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Wife doesn't want to homestead  RSS feed

 
Posts: 69
Location: upstate NY near MA/VT
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Great topic. I'm a mountain girl myself, and my husband, when he moved in after we were married 13 years ago, came from a town/city lifestyle. He sold his house in town and moved to the country. I owned this place already, and had a vision for where we would be today, which is pretty much accomplished. Making our homestead the beautiful space it is now required a lot of work on both our parts, but I held the vision, while he dragged his feet.

This went on for years, yet we managed to stay married. It was PAINFUL. Finally after 13 years he has joined in fully in the vision, and we can enjoy this place which requires a lot of work daily to maintain. Gardens, horses, llamas, fencing...trail clearing, cutting wood. We both also work so you can imagine. We also hosts woofers and permies each season to share what we know. I'm still in charge of the vision, the animal doctoring, the garden mulching as he hasn't fully learned what he needs to know, but he's getting there.

What I'm saying here is, the bottom line, in my opinion, has nothing to do with being married to a non-homesteader, but is more about the fact that the area you live in is unaffordable for the vision you carry. I suggest you look around farther than the next town, and find yourself a piece of land you can afford to purchase now while you have the funds and the vision. Continue to rent and know that you have your piece of land. What type of work do you do? Can you afford to find another job in the future?

You may or may not ever get to homestead it, but at least you will have your future plans in place. I can see why your wife is attached to her mom, especially with a toddler (does mom babysit?). Not having running water while building the homestead on a dime in an area where the land costs are out of your budget seems to me not financially feasible. Her attachment to her mom may never end, which leads you to your plan and your future. AND the future of your son, who will appreciate having an inheritance in the country.

You have made a critical decision that I fully agree with. You have decided to NOT GO INTO DEBT for a house you do not want. I know people who have done that for a spouse and regret it later as they are still paying for the house and their dreams are shattered. Hold onto your dream. You may or may not remain married in the long-term, but chances are your vision will remain. IF your wife never ever gets around to wanting to homestead, and you continue to carry your vision in the years going forward, you may part ways. It happens to the best of us.

I had to move away from mom finally for good at 29 years old. I disliked (hated) the town where I was raised (Lawton, OK) and relocated first to the West Coast, then to the great Northeast, where one can still afford to find land with water, grow gardens in the front yard, enjoy a wonderful organic movement, and get a good job. I have held my vision my entire life, and my first husband shared my vision. We split after 9 years, but I kept the land and house (and I paid the mortgage, he filed a quit claim). My husband of 13 years never had my vision, but yet here we are, living in the same place I originally bought with someone else. And in case you are interested, this place was not even remotely paid off, so I assumed the debt, and paid for it myself. My ex did not.

Follow your dream, and don't sell your soul. If you have a chance, find a house in the country in an affordable area and purchase it. The land/town with shady people where you live now may not be in your future.

Think outside the box. Find another job in a state where you can afford to follow your dream. Move forward with your vision.

Jules

Jules

 
Posts: 34
Location: Colorado
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It seems a lot of folk have said it without saying it.

Divorce is an amputation. It is horrible, painful, degrading, destructive, and humiliating. It's no better for the boy.

Divorce is horrible.

There is only one thing worse:

Compromising yourself to try to make your spouse happy - then getting divorced years later anyways.

There are lots of details that only you know, and it seems clear at least to me that your wife can't/won't have clear and candid conversations with you. Maybe you can't/won't with her, I don't know but....

The reality of homesteading will enlarge your relationship dynamic. If you are deeply and maturely in love, it will be magnified. If it is a petty, superficial relationship, it will be hell. I mean it, hell.

Dramatic turns like this (whatever the details) are a symptom of a very sick relationship. I don't necessarily see enough - but if the situation as you've described it is accurate, your marriage is over.

I'm serious. Massive changes in aspirations like this are totally incompatible - even if you band-aid it over, compromise, middle ground.... your marriage is poisoned.

She'll resent you - or you'll resent her - or you'll both resent each other - and some day it is going to explode in your face.

You really want to spend ten or twenty years dreading home? You want to pour yourself into something to have it taken from you years later?

My heart breaks for you - but looking at townhomes? She never wanted a homestead - homesteaders don't do that. While you've been dreaming of the timber frame, she's been going-along-to-get-along.

Either way, any way this goes - it ends in excruciating pain. You can decide how long, or you can have that decided for you.

That sucks brother. I hurt for you.
 
Jules Harrell
Posts: 69
Location: upstate NY near MA/VT
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Saying all women are bad and ruin lives is extreme. Obviously there are many women homesteaders leading the way. I do believe that partnership is critical, and its true we have all also seen dreams shattered as described. There is truth in almost everything written in this thread (with the exception of 'all women are bad'). The lessons are: Always hold onto your homestead dream, and be careful who you build your homestead dream with...
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Posts: 1424
Location: Zone 5 Wyoming
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I haven't read all of the replies.

People change. My husband and I were in agreement that we wanted 4 kids from the start. We have 2 and I'm done. Absolutely done. He still wants more and is baffled at how I just changed my mind like that. While I have my reasons  a lot of it is just that I have no urge for my kids at all either.

Perhaps she's been out in the country with you this long and has simply changed her view based on her experience. She has that right. Can you not homestead on an urban lot? Tons of people do.
 
elle sagenev
Posts: 1424
Location: Zone 5 Wyoming
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T. Gardner wrote:Our kid is still a toddler so a live in reno is not a good idea right now. On top of that every house that we look at that is around 30 minutes away from where we work is around 100k if you include reno costs in with the purchase price. At that price point it's do able if we could live in the house while fixin it up.

With that in mind I think the modular is our best bet, we just need the land to put it on and that's the bottleneck right now. Raw land is going 5-10k an acre right now...when it does come up for sale.



Pfft. My 3 year old was swinging a hammer and helping me demolish walls. Toddlers are only obstructions if you let them be.
 
Spencer Miles
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elle sagenev wrote:I haven't read all of the replies.

People change. My husband and I were in agreement that we wanted 4 kids from the start. We have 2 and I'm done. Absolutely done. He still wants more and is baffled at how I just changed my mind like that. While I have my reasons  a lot of it is just that I have no urge for my kids at all either.

Perhaps she's been out in the country with you this long and has simply changed her view based on her experience. She has that right. Can you not homestead on an urban lot? Tons of people do.



"She has that right." Any marriage concerned with "rights" over the other is dead.

Funny how "marriage" has been converted to Her Rights and his duties.

Changing the mind... changing the mind... Is it her "right" to decide "...in sickness..." didn't matter - that she didn't really mean it? Rights Rights Rights...

Why bother believing anyone, why faith, why trust...

Fickle. Subordinating your mate because you have a "right" to be inconsistent. Right to lie. Right to betray. Right to condescend. Right to manipulate. Right to demand. Right to nag. Right to cheat. Rights, rights, rights.

HE should change to the urban lot (though he already owns a lot, and has been working on it) because SHE changed her mind.

Yep - HE has to adjust to HER - like the weather. Consistency means nothing, loyalty means nothing. Keep your wife by doing everything SHE wants - then pay alimony/child-support anyways.

Compromise yourself to keep a woman - you'll loose both.

Commitment, consistency, trustworthiness?

Nahh... SHE has the RIGHT to change her mind.

Husbands. Are. Not. Accessories.
 
Posts: 29
Location: Rural Unincorporated Los Angeles County
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D. Logan wrote:Well, I'd say you two need to sit down together and talk out exactly what is at the core of her feelings. If it is only that one town specifically, then it almost certainly is family. If it is just any town, then maybe it is something else. Maybe she's worried about her mother needing someone close for example. Would a mother-in-law cabin be an option? Something where you offer a small home on your property where her mother could stay free of rent and where your wife could stop in regularly to ensure she remains safe and healthy? If it was an option, it could offer a means of compromise.



This is such sound advice!
Look for common ground.
Find a compromise.

We built a tiny house for my Mom and she lived with us for 8 years before needing convalescent care for her dementia.
 
elle sagenev
Posts: 1424
Location: Zone 5 Wyoming
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Oh boy! Someone has a grudge against women.

Tons of people DO homestead on urban lots. If homesteading is his dream he can still do it. He doesn't have to get rid of his wife to do it.

Are you saying if you make a decision when you are young you have to stick to it for all eternity? Because you do realize that with age and experience our ideals change. We change. That isn't a bad thing. I don't think it is at least. My husband and I married when I was 18 and he 22. We've been married almost 15 years now. We've both changed with our experiences and adjusted to each other and those changes. I'm still blissfully happy with my husband even through it all. I would happily change again for him and he for me.

Spencer Miles wrote:

elle sagenev wrote:I haven't read all of the replies.

People change. My husband and I were in agreement that we wanted 4 kids from the start. We have 2 and I'm done. Absolutely done. He still wants more and is baffled at how I just changed my mind like that. While I have my reasons  a lot of it is just that I have no urge for my kids at all either.

Perhaps she's been out in the country with you this long and has simply changed her view based on her experience. She has that right. Can you not homestead on an urban lot? Tons of people do.



"She has that right." Any marriage concerned with "rights" over the other is dead.

Funny how "marriage" has been converted to Her Rights and his duties.

Changing the mind... changing the mind... Is it her "right" to decide "...in sickness..." didn't matter - that she didn't really mean it? Rights Rights Rights...

Why bother believing anyone, why faith, why trust...

Fickle. Subordinating your mate because you have a "right" to be inconsistent. Right to lie. Right to betray. Right to condescend. Right to manipulate. Right to demand. Right to nag. Right to cheat. Rights, rights, rights.

HE should change to the urban lot (though he already owns a lot, and has been working on it) because SHE changed her mind.

Yep - HE has to adjust to HER - like the weather. Consistency means nothing, loyalty means nothing. Keep your wife by doing everything SHE wants - then pay alimony/child-support anyways.

Compromise yourself to keep a woman - you'll loose both.

Commitment, consistency, trustworthiness?

Nahh... SHE has the RIGHT to change her mind.

Husbands. Are. Not. Accessories.

 
pollinator
Posts: 1951
Location: Toronto, Ontario
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I think it's easy to feel hurt when someone changes their mind in such a drastic way. I don't think it's necessary to vilify anyone.

To remain consistent, though, I think it's necessary to point out that women have already been treated as accessories at best, or some hybrid of a house and sex slave at worst, at some point of time in history. I think it's wrong to treat anyone that way, husband, wife, or non-gender-binary spouse.

To become incensed that the shoe is on the other foot sometimes is silly, to my mind.

Husbands aren't accessories any more than wives are accessories; let's not treat either as such.

On the flip side, husbands and wives are merely incomplete halves of a partnership. I think that's the necessary view in such a partnership. If it's not equal, it's not going to be a healthy exchange.

If I felt that I was in any way slipping, I think I would man up and make sure my responsibilities are all taken care of, and then address the situation with her. If the general feeling is that I value my lazy time drinking beer in front of the TV too much, and I have, in the past, or if, say, gaming takes up too much of my time, even if I am keeping up my end financially and whatnot, perhaps I need to reevaluate my priorities.

Why do I want to escape into beer and fantasy? Why don't I want to be present when we're together?

I think people hook up too soon, put on false fronts when courting, and then the lies all come bare in the light of day. Let's be honest, with ourselves first, and then with prospective partners.

Personally, I don't believe in divorce. I think it results from a failure of a willingness to try. But the traditional husband-as-breadwinner role, where all he did was work his job and the wife kept the house and did everything else isn't realistic, and never was, really. It persists now in some demographics, even in two-income households, because that's the way some people are raised.

People aren't the roles they're expected to play; they're people. Let's be aware of how our actions, or inactions, in the short- and long-term, make the other in our lives feel, and let's eschew the traditional expectations, discarding them for mutual respect and honest communication.

To be with someone means that they are the priority in your life, and you are the priority in theirs. If this isn't the case, there shouldn't be a committed, long-term relationship until this develops.

-CK
 
pollinator
Posts: 139
Location: Southern Finland
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I think there's a difference between honestly and openly changing your mind and "changing your mind" when you really weren't that into something in the first place. I can't tell what we are talking about here as I don't know the OP or his wife. Come to think of it, I can't always tell the difference even when it's the case of someone I DO know (or have supposedly known in my the past).

I think honestly and openly changing your mind is totally okay and everyone has the right to do so - man and woman, married and single.

I think hiding the fact that you're really not that into something and then, when the time comes to make the move, saying you changed your mind is not the best way to a healthy relationship. I'm sure we've all done that, I know I probably have, just to please someone. But it never works out that great.
 
pollinator
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My gut reaction is that you told her homesteading and she agreed, saying yes hubby I can envision our wonderful house and we will be living in it in 24months. You said yes, then afterwards you said we will have to live in a TENT/HUT for the next 12years, defecating in a bucket, until we finish the house. And then the problems started.

But that is just my gut reaction so ignore it instead,
I would make a list of what your needs are and what her needs are, by having some dialogue with her.

Your needs:
To enjoy the process of slowly building the perfect homestead with all the options.
To not owe any money
To not be too close to the MOM
To not be too close to the "horrible" city
To enjoy your wive's company
To enjoy the "farming/husbandry" portion of homesteading.

Her needs:
To be close enough to help out her mom
To enjoy your company
To have a regular house soon vs living in a CAVE HUT, while you build it

So it seems like most people she loves the idea of not owing any money, being semi-retired young.
But she also sees that her mom is getting older and her mom health is no longer at the SUPERWOMAN level.
She also like the idea of eating healthy/organic food that you grow (who doesn't).
But it is possible that she doesn't want to join you in killing a hog
And maybe you don't want to join her in cleaning the toilet (just saying Division of labor)

So
1) She want to be close to help her aging mom
2) She wants to have a quick transition to a real house not just your tent/yurt while you build.
3) She might not actually want to be in a pig pen cleaning hog shit with you, even if she loves cooking the pork shoulder once you are done

Possible compromise:
1) Move as close as possible to town without actually being in the town
2a) Figure out how much time she is willing to wait to have a house vs a tent/yurt/hut
2b) Figure out how you could build a house in that timeframe.
2c) Maybe buy/build the cheapest/fastest house and then slowly build your dream house while also paying mortgage.
3a) Figure out how much actually work you have to do and how much she has to do for this homesteading to happen
3b) Figure out how of that work she is actually willing to do, and then you do the difference
3c) You could use machine or hired help or pre-made stuff to make up the difference
 
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This thread seems to be all over the place however I cant seem to figure out what or where the problem is. Very confusing.
 
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Angelika Maier wrote:
What is your more important dream building a house or a market garden?


Now that is the right question!

In my youth, I was a hopeless dreamer. I had so many mutually-exclusive dreams, even I couldn't keep them all straight. As I got older, one thing I learned is that the tree of dreams is best maintained with just a few trunks, not as a multistemmed shrub. I had to sift through all those dreams and pick which ones were (1) most important, and (2) doable.

I never had a partner, but on those occasions when I attempted to look for one, one of my considerations was: are this person's dreams compatible with mine. So, as you are sorting out your dreams to determine priorities, I suggest that your wife do the same with hers. When you can both clearly articulate what is most important to you, you will have a starting point to work out how you can best move forward together.
 
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Life is short, Think about it this way, if you did go the 30yr mortgage, the payments for a homestead in Carolonas might be $1600 a month or more. If you get an investment plan and sink that much money, in 15 years you will likely have $300,000 plus to put down on your dream.
 
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I think it probably takes about ten years of living with some one to know them. When you get married, you're signing up for all the surprises that person is going to bring. So I wonder, what are your wife's dreams?...

Be a team, sit down, and affirm that you are for eachother and not against eachother. Then negotiate. How can you help eachother reach your dreams?
 
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