comfrey

Does any one know the cheapest place to get comfrey?  Is it worth planting seeds?  I had intentions of planting comfrey this year, but I just lost my job after 14 years.  Money was already tight, but now, well without help from my son I would be out on the street.  Anyway I thought if I could find seeds for a couple dollars it still might be worth it.  I haven't found it local at all.  Why is that?  I would love your suggestions so I can get some early enough to plant seed, or not bother, but buy the crowns if I get another job soon enough.  Thanks

Jen Fulkerson wrote:Does any one know the cheapest place to get comfrey?  Is it worth planting seeds?  I had intentions of planting comfrey this year, but I just lost my job after 14 years.  Money was already tight, but now, well without help from my son I would be out on the street.  Anyway I thought if I could find seeds for a couple dollars it still might be worth it.  I haven't found it local at all.  Why is that?  I would love your suggestions so I can get some early enough to plant seed, or not bother, but buy the crowns if I get another job soon enough.  Thanks

My ground is still frozen, but if you don't mind waiting a month or so until I can dig, I'll send you some roots.  You can send me seeds of anything you have that I can grow here if you like.  If you don't have any seeds that can survive my climate, I'll just send you some.

I wouldn't use comfrey seeds because I wouldn't want the invasive varieties taking over the world :)

Not sure where you are in norcal but its a very common plant in the coastal and lowland pastures. Its already starting to sprout up around the Humboldt bay region. It is a plant you should be able to get for free.

Jen,

If you can get your hands on some roots, you should be able to easily spread a few plants.

Out of curiosity, how many plants are you planning on planting?  Are you doing so in order to plant some green manure?  Not trying to pry, especially regarding your financial situation—so sorry to hear—but do you see yourself being in the same place for several years?  The reason I ask is that comfrey takes a good year to get established, but once it is established, it gives loads and loads of great green manure.  If love my comfrey and I am planning on expanding my plantings this year.

I wish you good luck with your comfrey and especially your future finances.  Hang in there.

Eric

Trace,

I gotta give you a shout out, your offer for Jen is really just a decent thing to do.

Awesome!

Eric

Eric Hanson wrote:Trace,

I gotta give you a shout out, your offer for Jen is really just a decent thing to do.

Awesome!

Eric

Eric, that's what I love about permies. I'm certain if I were in the same position, someone would help me out.  I have been propagating my comfrey for years and I have plenty to go around.  I'm happy to share.

Trace,

I too love Permies for this quality.  Still, it was s great offer!

Eric

Trace you are very generous, I can't Thank you enough.  
People may think I'm a nut to be thinking about what to plant in my garden when I should be working on getting a job.  This is about the lowest I have been in a very long time.  I am working on getting unemployment, a new job, and some kind of insurance, but working in my gardens gives me joy and piece when the rest of life right now offers little.  
It's people like you that give me hope for our future.  
I love this site.  It's the only site I post on with a rare exception of Face Book for family.  Permies seems to attract people who are kind and willing to share their knowledge, options and humor.  A place I feel safe and can learn so many new and wonderful things.  A place I can share my knowledge and joy of so many permies subjects.
Trace I didn't collect seeds last year. (well I did collect some flower seeds, but left them sitting on the table I was working on and a wind storm blew them away.  Should be interesting to see what shows up in the lawn this year)  I was a Lowes at the end of Summer and they were giving seeds away.  Someone got into trouble for it because it was posted on social media, but I managed to get some before they were ordered to throw them away.  If you don't mind last years store type seeds let me know what you would like and I will tell you if I have it.  I would love to share.
My husband and I bought our house 25 years ago.  We will probably die in this house.  We live North of Sacramento Ca.  Zone 9b  We live on .99 of an acre.  Between a walnut and almond orchard.  I thought the comfrey would be good to plant by the apple trees I planted last year, to help bring nutrients up for the tree, to use as fertilizer, and compost.  It seems like such an amazing plant I don't know why it is so hard to find.
Thank you again Trace, you are a bright spot in  my day.

You're very welcome.  Everyone goes through hard times. I hope this one passes quickly for you.

Whatever you do do NOT plant comfrey seeds! The seeding strains can grow everywhere, and can easily become a serious weed. The sterile strains can still be a weed, but at least they tend to stay where you plant them.

Personally I believe comfrey is very over-rated. Lots of stories about how deep rooting it is, but I planted heaps and a couple years later digging it up I found very few roots deeper than 1 foot, in a light free draining soil where even shallow rooted plants like ryegrass can often have roots 4-5' deep. I planted it as a living mulch under avocado and cherimoya trees, but most of it is gone now. Interesting plant, but does it deserve the hype? Maybe for some areas, but the strain I have (recommended to me as the best) in my soil/climate... not a huge asset in my opinion. YMMV.

I've never planted comfrey, but I plant various ornamentals among my vegetables, and I find that I get a lot of biomass from them. Does comfrey really make more biomass than other plants?

Rebecca,

Fair question.

I think the bonus of having comfrey is that any one plant can be harvested multiple times per summer.

Eric

Rebecca Norman wrote:I've never planted comfrey, but I plant various ornamentals among my vegetables, and I find that I get a lot of biomass from them. Does comfrey really make more biomass than other plants?

For me, the answer is definitely. Comfrey leaves are huge, and as Eric said, you can easily get three or four cuttings a year. I have some around an apple tree that i let go last year because the bees love the flowers,. They grew well over 6 fight tall in my short growing season.

Comfrey is the only thing I have found that will stop invasions of things like quack grass. You can clear an area, border it with comfrey, and stop rhizome spreading plants from getting back in.

Comfrey is said to house thousands of spiders over winter. Bees love the flowers.  Comfrey suppresses weeds extremely well with its huge leaves.  For me, the list goes on and on. Easily one of my favorite plants.

Rebecca,

My last response was made while I was in the process of falling asleep.  I was barely coherent.

But yes, as Trace pointed out (and as I tried to illustrate), once comfrey is established it grows vigorously.  And it only gets healthier with time.  So a few plants will give you an abundance of nice green leaves (and green manure).

All of the other plants you mentioned certainly could be used for green manure, but I have to ask (truly, I don’t actually know), can you cut them after say a month of growth and have them grow back in the same season?  At present I am cutting my comfrey 4 times per season and I probably could cut once or twice more.  Realistically, comfrey should be cut just when or immediately before the flower stalk emerges.  Once the flowers emerge, the leaves stop their vigorous growth and the energy flows to the flowers.  Personally I find the flowers kinda pretty so I sometimes let them blossom for a couple of weeks.  But if I was really serious about getting green mass, the instant I saw the flowers start I would cut the whole plant down to the ground and let it start again.

Comfrey leaves don’t have a lot of fibrous material in them, helping them decompose very quickly.  If you want a compost activator, this is great.  If you just want to go lazy (I do) and chop and drop, the leaves will yield up their goodness to the soil in no time.

Being a deep rooted plant, comfrey will grow during times of drought when other plants will give up.  Worms love to hang out in their root mass and will travel to your garden if planted nearby.

Rebecca, I could go on but I will stop here.  All the plants you mentioned are great additions to a green manure patch.  Comfrey is king for green manure, but better than comfrey is comfrey with a bunch of companions (basically all the plants you mentioned) growing right alongside.  You are really doing something great by having that composting mix; comfrey can only add to it.

If you have any questions, please don’t hesitate to ask.

Eric

My first comfrey plant came from a roadside flea market where I was also selling.  The lady called it “comfy tea” and told how her grandmother used it for tea and that she had been unable to find any info on it.  I told her to look for info on “comfrey” instead and she spent her free-time that day learning about the plant on her phone.  I bought one, brought it home and plopped the pot under a shade tree until I could get to it.  That was mid-summer.  It was the next spring before I finally got around to the plant and had to use a knife to cut the plastic pot loose.  I divided it and planted around the base of a chestnut tree.  The pleasant surprise was that I had several more plants pop up where the pot had been setting due to the roots that had broken off.  I had suspected this might have been true comfrey but in seven years I’ve not had comfrey pop up in any areas were it wasn’t planted so suspect this is one of the sterile cultivars.  

I wanted both bocking  4 and 14 varieties so I found a couple of small hobby growers on eBay and ordered from them.  I got generous cuttings and was very pleased.  Don’t be afraid to ask the seller questions about the variety as their answers will help you determine whether they are actually growers and users of the plant or someone just looking to make a quick buck off a plant they know little about.

Personally I’ve gave away several plants to friends as I seem to always be starting root cuttings.  Oh and the deer discovered my comfrey last year.  It didn’t matter whether it was bocking 4 or 14, they devoured it every chance they got.

Hey Jen, north of Sacramento among the orchards might be a bit trickier to find. I would look in any large city parks or if you can make it up to any meadows in the foothills. Keep in mind that right now it is probably just starting to poke it's leaves up if at all yet (we are just seeing the first shooting leaves in the last month here on the coast). I'd also be willing to send you some root cuttings if you can't find any growing near you. I assume that stuff growing in your area would work better in your area but comfrey does seem pretty adaptable. Feel free to send me a PM if you're interested in a few roots

Trace sent me lots of comfrey roots, I planted them the day they came, and nothing ever happened. I figured I didn't water enough.  The next year Trace sent more, and Gary Numan sent me quite a few comfrey roots. Nothing, I planted in many different places, was carful to mark every place, and watered them. Not one grew.  I don't know why I can't get them to grow.    It still amazes me at the kindness and generosity of Trace and Gary.  
I ordered comfrey crowns of Russian, and Natural on Etsy,  Both grew. The chickens got to the Russian, but I put a chicken wire cage around it, and it came back.  Just about the time I thought I finally had it a gopher killed the Russian one.  I still have one.  It made it through the winter. The chickens got it, but it's coming back, I will have to cage it up.  As hard of a time as I have had, I'm not worried about it becoming invasive.
I also bought comfrey seeds. I cold stratified them, and started 12 seeds in the house. 2 germinated.  Once they had 4 or 5 leaves I put one in the greenhouse, (not heated) and one in the house. The one in the GH is still pretty small, the one in the house is 3 times as big.  Time will tell if they make it, and which will grow better.  I will definitely make a cage to protect the roots at least until it's established. I will also make a cage for the top to protect it from the chickens. It's a lot of work for a plant that is supposed to be super easy, and hardy.  But I'm thrilled to finally have comfrey.

I'm dumbfounded.  I mean ... it's comfrey!  I have no explanation why you're having difficulty.

When I occasionally see posts saying something like 'A friend gave me comfrey, and nothing ever grew', I'd think it wasn't comfrey to begin with.  But I know what I sent you (#14 btw), and I know that what Mister Comfrey himself (Trace) sent was the real stuff as well.  

I blame covid.  It's the scapegoat for everything lately ... and I don't have a more plausible explanation!

Gary, just a thought ...

If Jen tried to root the comfrey before planting would that help?

That way it seems it would be giving the comfrey a had start.

I have never tried to grow it though so I don't know.

Gary I think some of the problem is the weather. I have heard other California people say they have trouble.  I also have a bad gopher problem.  I planted some of the roots you are Trace gave me in my raised garden bed to make sure they got enough water, and protection from the gophers.  Still no luck.  I think I will stick with starting seeds from now on.  I'm tempted to buy one more Russian comfrey crown, and cage it top and root zone.  I think it's so much prettier than the other.
Who knows, might be something I do, or don't, maybe I planted to late for my zone?  I still appreciate your and Trace's kindness and generosity.

I'm a little shocked myself that yours didn't grow.  I can't really stop them from growing here, and you're the only person I have sent them to that had any trouble.  It may just be that your climate is a lot harder to get them going in, between the heat and the dryer conditions.  Crowns definitely establish faster, so you may have to use crowns to get going with them.  If you don't want to purchase more, if I were in your position I would give your plant a couple growing seasons to get established and then use a shovel and chop straight down through it into quarters, leave one, and plant the other three elsewhere.  When you pull out the three, you won't get all (or even most) of the roots, so those roots should grow more plants as well.  I have to say, I admire your tenacity :)

It's nearly spring here, I'm happy to send you a big crown if you want to try another one.

Anne Miller wrote:Gary, just a thought ...

If Jen tried to root the comfrey before planting would that help?

That way it seems it would be giving the comfrey a had start.

I've done both.  Rooting them before planting, and direct planting.  I recall a 75-90% success rate either way, so I no longer as a rule pre-root them, as it's an extra step without benefit.

Dear Peeps on the Comfrey Matter,

I hope that anyone having a slow start with comfrey will soon catch up. It's worth the wait. Some of my root cuttings never sprouted either, however the ones that did are nature's gift to gardeners and I just can't seem to get enough of them! Our baby orchard (3rd year) is a mess of weeds and we are on a mission to provide our trees with some helpful companions.

If anyone has extra root cuttings, crowns ( darn, I'll take pieces of stems with leaves! Sometimes you can propagate those too, I hear) I would love to trade! I have lots of wonderful stuff coming up this spring, including ramps, ginseng, alpine strawberries and thimbleberry to name just a few... Just tell me what you need:)

Best,

Naomi

Naomi have you tried growing from seed? The common comfrey isn't as pretty, but it will reseed itself.  I didn't have a great germination rate, but 2 did grow, and the one I left in the house is growing like crazy. Seeds are always so much cheaper than everything else.
I did keep them in the fridge for a couple of months. Before planting because I read they needed to be cold stratified.  Good luck to you.

Naomi Upland wrote:Dear Peeps on the Comfrey Matter,

I hope that anyone having a slow start with comfrey will soon catch up. It's worth the wait. Some of my root cuttings never sprouted either, however the ones that did are nature's gift to gardeners and I just can't seem to get enough of them! Our baby orchard (3rd year) is a mess of weeds and we are on a mission to provide our trees with some helpful companions.

If anyone has extra root cuttings, crowns ( darn, I'll take pieces of stems with leaves! Sometimes you can propagate those too, I hear) I would love to trade! I have lots of wonderful stuff coming up this spring, including ramps, ginseng, alpine strawberries and thimbleberry to name just a few... Just tell me what you need:)

Best,

Naomi

I can send you all the Comfrey root you need in a few weeks when the ground thaws. I love trades.

Thanks Jen and Trace for your replies!

Yes indeed I should consider seeds too.
I am concerned about invasiveness and was planning to stick to Bocking 14 only, but there are areas in the orchard that can use one invasive to fight another, ha ha!
Yes please Trace! let's trade when the ground thaws! In my zone 5, that should be sometime in late March!

Best to all,

Naomi

keep in mind that comfrey is a cold weather plant. like rhubarb it rarely does well above zone 7. its like a weed here in z3b and like rhubarb grows up though the last 6 in. of snow in april here. anytime it gets above 80f it wilts badly as does the rhubarb.

Naomi Upland wrote:
Yes please Trace! let's trade when the ground thaws! In my zone 5, that should be sometime in late March!

Best to all,

Naomi

Sounds great. I'll keep in touch.

Thanks Steve, that makes me feel better. The plant that survived is under is under a tree, it was heavily mulched, and I had to water often.  The common comfrey did better than the Russian.  The Russian wilted every afternoon in the summer.  
Thank you.

Now that the comfrey is done flowering it's growing the larger leaves comfrey is know for.  It's doing very well. I haven't had to water it very much. I will watch it closer now that the hot weather is here, but so far so good.  The comfrey I started from seed are alive and well.  Makes me want to try to start more seeds in late summer and plant them in the fall.  Maybe I can grow comfrey after all. Time will tell.

Jen, those look very healthy to me! May they live long and prosper!

I recently got TONS of comfrey root cuttings in a trade with Trace, and was able to plant nice circles around a bunch of our fruit trees. Thanks Trace
There is a spot in my garden where I had planted my first comfrey a couple of years ago and then pulled it out to move to the orchard. Well that spot continues to put out comfrey shoots as if there's some inexhaustible source in the soil itself This is in keeping with all that I've heard about the plant and is really a nice feeling to have something in the garden that doesn't fail me. I've had so many stupid, beginner "fails" in my garden. I'm going to check if there's a thread here on the topic where people can just purge/confess their failures... I have lots to contribute! Especially in the department of planting things in terrible spots and pulling out stuff that i planted thinking it was weeds ...

Cheers!

Naomi

Naomi Upland wrote:Jen, those look very healthy to me! May they live long and prosper!

I recently got TONS of comfrey root cuttings in a trade with Trace, and was able to plant nice circles around a bunch of our fruit trees. Thanks Trace
There is a spot in my garden where I had planted my first comfrey a couple of years ago and then pulled it out to move to the orchard. Well that spot continues to put out comfrey shoots as if there's some inexhaustible source in the soil itself This is in keeping with all that I've heard about the plant and is really a nice feeling to have something in the garden that doesn't fail me. I've had so many stupid, beginner "fails" in my garden. I'm going to check if there's a thread here on the topic where people can just purge/confess their failures... I have lots to contribute! Especially in the department of planting things in terrible spots and pulling out stuff that i planted thinking it was weeds ...

Cheers!

Naomi

You're very welcome.  I'm looking forward to grow reports.  Any issues, just send me a PM and I'll get more out to you.

Everything I got from you is doing great.  A few of the thimble berries got browsed badly but almost all recovered.  I have many, many new things growing thanks to you

Naomi I hope your comfrey grows well for you.  I'm sure you will find many post's about our many failures, misery loves company after all. You could also start your own if you like.  There's comfort in sharing our war stories.  I look forward to it.

I have had a very hard time with Comfrey. I have gotten comfrey roots twice from Trace, And once from Gary, I'm ashamed to even guess how many comfrey root I planted all over the place, and not one grew.  Talk about epic fail.  The one I have now was a crown I bought.  This year I started two from seed. So far they are doing well, but it's a long shot summer to get through, so we will see.  My hope is once it's established it won't be so hard to keep it alive.

All gardeners new or experienced have to deal with challenges. I don't know about you, but I tend to learn more from my failure than my success.  There's more to know then we can learn in a lifetime. Even if you you are the best tomato grower, and everyone you know thinks you're amazing, there's going to be that year mother nature kicks your feet out from under you, and have a lousy tomato yeald.  But as gardeners we stand up and do it again next year.  Why?  Why do we do it?  For those of us bitten by the garden bug, it's magical.  There's just nothing better than putting that tiny seed in the soil, watching it pop through the ground, grow leaves, flower, baby veggies, to something you can see the beauty of, smell, taste better than anything you have ever bought in the store. Magical.  Add extra triumph when it's something that has failed you again and again, and finally you get it to grow.  It makes you want to dance.  For a lot of us it's even deeper than that.  I find peace and inner joy in my garden. Magical

So true! I have definitely been bitten by the garden bug.
It  IS  magic.

The comfrey I grew from seed are doing well.  The one I planted by the new apple tree is doing very well. I worried about planting it there because it does get a bit of full sun. But it made it through a 8 or 9 day stretch of 105, didn't get watered every time, and still looks great, it bloomed.  The other one has been sadly neglected. I just planted it a few days ago.  It's alive in spite of spending it's life in a plastic cup.  

I'm definitely going to start more from seed.  I think I will start the seeds in late August. It's still quite warm in September and October, then it'll have all winter to establish itself.  I think it's worth a try.  I can't wait to have comfrey under every tree, and in my hugelkultur.  

Comfrey made it through the winter. Our unusually cold and rainy spring has slowed things down. The comfrey I started from seed last year is up and blooming.  The comfrey that was well established is just barely out of the ground.  My guess is because the one I started from seed gets a lot more sun, so maybe it warmed up the soil and got things going sooner.  
If you're worried about my comfrey spreading, at least so far I have had lots of flowers, and not one volunteer. I would be thrilled with a few volunteers.
I didn't get seeds going in August ( thought I still think that would be a good idea) I have started seeds this spring. I have had better luck this year. I started some inside with the same results, 2.  I put 10 seeds in a damp paper towel in a plastic ziplock bag. 10 in sand in a Ziploc bag. Both into the refrigerator for about a month.  The paper towels had sprouts, the sand did not. Then I planted all of them in a milk jug and put it outside.  I haven't opened it yet, but it looks like 5 or 6.  They are a lot smaller than what I started indoors, but I got a little better germination rate with this method.   Anyway I'm looking forward to planting more comfrey very soon.
Looking at the pictures I took it looks like something is munching on it.  I think I will put something around it to give it a shot.
Happy gardening

I've got comfrey in a pot right now but it's having trouble with the dryness of Florida and the heat.

Perhaps I will move it to partial shade.

I live in California zone 9 b. So far I have had the best luck planting in at least part shade. Mine seem to need to be watered regularly in the beginning. Once it's established it doesn't seem to need to be watered as much.  
Maybe someone else will confirm or deny, but I would think since comfrey has a tap root that it should be planted in the ground as soon as you can.  This is just what makes sense in my head. I'm definitely not an expert, or even good at growing comfrey. At this point I still worry over and baby my comfrey. I'm just happy I've finally managed to keep it alive.  
Good luck.

steve bossie from maine is bang on - i feel for you people in california and the like with your hot dry weather... it thrives ridiculously well here in cape breton... i have given it out to all sorts - no issues.. cool and wet == happy comfrey!!


water and shade is prob your best bet in hot climates.. best of luck!