• Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic
permaculture forums growies critters building homesteading energy monies kitchen purity ungarbage community wilderness fiber arts art permaculture artisans regional education skip experiences global resources cider press projects digital market permies.com pie forums private forums all forums
this forum made possible by our volunteer staff, including ...
master stewards:
  • Anne Miller
  • Pearl Sutton
stewards:
  • r ranson
  • paul wheaton
  • Beau M. Davidson
master gardeners:
  • John F Dean
  • Timothy Norton
  • Nancy Reading
  • Carla Burke
  • Jay Angler
  • Christopher Weeks
gardeners:
  • Tina Wolf
  • Saana Jalimauchi
  • thomas rubino

Permaculture Conservancy?

 
Posts: 55
10
  • Likes 5
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Several of us have been talking about what we see as the need in the permaculture community for some sort of permaculture land conservancy that would enable permaculture sites to be protected from future development.

We are all busy developing sites that are planned for the long term, are based on perennials, and are oriented towards developing a long term, regenerative culture (aka permanent culture). We are also, for the most part designing our sites with trees as major design elements, many of whom will not come into maturity until long after the site has passed from our hands.

In addition, we have a generation of permaculture elders, many of whom are, in fact, elders, who have established/developed sites that may be at risk for development when they pass on.

So what we were thinking is that we need a way for our sites to be protected from development, and continued to be managed as permaculture sites, down the years --something like the way land trusts/conservancies do.

What conservancy-type land trusts usually do is to have a mechanism for receiving development rights to a piece of property. They then take responsibility for making sure that no development occurs on that property over time and as it changes owners. We think that it would be pretty easy to do the same type of thing for permaculture sites.

What do other people think? Do you think there is a need for this? If so, would you be interested in helping to make it happen? Is there already something like that out there?

I apologise if there is already a thread about this, and I would love to be directed to it if there is.
 
Posts: 1
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Bumping an old thread here. I'm trying to do exactly what you're describing Deb. Would love to involve you and/or any other interested parties. To anyone who would like to be involved, please PM me.
 
pollinator
Posts: 1755
Location: Denver, CO
119
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
This is a great idea.
 
pollinator
Posts: 11853
Location: Central Texas USA Latitude 30 Zone 8
1250
cat forest garden fish trees chicken fiber arts wood heat greening the desert
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I am personally very interested in this concept because I have a parcel of land I would like to have conserved.

Here's another thread pertaining to this idea: https://permies.com/t/55698/permaculture/Continuity-Operations-Permaculture
 
Posts: 10
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
It seems that using standard conservancy covenants should accomplish this goal for nature preserve sections. (But if anyone has experience to the contrary it would be good to examine the details of any problems with that approach.)

To take that a step further, I have been thinking specific permaculture Zone covenants might be useful. For example, as mentioned above, if you want your Zone 5 to remain as such in perpetuity, could you have conservancy lawyer draw up a land preservation document called "Zone 5 covenant?" That seems like it would be a straight-forward, standard nature preservation covenant.

But I wonder about a more mixed-use Zone 4 or 3 covenant, where you would use the language of the covenant to spell out how much land remains in trees, under canopy or whatever goal is. I don't know the answer to that today, but it seems that using well-recognized permaculture land stewardship concepts could make conservancy covenants more robust.

The laws on drawing up land conservation covenants vary by jurisdiction, and landowners many only have so much leeway in some cases to tailor a covenant to their achieve their goals. But what are your thoughts on this approach?
 
Deb Berman
Posts: 55
10
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Thanks everybody for contributing to this conversation. I'm so glad other people are interested!

Our idea to date on the covenants is that each site being protected would have a permaculture design registered with the permaculture conservancy (which we've tentatively named The Permaculture Conservation Trust). The design would have all the usual zones, sectors, species inventory, and everything else a good design has. Proposed changes to the design would be submitted to the Trust, and if accepted, would be registered with the original design. There would also be a management plan.

Part of the job of the conservancy would be to go around and check to make sure that what’s going on in the site corresponds to what’s in the design and management plans, so that when the property changes hands after the original site designer leaves it, the site and its design continue to be protected.



I would like to get everybody who is interested in a permaculture conservancy working together to make it happen ASAP. Maybe we could pull together an email list of folks who would like to do this.

Our group that has been working on this has a Board of Directors, an almost-final draft of bylaws, and a draft of a conflict of interest policy. We are almost ready to incorporate, and then the next step will be to apply for federal nonprofit status. We can be a national organization, but we have to register in each state that we are operating in. So anyone who wants to join us in making this happen can, regardless of where in the US they are. (Our bylaws allow us to meet electronically).

We could use more people for the Board of Directors; also we could use a webmaster/social media person or persons, and someone to handle crowdfunding.

I am very interested to hear how the those of you who have been working on this have been thinking about it and where you have gotten with it so far. I would love to be able to join forces and make a really good organization that meets the needs of the permaculture community.
 
R Thomason
Posts: 10
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Sounds good. Seems that some of the well-established conservancies, both local and national, might be interested in some sort of partnership as time goes by.
 
Posts: 712
95
cat forest garden trees solar wood heat woodworking
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
bump.

Also I am highly interested and began to work out something similar for Germany.
There is one point that where I'm somewhat sceptic: Big organization attract parasites (some of them are politicians).

I would prefer to distribute the power. Maybe with the following model:
One institution would take the responsibility to work out the juridical template for smaller trusts and create a "big trust". (compare to Mollisons' "good trust".)

Then each community would create a small trust that they manage themselves. They take the template that the big trust provides and follows the steps in the manual (to be written).
The land that this community lives and operates on, belongs to their trust.
Their trust document contains the rules of permaculture and their own additions. Possibly also a statement that if they fail to follow their own rules, the land goes to the big trust and they can tell them what to do.
If this does not work, it is redistributed to others.

This would allow the communities to make changes to the design that are in agreement with their trust document. So we avoid the "big brother" here. It probably also makes things easier.
The "big trust" would only have to work when something goes wrong. It would also collect money and land that is then given to local communities.
 
Posts: 7
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Greetings Deb & folks, is your permaculture land trust nonprofit up & running? I'd love to be in touch to learn from your model as we figure out how to protect our permaculture teaching & learning farm in the future. Many thanks, Lisa of woodland harvest mtn farm

 
pollinator
Posts: 808
Location: Central Virginia USA
77
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I have been listening to Bill Mollisons tapes from a 1983 class, and he spends about 1/3 of his time talking about just this concept, although he goes a few steps further.

I like his ideas about setting up a non profit and a for profit company simultaneously, the for profit donating all it's earnings to the non profit each year to avoid taxes, the non profit set up to educate and sponsor Permaculture projects.

I have had these tapes for about a year, listening to them almost daily, and he covers the normal stuff--zones, sectors, trees, water, etc., and for a long time I would simply avoid all the complicated stuff about associations, and incorporations because it rattled my brain. it was easier to simply plan a dam and swale and all the plantings and such than to even start an association (or even understand why I would start one.)

But the end result in his legal planning becomes an untaxed, ever growing entity, protected in law and more or less immortal.

The catch here is that all this rhetoric and information is based on Australian Law from 40 years ago. As I gather my wits (after having my brain rattled ) more and more I'm starting to investigate just how applicable his meticulous plans and legal structures might be. (finding this thread was the result of a google search looking for existing documents on these principles.

He talks about "arming ourselves with the armor of the invincible" , and how all the big boys use these strategies to get over on the legal system, while all us uneducated(legally) peons plod along and subsidize their enterprises with our tax dollars.

He also was the one who had to coerce Geoff Lawton to set up his own institute, and of course Geoff has done nothing but grow and branch out.

Basically here most of what I'm doing is bumping an old thread, looking for others who may know more, and especially for others who may have already mastered these strategies and might want to share their trust documents. It costs a bit initially to get these set up, legal wording in contracts can be a bit pricey from a competent /sympathetic lawyer, but once the wording is in place copying it is cheap--Bill used to sell his trust documents for 10$, and they may still be available, but would likely need to be translated to the laws of the United States. If anyone has seen these documents, I'd love to hear about them.
 
Tyler Ludens
pollinator
Posts: 11853
Location: Central Texas USA Latitude 30 Zone 8
1250
cat forest garden fish trees chicken fiber arts wood heat greening the desert
  • Likes 4
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

bob day wrote: If anyone has seen these documents, I'd love to hear about them.



You might try contacting the Permaculture Research Institute to see if they can share copies of the original documents.

Address: 1158 Pinchin Rd, The Channon NSW 2480, Australia
Phone: +61 416 119 965

Contact Us
Phone:
+61 (0) 2 6688 6578 The office is currently unattended, please either leave a voicemail or email office@permaculturenews.org

E-Mail:
General Enquiries
office@permaculturenews.org

Not sure which phone number might work....
 
pollinator
Posts: 3847
Location: Marmora, Ontario
583
4
hugelkultur dog forest garden fungi trees rabbit urban wofati cooking bee homestead
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I think a Permaculturally-aligned Land Conservancy program is a great idea.

I was recently informed of a government land management program here in Ontario, which may or may not still be accepting applicants, that offered land taxation breaks or other incentives for what they call aforestation, which to me sounds like amorality or atheism, the absence of a thing, but apparently is the term they use for returning land that used to be forest in the past but has spent some time being not forest back to productive forest once again. The catch that threw most potential applicants was the stipulation that the land not be logged for 100 years.

I must admit that it gave me pause as well. I mean, no selective cutting, even? I love the sentiment, but for it to be practical, that 100 year thing would have to be a strong guideline with a set of exemptions, and a solid metric for identifying new ones.

A permaculture conservancy might also go a similar route, though, in terms of not simply reserving and preserving, but reclaiming, remediating, and returning spent, abused, or marginal lands to some sort of ecological support function, even if just pollinator habitat and erosion control. It is the sort of organisation that would benefit many urban and periurban organisations concerned with the fate of wild pollinators and honeybee habitat, for instance, or land stewardship groups whose foci are hunters and game fishers, outdoors enthusiasts, bird-watchers, or skijorers. This isn't an exhaustive list by any means.

It could also be a vehicle for guiding and informing land-use under the Conservancy, opening some opportunities for groups and individuals who could benefit from permaculturally-aligned eco-tourism and profit-generating land-use models to choose innovative new models and patterns for their land, increasing their operational budgets to allow for more return to themselves and the land, and to the Conservancy, who might offer ongoing assistance by connecting people looking for Permaculture getaways and jobs with those operations that need them, like a boosted, vetted woofer program and a travel brochure all in one.

So people get the Conservancy model to work with, permaculture help, business model help for those that need it, and that landowner and landuser connectivity, and the Conservancy gets some kickback from sites using their services, and the permaculture prion gets spread to more brains.

This is a good idea, and has many different possible iterations. I hope we can see more developments in this sphere.

-CK
 
bob day
pollinator
Posts: 808
Location: Central Virginia USA
77
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
thanks for the reference  Tyler, I've thought about that different times, since the trust documents used to be sold regularly,


there would be a great deal to change without doubt, but parts of it might be useful. Corporation law varies widely from state to state in the US, so one size doesn't fit all, but it might save some time if i hire a lawyer  to figure it out.


 
Posts: 39
Location: Just south of Dallas Texas
4
3
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
This is second hand knowledge  so take it as you will.
With that said my little brothers father has a farm in N.J. about 200 acres that was put into conservancy by my brothers grandfather.
Now it can be nothing except a farm or let go native.
My brother has no desire to be a farmer of any kind and doesn't want the home or property for several reasons. One is the home is in disrepair and would take large sums of money to make right and the taxes on the property are very high of it isn't producing an income.
What I am basically saying is be cautious with the conservancy route as is is very restrictive on what can be done with the property.
 
bob day
pollinator
Posts: 808
Location: Central Virginia USA
77
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Curt, You make a good point about a possible pitfall of a conservancy as it might be normally set up.  A good conservancy will/ trust would name a secondary trust/ foundation that would inherit the land and preserve it if your brother was unwilling/ unable to take responsibility for it.

I'd like to set up a trust that was more in the public domain even before I die, so there are more people with similar ideals participating and willing to enjoy and nurture the land I saved back from the cycle of clear cutting every 10-20 years. My own son is off making his own life, and I'd like to make a provision that he would always be welcome to participate should he ever choose to do so. Primarily though my land is a vehicle for changing ideas and life patterns to more productive and less damaging ones, not just a nest egg my son inherits and squanders.

Tyler, I sent an email to the address  office@permaculturenews.org and got back a nice note

Hi Bob,

Yes a lot has changed but Trusts are a popular way of managing estates.

You would need to seek out a local expert I believe and we don't actually have the material that you would be referring to I'm sorry.

Kind regards,


Darren Hey

PA to Geoff and Nadia Lawton

Personnel Manager Zaytuna Farm

Permaculture Research Institute



I'm guessing those documents would have been property of Tagari publications, which was Bill's creation, but the general idea of seeking local counsel is likely a watch word here. and the original trust documents from long ago could only be a starting point for a consultation, not a fill in the blank finished legal document.

A lawyer owns the property next door, and I may end up buying it from him, but for now I plan to float some of these ideas past him and see what he thinks. No reason he couldn't give some of his acres as a tax write off to a non profit next door, and then be allowed continuing access if he ever wanted to come back. The real hope is that he can refer me to a good trust lawyer who can set the whole thing up.


 
Posts: 4
1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Many of us are or have probably been members of the Nature Conservancy.

They are very effective at land preservation and trust and have this down to a science.  they welcome all levels of community, government and industry coming to them to settle ecological and land use differences. they set up diverse land trust, many different types, most all with local leadership in the are of compliance. I bet they would extend their trust services to those moving this direction. In the past they did not have to be a beneficiary of the property being entrusted. they also know about managing a trust and the difficulties that arise from poor writing and planning. We could learn much from them, not work as hard as we might, not make a lot of mistakes and get a good start as a result.

Well you get the idea.  Would they mentor this direction by this new Perma-culture Trust, as we are a sister organization? Board members could reach out and see.
 
bob day
pollinator
Posts: 808
Location: Central Virginia USA
77
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Thanks for the tip, I had no idea the Nature Conservancy offered others that sort of help, My own efforts were put on a back burner with so much else going on, but I'll make an initial contact and see about getting the ball rolling.
 
pollinator
Posts: 552
Location: Nomadic
47
  • Likes 3
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Bumping this thread.
Bob, how has you investigation into a permaculture aligned land conservancy been going? I’ve only just begun doing my homework on land trust conservancies but have saved a couple nuggets of information from the past. A friend joined OPAL (Orcas People and Land a community land trust)  years ago and it worked for him to secure a nice new affordable home for his family on a expensive island with skyrocketing prices. He holds a 99 year residential lease from the OPAL trust. Well, the members of OPAL told me there was a grant for $50,000 to have lawyers create the bylaws for the community. I have copies in my storage. They told me one of the stipulations for the big grant was that the bylaws were to be made available to other forming land trusts. Might these be of use? Or perhaps other bylaws are available. Are bylaws essentially the same as covenants mentioned earlier in this thread? I’m interested in the 99 year lease concept from a trust to do permaculture. We can even fund the trust to purchase the land and facilities. I’m just not sure where to start or how to go absolutely it. Maybe there’s another way to do it. I was offered funds that have to go to a charity.  Should I start a new thread?? Thanks.

 
bob day
pollinator
Posts: 808
Location: Central Virginia USA
77
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Jeremy, good to hear from you.  Unfortunately I have been grossly distracted by several personal matters, and while the land trust idea is still important I've had little energy to follow through with it. By laws would certainly be important, and might be transferrable from state to state, and I would certainly be interested in having that copy to research to see what is entailed there.  ramdai@juno.com

The last I did was to look at offerings from this organization-   Center for Nonprofit Excellence (CNE) promotes excellence through training and executive education for nonprofits in Charlottesville and Central Virginia. Charlottesville, VA 22903 434.244.3330 staff@thecne.org. Office Hours. In-Person: Mon - Thurs: 9:00 AM - 5:00 PM Remote: Fri: 9:00 AM - 4:00 PM.

Much of what they offer is training, and most courses looked pretty involved, so I never really followed through, maybe when I get things a little more under control.

I have hesitated to a certain extent simply because of wavering interest and/or the lack of dependable people. About the time when it looks like young people are around that might want to do something, suddenly they are gone. No sense tying up property in something that doesn't have enough public support.

 
Jeremy Baker
pollinator
Posts: 552
Location: Nomadic
47
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Hi Bob, I can relate to being preoccupied with personal matters. Perhaps that’s why this thread is not very active? Readers, if you are not interested or able to participate in a permaculture conservancy may I ask why? Would anyone be interested in a 99 renewable year lease on a permaculture conservancy holding? If it makes doing permaculture more affordable would that help? What am I missing here? It seems this might be a more active subject!
Bob, I’ll look at the Center for Non profit Excellence. However I’m looking for the most barebones stripped-down model to instigate permaculture conservancy at this time. But perhaps a Non Profit training would be a good wintertime activity while I’m in limbo.
 Currently we are at a stage where a Non-Profit called On Sacred Ground Land Conservancy is considering being a “fiscal sponsor” for us to help place a property in the OSGLC permaculture land conservancy. I’m not sure what a fiscal sponsor is exactly so looking that up next. I think it’s so they can recieve the funds to buy the property as we don’t have it yet.
 What I’m hoping to do with the funds is place a property in a permaculture aligned conservancy and build a permaculture research office and facility. Nothing to fancy. Probably a shop or garage-like multipurpose building converted to office and utility space. The land would be a permaculture plant trial and propagation center with a seed bank also.
 Perhaps once the busines of the center are established some volunteers could take the training program from the Non Profit Excellence Center. Then perhaps they could get paid a small salary if it grew into a large organization.
 
master steward
Posts: 14084
Location: USDA Zone 8a
3901
dog hunting food preservation cooking bee greening the desert
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
My suggestion for anyone who is serious about wanting to do this is to get in touch with an attorney whose specialty is in drawing up trusts.

Maybe there are organizations that have attorneys on board who do this sort of trust.  If so then the organization would need to be in your state so that their attorneys are familiar with trust laws in your state.
 
Jeremy Baker
pollinator
Posts: 552
Location: Nomadic
47
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Anne,
I wonder if a Trust Lawyer could take the free $50,000 bylaws I mentioned in previous post and modify them for a reduced fee to fit the new Trust?. I’m concerned about duplicating legal work that may be available free somewhere.
Ok, here’s a idea. Perhaps Paul could get the Executive Treasurer or President of a Trust on the forum to answer questions. Or the author of a book on Trusts?? Or a Trust lawyer?
 
Anne Miller
master steward
Posts: 14084
Location: USDA Zone 8a
3901
dog hunting food preservation cooking bee greening the desert
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I have no idea what you are talking about.

Maybe quotes might point me in the right direction.
 
Jeremy Baker
pollinator
Posts: 552
Location: Nomadic
47
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Jeremy Baker wrote:Bumping this thread.
Bob, how has you investigation into a permaculture aligned land conservancy been going? I’ve only just begun doing my homework on land trust conservancies but have saved a couple nuggets of information from the past. A friend joined OPAL (Orcas People and Land a community land trust)  years ago and it worked for him to secure a nice new affordable home for his family on a expensive island with skyrocketing prices. He holds a 99 year residential lease from the OPAL trust. Well, the members of OPAL told me there was a grant for $50,000 to have lawyers create the bylaws for the community. I have copies in my storage. They told me one of the stipulations for the big grant was that the bylaws were to be made available to other forming land trusts. Might these be of use? Or perhaps other bylaws are available. Are bylaws essentially the same as covenants mentioned earlier in this thread? I’m interested in the 99 year lease concept from a trust to do permaculture. We can even fund the trust to purchase the land and facilities. I’m just not sure where to start or how to go absolutely it. Maybe there’s another way to do it. I was offered funds that have to go to a charity.  Should I start a new thread?? Thanks.



Anne. I’m not sure how to do quotes but managed to move this previous comment
 
Posts: 487
43
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Charles E. Young wrote:Many of us are or have probably been members of the Nature Conservancy.

They are very effective at land preservation and trust and have this down to a science.  they welcome all levels of community, government and industry coming to them to settle ecological and land use differences. they set up diverse land trust, many different types, most all with local leadership in the are of compliance. I bet they would extend their trust services to those moving this direction. In the past they did not have to be a beneficiary of the property being entrusted. they also know about managing a trust and the difficulties that arise from poor writing and planning. We could learn much from them, not work as hard as we might, not make a lot of mistakes and get a good start as a result.

Well you get the idea.  Would they mentor this direction by this new Perma-culture Trust, as we are a sister organization? Board members could reach out and see.



Beware of land conservancy through The Nature Conservancy!

https://www.agenda21course.com/tag/the-nature-conservancy/
 
bob day
pollinator
Posts: 808
Location: Central Virginia USA
77
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Here's the steps Bill talks about  in the 1983 class--remember this is Austrailia 40 years ago, so laws and procedures may be different.--probably are different

1-start an association and register it- no great paperwork involved, should be near free-- if you can register one in your state/county-  the association involves no real commitment on the part of members, just establishing a community of like minded people. The association will help to guide the offerings of your trust to the community and also act as a labor pool. Permaculture lectures/presentations, setting up gardens in private yards, reduce lawns, increase trees and diversity, all sorts of community projects that can get you firmly established so any extra legal paperwork you do has real world support, not just idle dreams.  You may not need to register the association to legally obtain the non profit status, but if your state has that sort of category do it, even if it's not absolutely required.

2. find a couple friends to be on the board of directors--people you trust- number may differ according to state laws. do the minimum necessary -draw up a mission statement-remember this is a non profit, so emphasis on giving to the public good. get a treasurer and secretary, keep scrupulous financial records that will be monitored closely by the state- assuming you achieve non profit status. Those by laws you have <Jessie> might be useful, if you can, send a copy to me with an email attachment.

3. Set up a for profit company to handle all enterprises and take all risks. this company off sets it's  profit taxes by donating earnings back to the non profit.

vehicles   are risks so should be owned by either individuals or the for profit company. keep non profit assets out of harms way. your profit company should always carry as little material wealth as possible so rent furniture, office space, etc from the non profit, any attacks on the for profit  company will come up mostly empty handed.

real estate - houses- best in the non profit section.

Remember that non profit status means people can donate land for a tax write off, so if you don't already have land, don't worry,  sincerity and good works will show a way.

Permaculture Research institutes are always a good way to go, establishing a church has extra tax benefits.  I really have come to appreciate Nature as a religion, that deepens the more I experience the wonder and order of the natural world. I understand there are a couple of these sorts of churches in different places, but have not yet found an established one--just latching on to that paperwork might also expedite your process.

remember, we really are in this to advance the cause of sustainability which is in the public good, so this is not just a scam. It is however a good tool that has been misused consistently by bigger players for questionable ends.

Bill talks about these techniques as if they are weapons of war being consistently used against the normal working class, so he talks about arming ourselves with the same tools only for legitimate public welfare.

See if there are any lawyers who may sympathize with this cause and help pro bono or maybe reduced rates

and I decided long ago the Nature Conservancy was really almost a scam, what with dues and such.  It does promote growing the number of acres of conserved land, but many of us will have better progress/more direct control running our own trusts

One final thought, The time and geography of Bills instructions are likely worlds away from current requirements, There will likely be some basic, and very important procedures that must be consistently adhered to, A lawyer from your area will likely be your best insurance when setting up any trusts, it probably wouldn't hurt to plan on a professional tax accountant for at least a couple years just to make sure you're doing it right.  This can be a useful way to maximize your resources and organize your community if it's done right,  

TAKE YOUR TIME      BUILD A GOOD FOUNDATION,
 
Ted Abbey
Posts: 487
43
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

bob day wrote:Here's the steps Bill talks about  in the 1983 class--remember this is Austrailia 40 years ago, so laws and procedures may be different.--probably are different

1-start an association and register it- no great paperwork involved, should be near free-- if you can register one in your state/county-  the association involves no real commitment on the part of members, just establishing a community of like minded people. The association will help to guide the offerings of your trust to the community and also act as a labor pool. Permaculture lectures/presentations, setting up gardens in private yards, reduce lawns, increase trees and diversity, all sorts of community projects that can get you firmly established so any extra legal paperwork you do has real world support, not just idle dreams.  You may not need to register the association to legally obtain the non profit status, but if your state has that sort of category do it, even if it's not absolutely required.

2. find a couple friends to be on the board of directors--people you trust- number may differ according to state laws. do the minimum necessary -draw up a mission statement-remember this is a non profit, so emphasis on giving to the public good. get a treasurer and secretary, keep scrupulous financial records that will be monitored closely by the state- assuming you achieve non profit status. Those by laws you have <Jessie> might be useful, if you can, send a copy to me with an email attachment.

3. Set up a for profit company to handle all enterprises and take all risks. this company off sets it's  profit taxes by donating earnings back to the non profit.

vehicles   are risks so should be owned by either individuals or the for profit company. keep non profit assets out of harms way. your profit company should always carry as little material wealth as possible so rent furniture, office space, etc from the non profit, any attacks on the for profit  company will come up mostly empty handed.

real estate - houses- best in the non profit section.

Remember that non profit status means people can donate land for a tax write off, so if you don't already have land, don't worry,  sincerity and good works will show a way.

Permaculture Research institutes are always a good way to go, establishing a church has extra tax benefits.  I really have come to appreciate Nature as a religion, that deepens the more I experience the wonder and order of the natural world. I understand there are a couple of these sorts of churches in different places, but have not yet found an established one--just latching on to that paperwork might also expedite your process.

remember, we really are in this to advance the cause of sustainability which is in the public good, so this is not just a scam. It is however a good tool that has been misused consistently by bigger players for questionable ends.

Bill talks about these techniques as if they are weapons of war being consistently used against the normal working class, so he talks about arming ourselves with the same tools only for legitimate public welfare.

See if there are any lawyers who may sympathize with this cause and help pro bono or maybe reduced rates

and I decided long ago the Nature Conservancy was really almost a scam, what with dues and such.  It does promote growing the number of acres of conserved land, but many of us will have better progress/more direct control running our own trusts

One final thought, The time and geography of Bills instructions are likely worlds away from current requirements, There will likely be some basic, and very important procedures that must be consistently adhered to, A lawyer from your area will likely be your best insurance when setting up any trusts, it probably wouldn't hurt to plan on a professional tax accountant for at least a couple years just to make sure you're doing it right.  This can be a useful way to maximize your resources and organize your community if it's done right,  

TAKE YOUR TIME      BUILD A GOOD FOUNDATION,



Bob Day, and all Permies.. PLEASE read the link I posted above about Nature Conservancy. It is worse than a scam. It is about PERMANENTLY reomoving land from public ownership and productive use!
 
bob day
pollinator
Posts: 808
Location: Central Virginia USA
77
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Thanks for the link. A community I was thinking of joining had joined the NC, and I thought at the time it was a deal  fraught with possible problems, but being high minded idealists the rhetoric sounded good. Seeing how they callously handle "deserted" land makes me more certain than ever that my original aprehensions were well founded.

Again, Thanks for the link.
 
Jeremy Baker
pollinator
Posts: 552
Location: Nomadic
47
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Thanks for the succinct step by step guide Bob. I am thinking more and more about forming our own non profit organization or association. Groups of people like a community land trust also makes sense to me because there is more people invested in the community to safeguard it. However I’ve met the director of our local Nature Conservancy and they were buying up easements on land that is rare habitat. Habitat that should not be developed in any way. There are only tiny fragments left so I looked at it as a valuable service. Having said this I do not know if they are also placing conservation easements on farmland, residential land, ….potential permaculture land. I might see if I can get the records from our county assessor to see exactly what local conservancies are doing.
 Perhaps in our case can do a simple state non profit and skip the 501-C3 federal non profit status. If someone wants to donate assets to the permaculture research institute what incentive's would they have to do so. Would they get state tax credits. Washington has no state income tax so maybe there’s little incentive???
 I once visited a Benefit Corporation in Oregon that was experimenting with aquaculture and free energy and holding educational meetings. They were donated a tractor but I don’t know what else. I don’t remember where the land came from. I wonder if a B corporation with a state non profit is a possible combination?
 Sorry for the more questions than answers.
 
bob day
pollinator
Posts: 808
Location: Central Virginia USA
77
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Like  I said,, I haven't done any research at all for a couple years, and never got conclusive answers when I did.

Whatever non profit status you get, there may still be some taxes.

I really like the idea of a religious non profit,  that has the most complete tax exemption and I'm pretty sure those have already been granted in the vein/name of Permaculture.

Conservancies I think have some tax exemptions, but seeking shelter under them would likely be less complete than other non profit trusts you might be able to qualify for.  A non profit trust should be able to shelter your wages, land, improvements, even possibly supply you with odds and ends of spending money for your work on the property.  Again, be scrupulous with records and honest with adherence to your mission statement in establishing the non profit, and there's no reason why you couldn't totally dedicate yourself to the public good through Permaculture and enhance your own survival at the same time.

The idea of establishing a non profit and building on land it receives as donation is a simple one, but totally depends on the situation

I have land and might be interested in combining with someone else who had a completed plan and established non profit who also believed in Permaculture Principles, but the key is going to be proving yourself with stability and positive actions.

Again, the design should be well thought out, you seem to be studying a particular area, but do your research thoroughly, and be sure there is a chance of community support in the area.

At this point in time I can say, don't take my statements as if they were gospel, figure these things out as you investigate the situation, trust specifics,  and it's likely a good idea to talk with a lawyer or local tax professional to get accurate information. research the history of the properties for sale. Maybe look at a few, talk with owners, think about Permaculture possibilities, and see if there's any local support for your type of  situation.

As you go it's a real good idea to be asking yourself what you can do to improve the lives, sustainability, well being of the people in the area.  They may not know it yet, but you may figure out Permaculture tricks that can  improve their crops, their housing, even their peace of mind.

Conservancy is nice, but may cripple you as far as Permaculture ambitions and your energy might be better spent on a neglected run down piece of land that you can do erosion control, diversify plantings and really push forward the idea of People Care.  

Education is really the name of the game, get involved in the area you want to settle in even before you incorporate. For instance, there is a neighbor beside me and I approached him with the idea of creating a joint Permaculture Property, that he could keep possession of, possibly build on, and obtain a  tax exemption while still basically maintaining control of it. He wasn't interested, likely he will end up selling it,  but these are the types of possibilities you might explore, it really depends on the people and properties in the area you are looking at and the attitudes of the people.

I wish you luck, but don't jump at the first opportunity without some careful thought and research.
 
Thanks tiny ad, for helping me escape the terrible comfort of this chair.
Free Heat movie
https://freeheat.info
reply
    Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic