both sets of full batteries two times. I charged them once over-night and finished the job the next day.
More/larger batteries, a double charger, or another single one would help keep things moving, as I ended up waiting for batteries to charge.

Using it is so much nicer than a gas one though. It's pretty light, only makes noise when I squeeze the trigger, it doesn't smell apart from the bar oil, and I can charge it with our solar setup.

It doesn't seem to have the power of a gas saw though, and I'm not sure about the longevity of it being used frequently. I think if I was going to start cutting all of my firewood, I would maybe still get a gas saw, but will use the electric one when possible.

I also have the makita 18v long hedge trimmer which works really well and lasts a long time even on the 3ah batteries, as well as the drill/driver set.

If I wasn't already invested in their batteries etc, I may have chose a different system to start with for the chainsaw, but I've been pretty happy with makita so far.

My suggestion would be to consider having both a gas and an electric chainsaw. Some times all I need to do is cut up a few things or even just need to work around the house. The electric chain saw is really not designed for long cutting in my opinion. Doesn't mean you cannot do some bucking.

I regularly cut up a cord of wood in one sitting. No way would I get anywhere trying to use the electric chain saw. However, taking the branches off of the tree could be handled by the electric saw. The electric chain saw is also handy for building projects along with demolition projects, just watch out for nails. Its way more powerful than using a sawzall or a jiggsaw...

I am quite partial to the Husquvarna professional series myself. None of those rancher/homeowner versions.... for me.

Here is two very good videos by project farm on electric chainsaws

I have what many would sneer at now but a 044 Stihl with a 4-foot bar and after many years it has never let me down.  I was a faller for Weyerhaeuser some years ago.. I tried an electric saw a friend has not long ago, and it felt weak to me.  Lot of power initially, but fell on its face in short order.  I usually work with a Stihl 032AV, which many would feel is an antique, but I find is a dandy saw for all around use.  Hell, the 044 is an antique now, I suppose.   I used to have an 066 Stihl with a very long bar before I quit falling trees, but I never liked the damned thing.  Always seemed "choked up" to me.  Meh.. Put on the leathers on your shoulder and walk up into the woods at 3 or so in the morning and cut until 2 in the afternoon or so..

Do what feels right for you.  Parkinsons is making my usage of any saw questionable at this point.

Hi,  Why did it stop working?   Can it be repaired?  Can a new or different engine be put in for less expense? My 35 yr old stihl quit, I put in a new motor and bar. Cost was just over $ 100.00. Runs just as good as ever.  

As for performance,  if I am working long hours with the saw I would not use the electric.  The batteries aren't sufficient enough for the job, unless I buy several multiple batteries.  

There are options outside of the major brand names. I've got a couple of knock-offs that I got at extremely inexpensive prices. Jon Cutter 30cc (I think it's 30) and a Stihl 070 clone (I don't think the brand names on these matter, they probably all come out of the same factory). I also have a Husqvarna 576xp autotune (because I can't tune a saw worth a darn).

The Husky is a solid workhorse at 76cc and I've used it for everything. Worth the thousand dollar price tag.
The Jon Cutter was under $200 and is proving reliable and capable. If the job is 18" dia. or less, I'll grab this saw.
I got the 070 clone with its 105cc engine to be my milling saw. And, because I can't tune a saw worth a damn, I cooked it and seized up the piston in short order. That saw was under $500, and it's my fault that it has broken down.

For the sort of thing you're looking at, I wouldn't hesitate to suggest Jon Cutter as a cost effective option.

The gas powered saws all come with that downside - gas powered. The large battery technology has its environmental impact issues. Personal perspective to balance the relative pros and cons.

I'm assuming most of you are talking about pretty sizable rounds, but just adding another dimension.  In addition to a new DeWalt cordless chainsaw that my wife loves (5 Ah battery is typical for this, but she's worn out before her 2 Ah battery is.....), we occasionally use a corded electric McCullough with my Stihl gas unit doing the heavy lifting.  But for a good dose of the firewood collection, we use a chop saw-- either bringing wood (5-6" rounds) to the building where it is housed or bringing the chop saw to the field.  I don't know the amp draw from the chop saw.....could it be powered by an inverter from a truck?  But we use a PTO generator to power it in the field and then just haul the cut wood back with whatever is available a the time.  Bulk of the wood being cut is elm, ash, box elder, and some spruce.

I pulled the trigger and bought a 16”, 80v  GW.   It is supposed to be delivered today.

Oh, please do review for us.  I have been wanting to get my hands on one of those for some time now.

Eric

I will get some pic out.   I bought the 80v GW with the 2.5 amp battery and 16 inch bar. The price was $244.00.   This appears to be something worth taking your time to buy.  The price fluctuates like the stock market.

It has a 3.5 hp motor. The Stihl Farm Boss also has a 3.5 hp engine (sorry, I had a couple of friends in college who were engineering students. They taught me the difference between a motor and an engine).   The package arrived from Amazon well ahead of schedule.  Of course I charged the battery.

It came with one battery, bar, chain, a bar cover, and a funky throw away wrench.  

I have recent experience with the Makita 36v, Craftsman (Poulan?) 42cc, and the Stihl Farm Boss 52 cc.   Power wise, it seems to be a tad less powerful than the Stihl and far more powerful than the Craftsman.  

The Makita seems to be the better built saw.   It came with back up batteries, and it listed for $100 more than the GW.  

The GW is impressive in its cutting ability. The problem is that 4 cuts later, the battery was dead.   Now, to be clear, I was cutting through a year old 20 inch Oak blowdown.   But, 4 cuts doesn’t count as a day in the woods for me. It desperately needs a 4 amp battery , and it needs several of them.

I got what I paid for.  If I take the Makita as my base, it currently lists for $389.    If I take the GW and toss in two additional batteries, I land at  $500.00.  
A new Stihl Farm Boss also costs about $500.   And, taking a Makita from 36v to 80v ( if that was possible) would seem to land in the $500 price range.


I  will post more in a few days when I time the charger and cut time.   The Makita looks like it is safe as my goto saw.  But, even if I had a new Stihl, that would be the case.  

my old makita 520 finally gave out today. it is in desperate need of a new clutch and coil. which would cost much more than the 25 year old saw could be worth.
ive been learning more about wood cutting, firewood production and small engine repair on YouTube and have found two video posters to be very helpful. these are buckin billy and taryl fixes all.
excellent information these for anyone interested. those project farm videos are great. not currently having financial ability to invest in an up to the minute rechargeable saw its time to finally figure out how to get a couple old stihl saws to run once again. one is an ms 360 that since getting it used have never been able to get it to run, and the same situation with an old stihl 044. well after watching taryl videos I'm now learning the tips and tricks and proper way to repair these things. time to find parts. besides I'm not too sure how well a new battery powered saw would do in the 2' diameter and larger oaks and hickory that a local guy who owns a log truck brought me a couple months ago. one of these, I think it was a hickory, was so hard there were sparks flying off the chain when buried deep in the I/2 dried out tree. yes the chain was sharp and the oiler was working full blast. I had this happen a few years ago when cutting a giant dead white oak.

John,

Really sorry to hear about the crappy runtime, at least on the logs you are cutting up.  I had no idea you were cutting wood that sized.

As another idea—that is if you trust any from me at this point—is to try for 3rd party or aftermarket battery packs.  I know that the brand names really charge a premium just for their name and some 3rd party sellers can sell you a battery with all the same internal parts for half the price.

Another thought is to try factory reconditioned batteries.  These are typically old that went bad during their warranty period, got returned, rebuilt, and are being resold.  I have bought a couple of factory reconditioned tools that work great and were a tremendous value over buying new-off-the-shelf.

I wish you better luck!

Eric

Hi Eric,

20” is not my usual cut.  It was a blowdown that I had to deal with. Like I said, those were thick logs and far from green.  I don’t regret my decision.  I am just not having the “ Oh Wow!” moment I had with the Makita.   Now the big question is if I throw money into batteries ……probably around $250, or if I buy something like the Stihl 251  (around $350 if I shop around.).   Right now, I am leaning slightly toward the batteries.   The deciding factor is not cost.  It is the fact that when I pull the trigger on the GW, it runs like hell.   I can’t say that about gas fired saws that sometime don’t want to start.

And, the GW with even one added battery coupled with the Makita would make for a reasonable afternoon in the woods if I played to the strong suit of both.

I think I got it.  Nice to hear that it cuts nicely though.  And for what it’s worth, I think that the extra batteries are the better investment at this point since you are in the platform.  And really, a tool like this needs a bare minimum of two batteries in my opinion—one to use and one to charge.

Eric

I just spent a couple of hours out in the woods with it.   I have come to the conclusion that with 2 more batteries it would give the Stihl a run for the money on my average day in the woods.  I say my average day because the  major exception would be if the entire work load was 20 inch rounds.  Then the Stihl would win without question. Today I cut about 26 10 inch rounds and many smaller cuts.

Two electric saws would be good, especially if you already have them. Another thing to consider that hasn't been mentioned is the duty cycle. Electric motors don't like heat. One thing I liked about the one I bought was the fact that it had actual steel bumper spikes. I took that to mean that it was meant to compete with a gasoline saw. Unfortunately, using the bumper spikes to gain much leverage at all causes the thermal cutout in the motor to trigger. I guess it's better than burning out. Switching between two saws would help keep things cool.

Hi there,

You have several high quality replies and I'm only adding my reply to emphasize my experience in this exact situation.  I've been using chainsaws for decades.  I used to live in Montana and other cold weather places that required several cords of wood per year.  Now I live in a much more reasonable climate with regard to winter.  Years ago I tried battery operated chainsaws.  I thought it was a great idea...then I went through brand after brand...bought battery after battery...wasted hours researching how to make batteries perform better...wasted hours trying to find the most reliable brands...and I'm back to a gas operated chainsaw.

I'm only trying to save you from the misery I experienced.  In all of my chainsaw travels Stihl makes the best brand.  I've done things with a 16" bar that defy logic with regard to the size of the trees I've dropped.  I've had good experiences with other brands such as Husqvarna.  

Remember, I'm only posting to add another voice to the many fine voices you've doubtlessly read.  

Good luck with your decision.

John,

Your experience with the 10” rounds sounds a whole lot more reasonable.  I did once see a comparison of a (sorry, cannot remember the brand) 18 volt chainsaw cutting firewood—mostly 6” or so wood—compared to a 42cc gas chainsaw.  The results were about even, owing to the fact that the battery chainsaw never idles.

This guy really put it through the paces with a 4 or 5 amp hour battery which, contrary to mathematical assumption, has far more energy than the 2.5 AH battery.  The one test where the battery chainsaw simply failed to live up was in ripping a log for lumber.  He was ripping a log probably 16” in diameter and got a couple feet down the log when the battery just simply gave out.  This was one instance where gas was obviously superior.

But I would think that getting even just one 4 or 5 AH battery would really improve your runtime.

Eric

Hi All,

There is no doubt in my mind that Stihl is the best saw on the  market.  That is why I bought it when I was in my late 50s.   I am now nearly 73, and I am trying to figure out what saw is best for me.   That makes the equation a little more difficult.  I am looking for something that will be useful when I am 80.

Having gotten the Makita some time back (a year ….maybe 2 years ago), I developed a high opinion of the potential for battery saws. I am not fooling  myself, the Stihl is the best saw on the market from my perspective .  But is is more saw than I need on a regular basis.

Right now, for me, the hardest part of using a gas chainsaw is tugging on that rope and not having it start without playing with it.  So, electric saws seem to be a reasonable choice if I am only going to need an actual cutting time of 2 hours or so.  The batteries are expensive, but I see them as fuel paid for in advance.

Eric, I seem to remember some review stating the battery appeared to increase its capacity after several uses.  One thing worth noting, the 80v does not seem to bog down.  It has cut out on me maybe 2x in a total of 4 sessions.

John,

Took me a while to get back to you on this one—life and all.  

Your reasoning behind getting a battery saw is sound.  I like the notion that a battery is fuel paid in advance.

I have never heard that a battery actually increases its capacity after a few uses, but that would be an interesting find if it did.

Now as far as the larger battery not cutting out, that makes perfect sense.  If you have a 5 amp battery compared to a 2 amp battery, the 5 amp battery has much more mass.  The battery cuts out because of built in thermal cutoff protection circuitry.  That larger battery is just going to take longer to heat up to cause a thermal cutoff.  

To illustrate this, I once saw a comparison between a 42cc gas saw and an 80 volt, 5 AH battery powered saw.  When it came to cutting things like 4”-12” rounds, the batter saw equaled the gas saw.  The same review then tried to rip a log lengthwise to make lumber.  The saw started with a full battery and made about 2 feet of cutting before it just quit.  That much hard cutting with no breaks was too much for the battery and it was done.  So the moral of that story was cutting branches and logs—the battery saw was great (though your huge oak might be more of a problem).  Ripping a log was strictly for gas saws.

Eric

I have a 60v Dewalt 18" saw and a 50cc Jonsored 2250 with a 18" as well. Dewalt was $400 and the Jonsored was $200. The Jonsored runs absolute circles around the battery saw in all ways. LIghter, cheaper, way more power and a single tank of gas is equivalent to 3 or 4 battery charges AT LEAST. There are other positives for the gas saw but the only one I can think of for the battery one is if you use the thing once a year. No worries about draining gas and whatnot.

I bought a 3 amp, 80v Dsanke battery for the GW.   It cost in the $80 to 90 range.   I haven’t done exact measurements, but it seems to be at least as good as the original 2.5 amp.   I have recharged it 3x.  

The reviews were a little negative.  They seem to follow 2 themes. The first is that the battery does not work in the mower. Well, I don’t have a GW mower.  The second relates to the battery not charging.   I did notice that the battery will not take a charge or even recognize the charger if it has not cooled down.  After, it has cooled down, it takes a charge OK.   Of course, this adds to the recharge time.  

So, I will stick with my earlier estimate of needing a third battery for the GW.  That, combined with my Makita will make for an afternoon of putting up firewood.   In round numbers, this arrangement will give me around 200 cuts.  

If I count the added 2 batteries, the total cost comes in around  $420.00.   If I needed a saw for something heavier than general  use around a homestead, I would probably go with gas. But, I use it for firewood and brush clearing…..maybe cutting a fence post…..so it seems to be what I need.

Not a bad setup!