• Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic
permaculture forums growies critters building homesteading energy monies kitchen purity ungarbage community wilderness fiber arts art permaculture artisans regional education skip experiences global resources cider press projects digital market permies.com pie forums private forums all forums
this forum made possible by our volunteer staff, including ...
master stewards:
  • Anne Miller
  • Pearl Sutton
  • Leigh Tate
  • Nicole Alderman
stewards:
  • paul wheaton
  • jordan barton
  • r ranson
master gardeners:
  • Carla Burke
  • Jay Angler
  • John F Dean
  • Nancy Reading
gardeners:
  • Mike Barkley
  • thomas rubino
  • Beau Davidson

Nut suggestions for Northern Europe

 
pollinator
Posts: 2339
Location: Denmark 57N
585
fungi foraging trees cooking food preservation
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
We've planted a walnut and 30 hazelnuts we have a 80 year old beech tree and a few small oaks already on the property, I'm wondering what other nut trees might manage a crop in our cool/cold summers. Chestnuts, almonds and pecans do not crop here we simply do not have the warmth they require. Are there any pine trees that can be used for nuts? especially any that come from COLD summer areas.
 
pollinator
Posts: 374
Location: Zone 8b Portland
62
2
forest garden fungi food preservation
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Yeah absolutely pines will work for you. Korean nut pine comes to mind. I think there’s even some Siberian nut pines. Martin Crawford has an excellent book on all kinds of nuts. It’s worth checking out
 
gardener
Posts: 690
Location: Southern Germany
373
kids books urban chicken cooking food preservation fiber arts bee
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Chris Holcombe wrote:Yeah absolutely pines will work for you. Korean nut pine comes to mind. I think there’s even some Siberian nut pines. Martin Crawford has an excellent book on all kinds of nuts. It’s worth checking out


Don't get fooled by the denomination "Siberian". Siberia stretches so far to North and South that there are actually regions with much hotter summers than Central/Northern Europe.
Denmark certainly has milder winters but at latitude 55 is more northerly than for example Irkutsk (52).

So while it gives a rough outline there still might factors that don't make planting comparable.

Sorry, nothing to add on the nut front. Walnuts and hazelnuts are easy here, everything else (including edible chestnuts) not and has to be imported.
 
pollinator
Posts: 366
Location: Worcestershire, England
83
5
hugelkultur purity forest garden fungi trees urban bike bee woodworking
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Araucaria araucana- yes it can be a long wait but someone has to plant it. With some of the nuts you have ruled out there are varieties that are better for cool climates like England, e.g I have a robijn almond tree that has produced quite well but I guess if you are at 57N it might be a bit too far for them. Perhaps more named varieties of Hazel as Cobnuts and Filberts?
 
Skandi Rogers
pollinator
Posts: 2339
Location: Denmark 57N
585
fungi foraging trees cooking food preservation
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
unfortunately monkey puzzles don't fruit here again not warm enough.
Pinus koraiensis Korean nut pine does sound possible since it appears to like cool summers, does anyone know if it can grow on chalk? I see it prefers acid but that doesn't always mean it can't grow on a basic soil. And I can see I can buy them here which is a big plus!
 
Henry Jabel
pollinator
Posts: 366
Location: Worcestershire, England
83
5
hugelkultur purity forest garden fungi trees urban bike bee woodworking
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
People grow them in Scotland and get them to fruit there. I was assuming your climate isnt too different from there?!

One of the people I have bought seeds off before is in Inverness the other is Dundee

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Three-Araucaria-araucana-Monkey-Puzzle-Tree-Seeds/184443616349?hash=item2af1b23c5d:g:QxMAAOSwLAlfW-mD

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/40-x-FRESH-MONKEY-PUZZLE-TREE-SEEDS-Araucaria-Araucana/174583748776?hash=item28a60098a8:g:AYoAAOSwGz9fRl-L
 
Skandi Rogers
pollinator
Posts: 2339
Location: Denmark 57N
585
fungi foraging trees cooking food preservation
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Only going on what I am reading but they very rarely flower here and even when they do it's even less common that they ripen any nuts.  I've not seen any large ones around either which I used to in Aberdeen.
 
pollinator
Posts: 289
Location: Hamburg, Germany
82
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I just posted a bit on Korean nut pines here:  https://permies.com/t/153778/Korean-Pine-tree-growing-tips  

I actually just got around to shelling my first (tiny) harvest of bladdernuts!  https://pfaf.org/user/Plant.aspx?LatinName=Staphylea+pinnata  I actually picked them off the ground around November.  I've had the plant also about 5 years, and it's quite a pretty little shrub so far.  My understanding is that it's self-fertile but will fruit more heavily with another nearby, so I need to find another place for a second.  

I will say that the shells are VERY hard, and my nutcracker (from the nice guy at Piteba) left me with tiny shards of shell and meat instead of what the pretty picture shows.  So shelling was tedious and not particularly productive.  If anyone has a suggestion for improving the process, please chime in.

Also, um, a bladder is not the first organ I would have identified the protective structure as.  At least it makes finding fallen nuts easy, and the squirrels don't seem to have clued in that there's food inside.  
 
Anita Martin
gardener
Posts: 690
Location: Southern Germany
373
kids books urban chicken cooking food preservation fiber arts bee
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Skandi Rogers wrote:Only going on what I am reading but they very rarely flower here and even when they do it's even less common that they ripen any nuts.  I've not seen any large ones around either which I used to in Aberdeen.


One neighbour down the street has a little Auracaria, but in all the years I am living here it has hardly grown at all. Not sure about the variety.

Regardint the bladdernut:
Very interesting, just did some reading on the German wikipedia entry:
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gemeine_Pimpernuss

It seems the nuts are used in the Georgian cuisine as jonjoli, the dried shells were used for rosaries, and in parts of Bavaria the nuts are used for a special liquor with aphrodisiac effects (so they say, never had one myself - it is the first time I heard of it, to be true).


Today I have received a seed and plants catalog from one of my favourite organic providers and they have hickory nut trees. First time I saw them.
 
Skandi Rogers
pollinator
Posts: 2339
Location: Denmark 57N
585
fungi foraging trees cooking food preservation
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Morfydd St. Clair wrote:

I actually just got around to shelling my first (tiny) harvest of bladdernuts! .  



So what do they taste like? I've never heard of them before but they are available here and apparently crop well so if they taste decent they sound worth planting
 
pollinator
Posts: 133
34
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Araucaria doesn't fruit in Denmark? Weird, because according to the Norwegian alien species list it fruits well on the west coast of Norway, so well north of your location Skandi. (https://artsdatabanken.no/Fremmedarter/2018/N/3374) Also, I definitely saw one with ripe cones at about 63 degrees north (also Norwegian coast) although I never got around to checking if there were any seeds on that one. Probably not, as it was the only one of its species in the immediate vicinity. Awesome tree though, and the nuts are super tasty boiled, quite like chestnuts.
 
Skandi Rogers
pollinator
Posts: 2339
Location: Denmark 57N
585
fungi foraging trees cooking food preservation
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Eino Kenttä wrote:Araucaria doesn't fruit in Denmark? Weird, because according to the Norwegian alien species list it fruits well on the west coast of Norway, so well north of your location Skandi. (https://artsdatabanken.no/Fremmedarter/2018/N/3374) Also, I definitely saw one with ripe cones at about 63 degrees north (also Norwegian coast) although I never got around to checking if there were any seeds on that one. Probably not, as it was the only one of its species in the immediate vicinity. Awesome tree though, and the nuts are super tasty boiled, quite like chestnuts.



I have a suspicion that they die in our colder winters. the west coast of Norway is zone 8 and we are zone 7 so it may be that they die before they get old enough to fruit. That would explain why I have not seen one over 12 ft tall as well.

EDIT I found some more information on them, apparently one winter during ww2 every single one in the country died, except for one in Copenhagen there are a few large ones on an island on the southern border that look around 60 or so. If winters continue getting milder it might be something worth planting here, but at a 35 year wait to even know what sex it was..
 
master gardener
Posts: 2142
Location: Isle of Skye, Scotland
764
transportation dog forest garden foraging trees books food preservation woodworking wood heat rocket stoves ungarbage
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I have a similar problem here with cool summers on Skye (NW Scotland) the US zone system doesn't really work well to identify whether a plant will grow well or fruit.  However, we also get mild winters rarely below -5, so I am optimistic that my monkey puzzles will crop (in between 10 to 40 years from now- they grow here almost as fast as any other tree!).  I have also bought some hazelnut cultivars this year, since we had a really good year with local nuts three years ago.  Chestnut doesn't seem to like the salt winds, so isn't doing very well, maybe if the warmer summers reach this far I might get better wood ripening in future, but I'm not even planting it for firewood now.  I am also trying bladdernut and korean pine.  
I tasted bladdernut at East Devon Forest Garden a couple years ago - very pleasant, a bit chewy perhaps.  The inner shell is tough and soft which is what makes it difficult to remove.  Mine haven't fruited yet, but I'm optimistic; the plants are growing well so far.
I've struggled to get Korean pine to germinate - only one seedling in two years trying from seed (although that has now survived a year in the ground, still tiny).  Last year I thought I'd bought seedlings, but I'm not sure what they actually are, the foliage is yellow tipped, so I'm not convinced they are Korean pine.  I'm trying seed again this year.
Another nut I am hopeful may work for me is Gevuina avellana (chilean hazelnut), the edible seeds also have an oil that is supposedly a valuable sunscreen.  I have one plant growing well, and a couple of seedlings.  It may be too tender for you again though.
Another Chilean possible is Chilean plum yew: Prumnopitys andira/elegans and the somewhat similar Japanese plum yew Taxacarpus fortunii.  I have small plants of these, but they may need rather warmer summers than I get.
Some Elaeagnus species have edible seeds that may be of interest, and other Pines I am considering are Pinus cembra, and Pinus pinaster.
I wasn't hopeful I would get Walnut to fruit here.  What variety have you got?  I gather the heartnut (Juglans ailantifolia) will ripen earlier than walnut, so I'm thinking of trying a few of those. ART list several cultivars.
 
Eino Kenttä
pollinator
Posts: 133
34
  • Likes 4
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I'm thinking of trying shagbark hickory (Carya laciniosa) as I've read that it can fruit in southern Sweden, but haven't found a reputable seed source yet. Does anyone know of one (preferably in Europe)? But again, it will take many years to reach maturity...
Yellowhorn (Xanthoceras sorbifolium) is mentioned a lot, but few people seem to have actually tasted it. You find dozens of sources (all quoting each other, I suppose) claiming that the nuts taste like macadamias, but that seems to be nothing more than rumor. Tried to find statements from people who actually tried, could only find two who said they had. One said that it was pleasant eating, but not entirely like macadamias, while the other said it was barely edible and quite disgusting. Did anyone here try? Also, not sure how far north it would be hardy.
Nut pines are nice! In northern Sweden you find them (probably Pinus sibirica) planted in a lot of small villages, even in the cold inland. I once heard someone claim that the state at some point encouraged people to plant them as an emergency food source for scarce years (fat, yum). Unusually good thinking for the state, if it's true...
 
Anita Martin
gardener
Posts: 690
Location: Southern Germany
373
kids books urban chicken cooking food preservation fiber arts bee
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Eino Kenttä wrote:I'm thinking of trying shagbark hickory (Carya laciniosa) as I've read that it can fruit in southern Sweden, but haven't found a reputable seed source yet. Does anyone know of one (preferably in Europe)? But again, it will take many years to reach maturity...
Yellowhorn (Xanthoceras sorbifolium) is mentioned a lot, but few people seem to have actually tasted it. You find dozens of sources (all quoting each other, I suppose) claiming that the nuts taste like macadamias, but that seems to be nothing more than rumor. Tried to find statements from people who actually tried, could only find two who said they had. One said that it was pleasant eating, but not entirely like macadamias, while the other said it was barely edible and quite disgusting. Did anyone here try? Also, not sure how far north it would be hardy.
Nut pines are nice! In northern Sweden you find them (probably Pinus sibirica) planted in a lot of small villages, even in the cold inland. I once heard someone claim that the state at some point encouraged people to plant them as an emergency food source for scarce years (fat, yum). Unusually good thinking for the state, if it's true...


Not sure if this is the hickory variety you mean, but saw it in a German gardening catalog.
IMG_20210105_171017.jpg
[Thumbnail for IMG_20210105_171017.jpg]
 
Eino Kenttä
pollinator
Posts: 133
34
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Thanks! What's the name of the company/catalog? Not sure what species it is either, but guess either C. laciniosa or C. ovata. Both are hardy and fruiting in south Sweden according to what I read... My German is so rusty it's virtually nonexistent, but those are plants, not seeds, right? Would be easier with seeds, but the best seed source I found in Europe was some russian guy on Etsy, plus B and T world seeds have them for preorder.
 
Anita Martin
gardener
Posts: 690
Location: Southern Germany
373
kids books urban chicken cooking food preservation fiber arts bee
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Eino Kenttä wrote:Thanks! What's the name of the company/catalog? Not sure what species it is either, but guess either C. laciniosa or C. ovata. Both are hardy and fruiting in south Sweden according to what I read...


The company is Hof Jeebel. The German name translates to shagbarked hickory nut (was that the name? Can't check on my mobile phone and hope I haven't written an obscenity...).
 
Eino Kenttä
pollinator
Posts: 133
34
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Yeah, that's the name, and whether it's obscene or not is anyone's guess... Gonna check it out, thanks again!
 
Posts: 25
Location: Denmark/scandinavia
3
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Both chestnuts and almonds can crop in denmark. My grandparents got an almond (cant remember the cultivar) that usually get loads of nuts. Its up against a wall so its a bit shelted in its location, but almonds can be grown here especially if your in a milder part of the country. Sweetchestnuts are naturalized and spreeding in some places in denmark and they crop very well. The chestnuts i´ve seen around here are seedling trees so the nuts are a bit smaller but I know of people who has planted grafted varites that should produce decently in our climate. Last october I found a  huge chestnut in a park in copenhagen that produced nuts the size of those imported for eating. Black walnut can grow and produce ripe nuts here and the taste is great and totally different than the regular walnut (juglans regia). Due to black walnuts ripening here I think that some of the pecans and hickories with a more northern distribution might be alright also, but its just a theory.
 
Skandi Rogers
pollinator
Posts: 2339
Location: Denmark 57N
585
fungi foraging trees cooking food preservation
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Simon Flygare wrote:Both chestnuts and almonds can crop in denmark. My grandparents got an almond (cant remember the cultivar) that usually get loads of nuts. Its up against a wall so its a bit shelted in its location, but almonds can be grown here especially if your in a milder part of the country. Sweetchestnuts are naturalized and spreeding in some places in denmark and they crop very well. The chestnuts i´ve seen around here are seedling trees so the nuts are a bit smaller but I know of people who has planted grafted varites that should produce decently in our climate. Last october I found a  huge chestnut in a park in copenhagen that produced nuts the size of those imported for eating. Black walnut can grow and produce ripe nuts here and the taste is great and totally different than the regular walnut (juglans regia). Due to black walnuts ripening here I think that some of the pecans and hickories with a more northern distribution might be alright also, but its just a theory.



Interesting that sweet chestnuts can fruit here the only one I have ever seen died about 5 years ago when we had a spell of -15 it was quite a large tree as well I know they should survive that temperature but rosemary and sage don't survive outside here either and they should as well. (I suspect it's the constant freeze thaw and damp) Interesting you found one that produced big nuts, in the UK it's very noticeable how much smaller the nuts are in the north  than they are in the south. I found a good crop in Durham but they were nearly half the size of the New Forest ones. It might be worth getting some seed from that tree. Not that I will ever be in Copenhagen.
I am up near Hanstholm so it's much cooler than copenhagen, and my only south(east) facing wall is reserved for a fig it was only planted last year so will take a while.  I found this little diagram showing the heat differences over denmark

And the link so you can see what the colours mean
 
Morfydd St. Clair
pollinator
Posts: 289
Location: Hamburg, Germany
82
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Skandi Rogers wrote:

Morfydd St. Clair wrote:

I actually just got around to shelling my first (tiny) harvest of bladdernuts! .  



So what do they taste like? I've never heard of them before but they are available here and apparently crop well so if they taste decent they sound worth planting



i was told that they taste like pistachios.  With that possibly biasing me, I'd say that's correct.  A kind of green taste and a creamy texture.  I did not roast them, so I don't know how that changes them.
 
Posts: 42
8
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Skandi Rogers wrote:

Simon Flygare wrote:Both chestnuts and almonds can crop in denmark. My grandparents got an almond (cant remember the cultivar) that usually get loads of nuts. Its up against a wall so its a bit shelted in its location, but almonds can be grown here especially if your in a milder part of the country. Sweetchestnuts are naturalized and spreeding in some places in denmark and they crop very well. The chestnuts i´ve seen around here are seedling trees so the nuts are a bit smaller but I know of people who has planted grafted varites that should produce decently in our climate. Last october I found a  huge chestnut in a park in copenhagen that produced nuts the size of those imported for eating. Black walnut can grow and produce ripe nuts here and the taste is great and totally different than the regular walnut (juglans regia). Due to black walnuts ripening here I think that some of the pecans and hickories with a more northern distribution might be alright also, but its just a theory.



Interesting that sweet chestnuts can fruit here the only one I have ever seen died about 5 years ago when we had a spell of -15 it was quite a large tree as well I know they should survive that temperature but rosemary and sage don't survive outside here either and they should as well. (I suspect it's the constant freeze thaw and damp) Interesting you found one that produced big nuts, in the UK it's very noticeable how much smaller the nuts are in the north  than they are in the south. I found a good crop in Durham but they were nearly half the size of the New Forest ones. It might be worth getting some seed from that tree. Not that I will ever be in Copenhagen.
I am up near Hanstholm so it's much cooler than copenhagen, and my only south(east) facing wall is reserved for a fig it was only planted last year so will take a while.  I found this little diagram showing the heat differences over denmark

And the link so you can see what the colours mean



That is interesting to know, I live currently on Hornsherred, so zone c, and chestnut trees grow quite fine here but yeah the nuts are quite small. I have also seen some planted on fyn quite close to the little zone b area, or possibly inside it. But not sure if those ones fruited. And I wonder, how does Mark Shepard grow chestnuts in Wisconsin, which is zone 4b? Are the summers that much warmer? I do know he has done some hybridisation work with american, europen and chinese chestnut so maybe that plays a part in it.

Other than that, we are actually going move to Arden this year to start a permaculture community (https://levefaellesskab.dk/wp/) and looking also into planting different nut trees. I have some books on the topic, but not started the research yet, so will post updates if I find out anything interesting. One nut I saw mentioned I have not heard of before, is the water caltrop/chestnut: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_caltrop It does require water and is an annual but I wonder if it could grow here in denmark.
 
gardener
Posts: 1155
Location: the mountains of western nc
282
forest garden trees foraging chicken food preservation wood heat
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
the summers are that much hotter. summer highs are frequently in the 90’s-100’sF (or 35-38C) in that area. the area in southern wisconsin where mark’s farm is, is also something like 13 degrees latitude farther south than much of denmark.
 
Markus Padourek
Posts: 42
8
  • Likes 4
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I just had a quick glance into the "Trees for gardens, orchards and permaculture" book from Martin Crawford and about almonds he writes that french clutivars that bloom late but ripen early are the best for britain, which I guess are also better for denmark. He does also give an overview of some suggestions. Out of curiosity I also looked at his book on how to grow nuts (one can see a preview on amazon), there he gives even more detail and talks about dutch and french cultivars for cold temperate climates, as well as almond/peach hybrids. Some examples are "Ingrid" and "Robijn" for hybrids as well as "Ferralise", "Felisia", "Lauranne", "Steliette" and "Tuono" for non-hybrids that flower late and fruit early.
I could also see some pages on chestnuts there and again much more details than on the general book on trees and there he classifies chestnuts in 6 different ripening seasons spanning over around 6 weeks. So maybe some of the "very early" cultivars could be something for denmark. "Darlington" and "Primato" are two I can see. He does however only talk about european, chinese and japanese chestnuts (as well as hybrids between those). For american ones he only talks about the chinkapin/dwarf chestnut (Castanea pumila) that is hardy to zone 5 and fruits early compared to european chestnuts (september/october), so they might also be a possibility. Castanea dentata is the "normal" american chestnut and could be interesting to find out more about that one also.

There are many more nuts in the book but that was just what I had time to look into now.

Also for both books Martin provides information about the RHS hardiness, in addition to the usda zone, for each tree. That system also takes into account temperature swings, especially in spring and fall so that gives an additional useful indicator.
 
Markus Padourek
Posts: 42
8
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I also just realised I have the book "permakultuhaven" which is from two people in midtjylland and they are writing that almonds can grow in denmark, but needs protection from wind and as much sun as possible. They also say, that one should select cultivars that fit to the northern climate. About chestnut (Castanea sativa) they say that it grows well in denmark as long as there are at least two trees close to each other. Then they also mention the heartnut (Juglas ailanthifolia var. cordiformis) that is even more hardy than walnut and grows faster and also needs at least two trees. Other than that they only mentione hazelnuts, so not broad selection they cover, but still good to hear about their experiences.

I also found some more information on the american chestnut from a polish plant nursery: https://kornelkirsche.eu/sortiment/edelkastanie?lang=de-DE It says they taste more like hazelnuts and are edbile raw, is more hardy than the european chestnut and therefore can well tolerate colder locations than the european chestnut. But it has more needs when it comes to soil condition. It also needs at least two genetically different chestnut trees and one can use any tree from the Castanea family. Also sounds quite interesting. Definitely will get added to my list.
 
Skandi Rogers
pollinator
Posts: 2339
Location: Denmark 57N
585
fungi foraging trees cooking food preservation
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Markus Padourek wrote:I also just realised I have the book "permakultuhaven" which is from two people in midtjylland and they are writing that almonds can grow in denmark, but needs protection from wind and as much sun as possible. They also say, that one should select cultivars that fit to the northern climate. About chestnut (Castanea sativa) they say that it grows well in denmark as long as there are at least two trees close to each other.



living right next to the "Nationale Testcenter for Store Vindmøller" almonds are out then, wind is something everything here has to put up with.  I love chestnuts but I really would need to see one within 100km of me before planting two or three and then having them die when we have a cold snap like we just did. (-16 this year) I'm not convinced by the health of my walnut it's been very poorly grafted I fear. I will see if I can find some heartnuts for sale they sounds interesting, I have around an acre (half a hectare) I can plant with big trees so space isn't a huge issue.
 
Skandi Rogers
pollinator
Posts: 2339
Location: Denmark 57N
585
fungi foraging trees cooking food preservation
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I decided to see if I could find any more info on chestnuts (Castanea sativa) around here, I'm finding conflicting information on whether they can deal with chalk or not, some sites say yes others say no not at all. Some sites (British) say it dies around -15C (zone 7) whereas American sites say it can go to zone 5. I think if I can find seed or find a tree near me that is older than 20 years I will plant a few, but I think they are to marginal to spend good money on them. It's a shame I really like chestnuts.
 
Simon Flygare
Posts: 25
Location: Denmark/scandinavia
3
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Markus Padourek wrote:

Skandi Rogers wrote:

Simon Flygare wrote:Both chestnuts and almonds can crop in denmark. My grandparents got an almond (cant remember the cultivar) that usually get loads of nuts. Its up against a wall so its a bit shelted in its location, but almonds can be grown here especially if your in a milder part of the country. Sweetchestnuts are naturalized and spreeding in some places in denmark and they crop very well. The chestnuts i´ve seen around here are seedling trees so the nuts are a bit smaller but I know of people who has planted grafted varites that should produce decently in our climate. Last october I found a  huge chestnut in a park in copenhagen that produced nuts the size of those imported for eating. Black walnut can grow and produce ripe nuts here and the taste is great and totally different than the regular walnut (juglans regia). Due to black walnuts ripening here I think that some of the pecans and hickories with a more northern distribution might be alright also, but its just a theory.



Interesting that sweet chestnuts can fruit here the only one I have ever seen died about 5 years ago when we had a spell of -15 it was quite a large tree as well I know they should survive that temperature but rosemary and sage don't survive outside here either and they should as well. (I suspect it's the constant freeze thaw and damp) Interesting you found one that produced big nuts, in the UK it's very noticeable how much smaller the nuts are in the north  than they are in the south. I found a good crop in Durham but they were nearly half the size of the New Forest ones. It might be worth getting some seed from that tree. Not that I will ever be in Copenhagen.
I am up near Hanstholm so it's much cooler than copenhagen, and my only south(east) facing wall is reserved for a fig it was only planted last year so will take a while.  I found this little diagram showing the heat differences over denmark

And the link so you can see what the colours mean



That is interesting to know, I live currently on Hornsherred, so zone c, and chestnut trees grow quite fine here but yeah the nuts are quite small. I have also seen some planted on fyn quite close to the little zone b area, or possibly inside it. But not sure if those ones fruited. And I wonder, how does Mark Shepard grow chestnuts in Wisconsin, which is zone 4b? Are the summers that much warmer? I do know he has done some hybridisation work with american, europen and chinese chestnut so maybe that plays a part in it.

Other than that, we are actually going move to Arden this year to start a permaculture community (https://levefaellesskab.dk/wp/) and looking also into planting different nut trees. I have some books on the topic, but not started the research yet, so will post updates if I find out anything interesting. One nut I saw mentioned I have not heard of before, is the water caltrop/chestnut: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_caltrop It does require water and is an annual but I wonder if it could grow here in denmark.



Hi Markus, chestnuts does indeed grow very well in Hornsherred and i´ve seen them scattered around the area. Theres an old stand (10-15 ) of chestnuts at the rosenpark in gerlev not far from Jaegerspris, that crops very well plus a huge black walnut too.

Skandi ,I dont think that -16 would be of much harm for a chestnut with some hardy genetics. I had -14 right against  my house and i got strong winds coming through my garden so it was probably mush colder than -16 and no damage too my almond and peaches and a little frost dammage on the buds of my figs. Theres some very old chestnuts 100 m from my home and even though they get some protection from being grown in a forest they are old enough too have been through some pretty harsh winters. I think that some kind of windbrake would work wonders sheltering them from the worst windchill until they are a little more robust in size
 
Skandi Rogers
pollinator
Posts: 2339
Location: Denmark 57N
585
fungi foraging trees cooking food preservation
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Markus Padourek wrote:

Other than that, we are actually going move to Arden this year to start a permaculture community (https://levefaellesskab.dk/wp/) and looking also into planting different nut trees. I have some books on the topic, but not started the research yet, so will post updates if I find out anything interesting. One nut I saw mentioned I have not heard of before, is the water caltrop/chestnut: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_caltrop It does require water and is an annual but I wonder if it could grow here in denmark.



I very nearly bought a house near Arden 2 years ago but the position on a bend made it unsuitable for a roadside stand (it did have it's own well which was a plus) Water chestnuts are not a nut but rather a root and one of my favourite vegetables, if you get them to grow let me know I don't have any water but I'm sure I could work something out!
 
Markus Padourek
Posts: 42
8
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Skandi Rogers wrote:

Markus Padourek wrote:

Other than that, we are actually going move to Arden this year to start a permaculture community (https://levefaellesskab.dk/wp/) and looking also into planting different nut trees. I have some books on the topic, but not started the research yet, so will post updates if I find out anything interesting. One nut I saw mentioned I have not heard of before, is the water caltrop/chestnut: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_caltrop It does require water and is an annual but I wonder if it could grow here in denmark.



I very nearly bought a house near Arden 2 years ago but the position on a bend made it unsuitable for a roadside stand (it did have it's own well which was a plus) Water chestnuts are not a nut but rather a root and one of my favourite vegetables, if you get them to grow let me know I don't have any water but I'm sure I could work something out!



Ha, what a coincidence. Yeah I really want to add a little water garden, but let's see there are still many things needing to be designed. In terms of chestnuts, maybe it is worth contacting some local plant nurseries? Maybe Aalborg planteskole has it? Other than that I can see that https://www.roeds-planteskole.dk/ a plant nursery north of randers has chestnuts and for permaculture plant nurseries there are: https://permakulturhaven.dk/plantesortimentet and http://www.westergaards.dk/kastanje/

None of them quite as north as you are, but might still be able to help you out. Also I am pretty sure we are going to plant chestnuts on the property in Arden, but then we are probably also much more wind protected then you are.

Also in terms of temperature here on horrensherred - I just checked the weather archives in Frederikssund and in the last 10 years the lowest I could find was -15.6C, so seems the chestnuts can tolerate that.
 
Anita Martin
gardener
Posts: 690
Location: Southern Germany
373
kids books urban chicken cooking food preservation fiber arts bee
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Maybe this is not quite to the point, but could you not replace nuts with seeds to some extent?
I always add a mix of nuts and seeds to my porridge, and I also use them for bread and cakes.

If you have the space available but not the climate for nuts, you could grow pepitas? The cucurbita pepo var. styriaca originates from Austria and thus can handle a colder climate.
I have only cultivated them once (due to lack of space) and the amount you get is rather small, but still a great food to grow yourself.
 
Skandi Rogers
pollinator
Posts: 2339
Location: Denmark 57N
585
fungi foraging trees cooking food preservation
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Anita Martin wrote:Maybe this is not quite to the point, but could you not replace nuts with seeds to some extent?
I always add a mix of nuts and seeds to my porridge, and I also use them for bread and cakes.

If you have the space available but not the climate for nuts, you could grow pepitas? The cucurbita pepo var. styriaca originates from Austria and thus can handle a colder climate.
I have only cultivated them once (due to lack of space) and the amount you get is rather small, but still a great food to grow yourself.



I grow some pumpkins each year and I do get seeds, I've not had any luck with hull-less pumpkins yet but I will keep trying.
 
Nancy Reading
master gardener
Posts: 2142
Location: Isle of Skye, Scotland
764
transportation dog forest garden foraging trees books food preservation woodworking wood heat rocket stoves ungarbage
  • Likes 4
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Update on my Korean pine seedlings: I have decided that they are Korean pine after all. Despite being really yellow last year, this year they have darkened up and some even have a bluish tinge to the needles like I believe they should have. I have read that they take a few years to get established, so I guess they have been starving a little until they build their relationships with soil fungi. Nice to see them looking a bit a) healthier and b) like the trees I wanted rather than a random ornamental conifer.
I have also been trying to grow them from seed, but although I think I have been pretreaing them correctly I only have succeeded in germninating one little tree so far. Of my new hazelnut cultivars only three of the four survived. I may try replacing them next spring. My monkey puzzle seedings have been doing great though. I think I'll start off a few more seedling this winter.
 
Posts: 211
9
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Here in Germany walnuts do really well, much better than chestnuts, which do grow, but the nuts are very small and not well developed. Walnut can also be sold for its wood at a premium price, takes quite some years though... but walnuts really do well here, the trees are huge and the harvest plentiful, and the trees do not seem to need a lot of care.
 
Posts: 49
13
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
English walnuts you can DEFINITELY grow in Denmark, they are already growing naturalised in some areas in southern Sweden in Scania and on the isles of Öland and Gotland. I've seen A LOT of trees and self-sown seedlings there of various sizes. In Stockholm there are several old, big beautiful trees that produce a lot of nuts - I currently have a seedling from one of these trees which I got from planting a few of the walnuts that had fallen down on the ground(millipedes and fungus gnats destroyed the other seedlings unfortunately). In the region of Dalarna there are people who are growing walnuts with some success, here's one article which was translated to English on growing walnuts in Sweden: https://xn--skogstrdgrden-hfbr.xn--stjrnsund-x2a.nu/notodling-valnotter/?lang=en
The same website has other articles/parts discussing other nuts like chestnuts too: https://xn--skogstrdgrden-hfbr.xn--stjrnsund-x2a.nu/notodling-kastanjer/?lang=en
There are some sweet chestnut tree specimens here and there in south Sweden that produce fruit, even in Stockholm there are or have been some quite big and old and productive trees from what I've heard.

The walnut cultivars Lake and Broadview are quite hardy and can be grown quite far up north in the US and Sweden. In Ukraine and Russia there are some old, hardy walnut cultivars that were developed during the USSR era like the walnut tree "Ideal" which is said to be extra hardy. In Belarus there was a man by the name Loiko who bred an extra hardy form of walnut that now bears his name "Loiko" whose seedlings are growing as far north as Örnsköldsvik, Sweden. Take a look at a map and you will see that that is VERY far up north! You can read more about it here but it is in Swedish so you might have to use Google translate: https://xn--skogstrdgrden-hfbr.xn--stjrnsund-x2a.nu/loiko-bakgrund/ Anyone who has problems growing walnuts in a cold area should look into finding hardy walnut cultivars like Lake, Broadview, Loiko and Russian/Soviet/Ukrainian ones like Ideal.

By the way it might be worth looking into growing sweet pitted apricots as well for nuts, their nuts/seeds are of near equal value as that of the sweet almond I dare say if they truly are the sweet kind that are very low in cyanide. They are very tasty if not more tasty than almonds. As a bonus with each nut you get a nice sweet apricot to eat as well, so it's like double the harvest! And if the apricot is bad or moldy you can still get a good nut out of the pit/stone as it's not going to be affected by the moldy fruit on the outside. A lot of health stores sell raw, sweet apricot kernels that usually come from Uzbekistan. If your hardiness zone is similar to that of Uzbekistan or not that much colder then you might do well growing these apricots for their nuts? I am currently trying to grow trees out of sweet apricot kernels myself, they are VERY easy to sprout.
 
Skandi Rogers
pollinator
Posts: 2339
Location: Denmark 57N
585
fungi foraging trees cooking food preservation
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Anton Jacobski Hedman wrote:
By the way it might be worth looking into growing sweet pitted apricots as well for nuts, their nuts/seeds are of near equal value as that of the sweet almond I dare say if they truly are the sweet kind that are very low in cyanide. They are very tasty if not more tasty than almonds. As a bonus with each nut you get a nice sweet apricot to eat as well, so it's like double the harvest! And if the apricot is bad or moldy you can still get a good nut out of the pit/stone as it's not going to be affected by the moldy fruit on the outside. A lot of health stores sell raw, sweet apricot kernels that usually come from Uzbekistan. If your hardiness zone is similar to that of Uzbekistan or not that much colder then you might do well growing these apricots for their nuts? I am currently trying to grow trees out of sweet apricot kernels myself, they are VERY easy to sprout.



Walnuts grow yes the mother in law had a lovely huge tree before she moved.  I have a broadview grafted tree that´s  been in the ground 3 years and did flower this year but didn't set anything. Apricots are a greenhouse only thing here, while the tree will grow we'll never get fruit outside. I do know someone who gets amazing apricots, in a massive dome greenhouse, but I don't have that sort of indoor space here.
 
pollinator
Posts: 681
Location: Ohio River Valley, Zone 6b
177
purity forest garden foraging food preservation building homestead
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Try American Chestnut. They're native from Southern Canada and down into the north-eastern US. It gets damn cold here and they do just fine.

Another tree with a similar range is Black Walnut, though it also ranges further south.

Then there are butternuts, pignuts, shagbark hickory, and so on.

You can also eat maple seeds if you cook them.

It actually gets colder where I live than it does in Denmark. And I'm not even that far north. When I was a kid, we had -30 to -40 F a few times. North Dakota has it real bad and they grow hazel, chestnut, and hickory nuts just fine.

I don't think it's the cold that's the problem. Denmark has very sandy soil. It was why the Saxons left and went to Germany and England in the 400s. It was part of the reason the Danes invaded Northumbria in the 900s.

The only cold hardy nut trees that do well in sand are loblolly pines and black walnut. Loblolly can handle your winters, but not cool summers. Black Walnut is not the same tree as English or Greek walnuts. It's native to Canada and the US. But that tree hates other trees. It makes the soil acidic. It has more tannin in it than an oak by a long shot. After harvesting the nuts, I break up the shells and use it to tan hides. The leaves soaked in alcohol are also used as a bug repellent. And the juice pressed from the husks around the nut are the best cure for mosquito bites that I have found. The nut meats are mostly oil, like, you can squeeze it out with your hands. They also burn like a candle. The wood is very durable, close grained, and is the choice wood for heirloom quality gun stocks.
 
Anton Jacobski Hedman
Posts: 49
13
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Skandi Rogers wrote:

Anton Jacobski Hedman wrote:
By the way it might be worth looking into growing sweet pitted apricots as well for nuts, their nuts/seeds are of near equal value as that of the sweet almond I dare say if they truly are the sweet kind that are very low in cyanide. They are very tasty if not more tasty than almonds. As a bonus with each nut you get a nice sweet apricot to eat as well, so it's like double the harvest! And if the apricot is bad or moldy you can still get a good nut out of the pit/stone as it's not going to be affected by the moldy fruit on the outside. A lot of health stores sell raw, sweet apricot kernels that usually come from Uzbekistan. If your hardiness zone is similar to that of Uzbekistan or not that much colder then you might do well growing these apricots for their nuts? I am currently trying to grow trees out of sweet apricot kernels myself, they are VERY easy to sprout.



Walnuts grow yes the mother in law had a lovely huge tree before she moved.  I have a broadview grafted tree that´s  been in the ground 3 years and did flower this year but didn't set anything. Apricots are a greenhouse only thing here, while the tree will grow we'll never get fruit outside. I do know someone who gets amazing apricots, in a massive dome greenhouse, but I don't have that sort of indoor space here.


There are hardy apricot varieties that can be grown in Northern Europe. Examples of such varieties would be: Harcot, Hargrand, Kuresia, Orangered, Nancy. Some Hungarian varieties might also work like Gönczi Magyar/"Best Hungarian" and a few others. I know people growing apricots with success in south Sweden outdoors using some of these varieties!! I've also planted apricots from seed that survived the winter without problem, next year I will also see if the apricots grown from seed will be able to set fruit as they have made a lot of fruit buds now. I also have a couple of grafted varieties(Kuresia and Gönczi magyar). If we can grow them in south Sweden, shouldn't you be able to do the same in Denmark? Also in Russia they developed extra hardy apricot cultivars during the USSR era, but I've yet to hear about these varieties being available in Western Europe. Still the question would be if the sweet pitted apricots can survive in places like Denmark. In the US Starkbros have a hardy sweet pitted variety of apricot by the name "Sweetheart" originating in Idaho which is in a similar USDA hardiness zone as Denmark, but I don't know if there is any nursery in Europe that supplies this tree.

Anyway I don't think sweet kernel apricots are 100% outside the realm of possibility in some parts of Northern Europe.
 
Skandi Rogers
pollinator
Posts: 2339
Location: Denmark 57N
585
fungi foraging trees cooking food preservation
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Anton Jacobski Hedman wrote:[
There are hardy apricot varieties that can be grown in Northern Europe. Examples of such varieties would be: Harcot, Hargrand, Kuresia, Orangered, Nancy. Some Hungarian varieties might also work like Gönczi Magyar/"Best Hungarian" and a few others. I know people growing apricots with success in south Sweden outdoors using some of these varieties!! I've also planted apricots from seed that survived the winter without problem, next year I will also see if the apricots grown from seed will be able to set fruit as they have made a lot of fruit buds now. I also have a couple of grafted varieties(Kuresia and Gönczi magyar). If we can grow them in south Sweden, shouldn't you be able to do the same in Denmark? Also in Russia they developed extra hardy apricot cultivars during the USSR era, but I've yet to hear about these varieties being available in Western Europe. Still the question would be if the sweet pitted apricots can survive in places like Denmark. In the US Starkbros have a hardy sweet pitted variety of apricot by the name "Sweetheart" originating in Idaho which is in a similar USDA hardiness zone as Denmark, but I don't know if there is any nursery in Europe that supplies this tree.



What are the summer temperatures like in southern sweden? It's not our winter temperatures that are the problem (0F is a rare low) it's the total lack of heat in the summer. Idaho has 2 months longer without frost and a much higher summer day temperature than I have. I see my favourite tree shop has Hargrand though it says it needs a south facing wall to fruit. If they wern't so expensive it might be worth a shot, Maybe I will add them to my xmas wish list, although are they a sweet seeded apricot? I love apricots anyway so having the fruit would not be a bad thing.
 
Simon Flygare
Posts: 25
Location: Denmark/scandinavia
3
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Apricots need a good amout of heat to fully ripen. But its not imposible here in denmark (at least in milder areas) to grow out in the open, without a greenhouse. I´ve heard of and seen pictures of trees that are fruiting and doing allright. I  think our rainy summers can problematic though due to fungi. Peaches grow fine too but peach leaf curl can be a problem in wet summers. I got about 20-30 peaches on my little 5 year old tree last year, that are planted out in the open.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6LqpPTKnJpo&ab_channel=Inspiratoriet
I found this lady that grows apricots in her food forest in denmark, but i´m not sure of the whereabouts of the forest.
gift
 
Rocket Mass Heater Manual
will be released to subscribers in: soon!
reply
    Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic