Medieval Korean oiled-paper greenhouses

Aug 18, 2024 06:18:30

These eliminate the need for plastic.

https://londonkoreanlinks.net/2019/11/22/the-worlds-first-active-greenhouse/

I'm sure there are downsides, but I wonder if anyone here might be interested in trying it? I couldn't find any other experiments online.

Aug 18, 2024 08:17:19

I have seen the paper houses from olden Japan in a lot of movies so it seem logical that their greenhouses would be made of paper also.

Aug 18, 2024 10:53:21

That is seriously cool. I would love for you to do a little research on exactly what "Hanji" paper is - if it's like traditional Japanese rice paper that I've seen, the techniques for making it are still well understood and practiced and I think that it has some longer, unaligned material in it which improves it's tear resistance compared to what we think of as paper today.

I'm also not sure exactly what "kudle" heating is either, and if you have time for research, adding a post on that would be most welcome.

The article was posted, Nov 2019, and it would be absolutely fascinating to find out how long the paper lasted. Did they only get 1 season before replacing? You can see the roof is constructed in squares with cross supports in both directions. I wonder if these are easily removable panels. If so, it could be that they removed and stored the panels when they weren't needed. That concept alone is worth considering if someone is building from scratch. Woman handling large sheets of plastic is awkward, and rolling and unrolling them probably weakens them. I don't know of anyone who actually removes their green house plastic in the summer in my area, but many put shade cloth over top - ie more plastic of a different form! Making something in panels that are easily manageable by 1 or 2 people could be useful in many locations.

Great article - loads of interesting concepts that pemies can apply to the green house or other projects. For example, I wonder if this could make an exterior winter cover for house windows to keep the wind off the glass, but still allow light in? Most people don't want to have to install "storm windows" for the winter anymore, even though they have their benefits. Glass is heavy! And the frame needs to be heavier also, as it can't tolerate being warped.

Aug 18, 2024 10:57:12

Hanji (Korean hand made) paper:
What: https://www.momentslog.com/culture/unveiling-the-beauty-of-south-korean-hanji-handmade-paper-craftsmanship-and-cultural-symbolism

How: https://mymodernmet.com/hanji-paper-art-korea/

Watch:

Aug 18, 2024 14:48:12

Cool! From Carla's top link:

Hanji is made from the inner bark of the mulberry tree, which is abundant in South Korea. The process of making Hanji is a labor-intensive one, requiring great skill and precision. The bark is harvested, boiled, and then pounded to create a pulp. This pulp is then mixed with water and spread onto a wooden frame, where it is carefully pressed and dried. The result is a strong, durable, and flexible paper that is highly regarded for its quality.

I have heard of mulberry as a substrate in paper making, although I am pretty sure that I read it relating to Japan, rather than Korea, but the countries are very close together. This is another great place for permaculture, because Mulberry can be coppiced. I will read the two articles, but something critical I think I read about the Japanese Mulberry paper, is that it wasn't made from Morus alba - the mulberry grown for silk worms.

Yes, here:

Mulberry paper, also known as "Kozo Paper", "Washi", "Hanji", or "Rice Paper," is a unique and versatile type of paper that originates from the bark of the mulberry tree, primarily the Paper Mulberry (Broussonetia Papyrifera)

https://kozo.studio/blogs/journal/discovering-the-magic-of-mulberry-paper-origins-production-and-creative-uses#

So I guess I'd have to look up Broussonetia papyrifera to see whether it coppices.

My underlying point here is that replacing one unsustainable product for another, isn't the goal here!

That said, for special uses, and beauty, it may take great skill to make, but for oiling for a green house, it may not be beyond a medium skill level without more research.

Dec 30, 2024 15:26:45

This really interests me as an alternative to plastic. Would it be possible to make it out of any other type of paper or make cloth from second hand sheets?

Dec 31, 2024 11:55:45

I just ordered a 20-meter roll of Hanji paper for experimentation. (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01EIA90PI)

I wonder what I should oil it with. It seems like the oil can help with water-shedding and transparency...but does the kind of oil matter? Are there other attributes the oil controls?

Dec 31, 2024 12:10:51

I think linseed works for everything… wood, metal, clay, lime… I’d try that first. I definitely want to hear how this goes and I might be following your lead!

Jan 21, 2025 02:14:07

Christopher Weeks wrote:I just ordered a 20-meter roll of Hanji paper for experimentation. (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01EIA90PI)

I wonder what I should oil it with. It seems like the oil can help with water-shedding and transparency...but does the kind of oil matter? Are there other attributes the oil controls?

Great! I hope you can get around to it and report back! :-)

Jan 21, 2025 02:16:55

Annie Hope wrote:This really interests me as an alternative to plastic. Would it be possible to make it out of any other type of paper or make cloth from second hand sheets?

I've seen a couple of YouTube videos about DIY methods of making ordinary sheets incredibly waterproof, like a tarp.

Jan 21, 2025 03:44:20

Regarding the kudl (온돌), it appears to be the same as an ondol - a traditional Korean hypocaust or heated floor:

https://ko.wikipedia.org/wiki/%EC%98%A8%EB%8F%8C

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ondol

The English language Wikipedia article (which can be reached by changing the Korean articles language to English), states that "ondol" (온돌) can be pronounced "gudeul" (구들), where the leading "g" is a "hard g", i.e. more or less a "k" sound.

From the article:
"...gudeul originated from guun-dol (Korean), which means "heated stone"".

Jan 21, 2025 10:15:33

Scott Lawhead wrote:I think linseed works for everything… wood, metal, clay, lime… I’d try that first. I definitely want to hear how this goes and I might be following your lead!

Just something to consider, if the oil solidifies or is liquid can have a significant impact on how condensation behaves when in contact with it. Likewise to the fiber form and the chemistry of the oil/solidified oil. My guess would be that the way water contacts and rolls down a liquid oil face would be very beneficial, but that the solidified oil might last longer. Also, I would guess that if the fiber structure helps with toughness, as Jay mentioned, that if the oil solidifies then it might become more brittle. But liquid oil might need more maintenance in the form of occasional reapplications. All conjecture on my part!

Great subject!!!

May 26, 2025 06:16:22

A (very) little more on these early Korean greenhouses can be found here:
https://web.archive.org/web/20170928061551/https://english.hani.co.kr/arti/english_edition/e_national/183056.html

Jun 08, 2025 05:59:56

This Korean language paper investigates 3 plant oils for making oiled Hanji - sesame, perilla and tung oil. Based on the English language abstract, the focus is more on the pH of the oil, and how that is affected by temperature, with a view to having as neutral a pH as possible in the finished product, for maximum durability. While it does not explicitly state in the abstract that these oils are those traditionally used to make oiled Hanji, that is my inference.

https://cdn.apub.kr/journalsite/sites/ktappi/2018-050-05/N0460500506/N0460500506.pdf

This PDF has a text layer, but I haven't tried pushing it through a mechanical translator.

@Cristopher Weeks - Have you had a chance to experiment with your Hanji paper, yet, or have you had bigger fish frying?

Jun 09, 2025 04:46:35

Not yet!

Jun 16, 2025 16:50:51

Has anyone seen any details on how this oiled hanji paper is secured to the structural framing?

I can imagine using wooden battens or laths is possible. Maybe wiggle wire would work. Unfortunately, I haven't seem any detail images of this in the few articles I've found describing the traditional Korean green houses, whether historic or the modern attempts to reconstruct one.

I know from experience that even fairly delicate paper seems to be tougher and more damage resistant once oiled (even if with a non-drying - that is, not readily oxidizing - oil). I've used cigarette rolling paper (about 0.001"/0.025mm thick) as a feeler when touching off milling cutters on the edge of a work piece (N.B. I am not a machinist, but needs must). Once saturated with machine oil, the papers hold up fairly well, with reasonable care. I'd expect oiled hanji paper to behave similarly, though stiffening up as a drying oil such as tung or linseed cures.

In my neck of the woods, design snow loads are quite high (80-100 psf - maybe something like 4500 Newtons per square meter maximum, roughly speaking [feel free to correct my mental math]). I'd expect snow to slide off the oiled hanji, similar to a plastic covered green house, which should help to reduce the loads on the paper, and consequently on the fastening means, too. But, snow load is still a major design consideration where I live.

So, anyone have ideas on attaching a hanji paper covering to a green house frame?

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