herbs, diet to treat depression?

Has anyone here successfully treated clinical depression with herbs or diet?  I'm very interested in getting off pharmaceuticals and hope to give it a try again in the coming months.  Would like to see any of your personal successful treatments.  Pot has been suggested but unfortunately that's not plausible for me to try.

I also have high blood pressure (not weight related) and would like to treat that naturally as well.

Hi Ludi,
Paul told me once about how niacin helps people prone to depression.
Hope it helps!

Thank you! 

I have had many clients with depression in my energy therapy practice, and many of them (but not everbody) have been able to beat clinical depression or sub-clinical depression.

There are several categories of depression, and each case is unique.  There are a wide range of symptoms and a wide range of causes.  I am most interested in identifying the cause of depression.  There is usually a primary cause and several secondary causes. 

In most cases, the primary causes are psychological/spiritual/behavioral/relational.  Financial stress is a common cause.  Nutritional deficiency or toxicity can be causes as well.  Disconnection from one's inner purpose in life is almost always a significant factor at a deeper level. 

Regardless of the primary cause, a holistic approach is warranted.  This will probably include several if not all of the following approaches: 1) exercise 2) meditation, breathing exercises or chi gong 3) dietary changes 4) supplementation 5) massage/bodywork/acupuncture/energy healing 6) some form of counseling for whatever is causing stress 7) behavioral changes to address self-sabotage alignment with one's life purpose

Some of this stuff is free or nearly free.  However, realistically, recovering from a clinical depression will likely require some form of professional support.  You are worth that investment.

#1 proven treatment for depression is 30+ minutes of moderate exercise every day.  Research proved it more effective than any pharmaceutical - which really isn't hard to do because the pharma drugs do not perform better than placebo.  Sunshine is also very helpful for depression, so walk in the daytime if it isn't unbearably hot. 

Plenty of natural substances have shown remarkable anti-depressant effects.

Here is a list of natural substances that have BOTH anti-depressive AND anti-hypertensive effects:

Turmeric (curcumin)
Rosemary 
Omega 3 fatty acids
Resveratrol
Flavonoids (eat the white inner peel of citrus!)
Goji (lycium)
Raw Cacao
Lavender
Onion
Black Pepper
Folic Acid

As for the pharmaceuticals, if you get off them you must go off them SLOWLY and under medical supervision.  I cannot stress this enough, as the detox can be dangerous.  Hopefully yours will be smooth and painless. 

All the best,
Y.K.

I use Reishi quite successfully to treat depression & high blood pressure.
Even though i find it to be worth its weight in gold, It can have a range of side effects that you may or may not experience including an anticoagulant effect & increased liver function so its worth doing a search for all the side effects before you commit yourself.
It also saves you having to drink prune juice.

Thank you! 

p.s. - It may be worthwhile to check levels of Vitamin D3, Thyroid function and B-vitamin status.  Deficiencies of any of these can contribute to depression.  

Good advice from Yukkuri.

One minor addition to the herb list is lemon balm - it has more rosmarinic acid than rosemary, but a much milder flavor. The rosmarinic acid is an excellent anti-stress plant molecule. It does not act quickly (like scutellaria or passionflower or kava) ... it works over the course of a few days as it gradually builds up levels of the anti-stress compound GABA in the brain. But it helps fight automatic negative thoughts that dominate when a person is stressed to the point of depression.

Years ago, when I was studying herbal medicine, I thought that St. Johns Wort was the best known herbal antidepressant. It was ranked right up there with Prozac. This may be old outdated news as I haven't studied herbal meds for quite a while.

  I've got mixed feelings about St John'swort.

  I believe if gathered and tinctured by the person who needs it (or someone they trust) it's of great benefit, like bottled sunshine, in fact. BUT commercially grown, under who-knows-what conditions, "standardized" etc., I'd be wary of. It's Big Pharm all over again (IMO).
  That said, I think it works so well for depression because it works on so many levels. It is excellent for nerve pain, for example, so helps to relieve headaches, sciatica and the like. It has anti-viral qualities as well, and so can be useful to help to prevent herpes outbreaks. So in a whole-person approach to recovery from depression, AFTER discontinuing prescription meds., it has a place.
  My sister fell into a post-partum depression after a baby at 40. It lasted 15 years. Then she took up singing lessons! As part of a larger picture, the expression she found through music, and the help it gave her in learning how to breathe properly, she has stayed "clear" for three years now.

I always try to grow or wild craft my own - best for many reasons.

Just to clarify, mine is bipolar depression, not situational depression.  My sister is bipolar also but much more severely than I am (though stabilized on pharmaceuticals at the present time).  I live a very pleasant, stress-light life, pursuing my dreams and personal goals, so that sort of thing isn't an issue.  Happy marriage, getting along with family members, all that.    So being depressed has nothing to do with my way of life.  The medication I'm on doesn't work the greatest a good bit of the time, as pointed out they don't really work better than placebo in many/most cases.  :p  But they are a lot more toxic than placebo, which is why I want to try to get off them.

Thank you everyone for your helpful input, it is very encouraging. 

I can't speak to the depression part.
High blood pressure though I have been able to manage with garlic and hawthorn. Still something to monitor though.

Robert Ray wrote:
I can't speak to the depression part.
High blood pressure though I have been able to manage with garlic and hawthorn. Still something to monitor though.

What part of the Hawthorn? Are you using the berries from the tree? How much and how often do you use it?

I use capsules 200mg x 3 per day. I am told that hawthorn tea is also effective but have never tried that.

Thanks Rob. DO you eat garlic cloves and/or garlic pills? How much?

Robert Ray wrote:
.
High blood pressure though I have been able to manage with garlic and hawthorn

That's very encouraging!

Ludi,
My husband has done very well with the chemical free diet.  He is not completely chemical free but since we eat together a lot and he likes to cook he eats far fewer chemicals than he used to.

His high blood pressure can be attributed somewhat to weight but mostly to his very high strung personality; there is where the depression comes in.  He did do well with counseling and medication but when I drastically changed my diet (for different reasons) he slowly started coming along.  He still takes meds but not nearly the strength that he used to and he is able to deal with his depression a lot better.  That is why I feel that his depression is of a mostly physical origin; when he ‘falls of the wagon’ and has a restaurant lunch with friends he always feels moody and irritable for a couple of days.  But at least it is only a couple of days now.

My ‘cure’ for depression 30 years ago, on the advice of a friend, was a chart and valerian root.  I charted my mood, physical state (headache, tired, joint pain, tired, etc.) for 90 days.    It fell in to a specific pattern, looked like a quilt on the calendar.  Here is the interesting (to me) part; I was in my childbearing years then and I have since gone through menopause but my behavior still follows a pattern.  It is just less negative and disruptive for me now. 

Could it be that the few hormones are still causing occasional problems?  Could it be the moon cycle?  And as for my improvement; is it my diet?  Is it that I am older?  Don’t know.  I do know that since I have gotten rid of chemicals in my food I am soooo much more relaxed, focused, and energetic – besides the fact that it relieved my other problems.

I would not recommend the valerian root though until you are completely off meds.  I believe that it can interact badly with meds.  Once you are off though do some google research on valerian root studies.  I found that if I am having a difficult stretch (more than a day or two) I will take valerian twice a day for at least a week or, in the past, up to a month.  Seems to help me stop fixating on whatever I think it is that is going to cause me to kill someone.  

Thank you, Carolina.   

Hi Ludi,
I hope you will report back if you are able to make the change successfully. I have family members coping (or not...) with bipolar in varying degrees, and would very much like to know how you manage. Plus, I like reading your posts here on the forum. 
Gani

Ronie,
I do eat a lot of garlic, but I take 1500 mg/day in tablet form along with the hawthorn.
High blood pressure can be serious so  monitor and exercise caution. Losaar precribed to me just made my legs muscles and joints extremely panful.

gani et se wrote:
Hi Ludi,
I hope you will report back if you are able to make the change successfully. I have family members coping (or not...) with bipolar in varying degrees, and would very much like to know how you manage. Plus, I like reading your posts here on the forum. 
Gani

Thank you.    Yes, I will be letting you all know how it goes.  I won't be trying to go off the medication until I can clear my work schedule of deadlines.  I'll probably first be trying to make some changes in my diet between now and then, as I've been eating more "junk food" - crackers and chips - than I really want to be.    I always have trouble figuring out what to eat in the summer, as I don't feel like cooking when it's 90+ F in the kitchen. 

My sister tried treatment with herbs but was not successful.  She has much worse symptoms than I have though (she's been hospitalized multiple times) so I think I might have a shot at going med-free. I've never been so bad as to require hospitalization.

Thanks Rob. I don't have high BP, just been very interested in herbal meds for a long time- if and how they work.

Ludi, if you don't mind, how often do you tend to 'cycle'?  (how long between manic/depressive episodes?)

With any form of mania or psychosis, we want to deal with excitotoxins first - as mentioned above, a chemical-free diet would be important. 

Next we look at oxidized oils - which, with few exceptions, includes any cooked oils as well as all hydrogenated oils.  The body is composed mostly of water - oil rises to the top, your brain.  If there are bad quality oils, they will rise to the top and gunk up your brain to where you can't think straight.  In addition, bad oils have a significant negative effect on endocrine function - hormones.  Shitake mushrooms and medicinal mushrooms will help take out bad oils from the brain.  Try making a small pot of broth with 4 dried shitake, maybe some seaweeds.  You will need to gently simmer the shitake for about 20 minutes uncovered.  You will feel the difference immediately. 

Omega 3 oils (fish oil, krill oil, chia seeds, flax oil, purslane) are very important for neurotransmitter function, and seem to boost seratonin levels.

http://www.webmd.com/depression/features/fish-oil-to-treat-depression

Fish Oil to Treat Depression?
Omega-3's may have an affect on serotonin levels.

Dave thinks a lot about fish these days. Study after study has suggested benefits for omega-3 fatty acids, which are plentiful in certain fish oils. But what intrigues Dave isn't that omega-3's might reduce his risk of heart attack, or ease the pain of arthritis. He's hoping to lubricate his mind.

A handful of small studies have suggested that omega-3 fatty acids can help smooth out the mood swings of bipolar disorder. There are few effective treatments against the disease, so the news is a hot topic now at support groups for manic-depressives, like the Berkeley, CA, group in which Dave participates.

The first news to attract attention was a 1998 report in the Journal of Affective Disorders. Researchers noted significantly lower levels of omega-3's in the red blood cell membranes of patients with depression.

Then in the May 1999 Archives of General Psychiatry, Andrew Stoll, M.D., and colleagues reported a study of fish oil in 30 manic-depressive patients. Sixty-four percent of those who took 10 grams of fish oil per day for four months reported a marked improvement in their symptoms. By contrast, only 19 percent of those receiving the placebo benefited.

I've only had one serious manic episode, which was one of the most exciting, most artistically productive periods of my life, but ended badly as they often do.    Otherwise I can't tell any pattern to the depression, I haven't kept a chart since I've been on medication that sort of works.

Does shiitake work against the irrational thoughts and feelings of depression?

H Ludi Tyler wrote:
I've only had one serious manic episode, which was one of the most exciting, most artistically productive periods of my life, but ended badly as they often do.     Otherwise I can't tell any pattern to the depression, I haven't kept a chart since I've been on medication that sort of works.

Does shiitake work against the irrational thoughts and feelings of depression?

Sorry your expansion didn't end in a cozy contraction.    I wish you safe and gentle experiences of creative expansion and easy integration in the future. 

I suggest you try the shiitake and see how it feels.  No side effects that I know of, and it isn't expensive.  Make sure you simmer the shiitake until the broth gets a bit dark and smells tasty!    You can throw some seaweeds, cabbage, daikon or green onions in there once it's simmered a bit, but don't overdo the veggies - the soup should be 75% broth.  Drink it slowly.

my wife and I use saffron from November through March to ward off S.A.D.  Approximately 10 milligrams twice a day has been our dosage for several years now.  I tend towards depression in general, but the growing season keeps me busy and outside working enough to enjoy the time from Spring through Fall.

I've tried St Johns, acupuncture and meditation over the past couple decades and didn't get much that seemed to last in comparison with the saffron.  Before that I had used the pharma approach and it works, but the price of the side effects weren't worth it.  Haven't encountered any side effects from the saffron so far.

H Ludi Tyler wrote:
Thank you.    Yes, I will be letting you all know how it goes.  I won't be trying to go off the medication until I can clear my work schedule of deadlines.  I'll probably first be trying to make some changes in my diet between now and then, as I've been eating more "junk food" - crackers and chips - than I really want to be.    I always have trouble figuring out what to eat in the summer, as I don't feel like cooking when it's 90+ F in the kitchen. 

My sister tried treatment with herbs but was not successful.  She has much worse symptoms than I have though (she's been hospitalized multiple times) so I think I might have a shot at going med-free. I've never been so bad as to require hospitalization.

Bipolar runs rampant in my family.

I believe that reducing stress can help a great deal for depression. It seems that you have some stress at work and also stress at home over what to eat and what to cook when it's hot... Take this problem and research it. What foods can be cooked slowly in a crock pot that you like? Maybe ask around and keep focused on this one single problem until you have multiple solutions that will work for you. 

There are simple solar ovens that can cook meats, soups, and reheat just about anything... They don't require a lot of turning in the Texas summer sun, but may require you to be nearby.

Perhaps there is a gas grill you could use under a tree in the shade instead of heating your kitchen with cooking.

Maybe an outlet on the back porch that the crock pot could cook rice, stews, meats or soups or food you like.

Write down the problems and choose which seems most pressing.
Take each problem (stressor) on one at time - don't let multiple problems rush you...pick one that seems important and deal.
Write the problem down and search for relief from that one problem - write possible solutions down.. Exhaust the rational possibilities then choose a solution that seems best...You can't predict all possible outcomes --- Take a break from problems then move on to the next problem

When irrational thoughts jump up, maybe own that thought as kinda funny and write down your thoughts and what your self talk is to yourself about the irrational thought.  On the other side of the paper write the reasons that the thought is irrational then if that irrational thought comes back up...you have a paper prepared to deal with it.

A higher power and hope for the future get me through today and give me hope for an eternity that has no pain nor tears nor irrational thought...My strength comes from the Bible...I don't know how anyone can get though today without the hope
that is in my God book. If your power/strength/hope comes from a different book, then read that book often.

Thank you so much for all the kind thoughts and helpful information. 

I just saw this on a friends FB page and I HAD to share:

"Before you diagnose yourself with depression or low self-esteem, first make sure that you are not, in fact, just surrounded by assholes" - William Gibson

I have had a few lengthy episodes that cleared up when certain people were removed

South Carolina wrote:
I just saw this on a friends FB page and I HAD to share:

"Before you diagnose yourself with depression or low self-esteem, first make sure that you are not, in fact, just surrounded by assholes" - William Gibson

I have had a few lengthy episodes that cleared up when certain people were removed

Now you guys know why I'm a hermit... 

I'm very hermit-like and avoid a lot of stress that way!   

All the above-ground parts of the wild Maypop, (passiflora) can be dried and used as a very calming tea.

I agree with an earlier post about chemicals in our food supply.  The further you get away from mainstream and mid-supermarket processed foods, the better chance of de-tox.

Germans have what they call a 'happy pill'  It's St. John's Wort.  (Johanniskraut).  Most of our St. John's Wort pills are useless... you need the red oil... not dried leaves.  And it takes about 2-3 months to get working on a very low but steady level.

The yellow flower is wildly abundant in the west.

http://www.gardensablaze.com/StJohnWort.jpg

winsol3 wrote:
I agree with an earlier post about chemicals in our food supply.  The further you get away from mainstream and mid-supermarket processed foods, the better chance of de-tox.

Germans have what they call a 'happy pill'  It's St. John's Wort.  (Johanniskraut).  Most of our St. John's Wort pills are useless... you need the red oil... not dried leaves.  And it takes about 2-3 months to get working on a very low but steady level.

The yellow flower is wildly abundant in the west.

If, someone has St. John's Wort, how do they process to get the active red oil?

Blood Type Diet (for some the later work with Phenotypes may be better) and recommended exercises have kept me consistently better even if I have a bad day.

It took awhile, but I think largely intestinal imbalance (which is essentially what the BTD is meant to fix and keep healthy) was the biggest contributor aside from needing to learn intense exercise is really god damn wrong for my body.

I am A- and grew up eating way too much red meat and cheese. I even limit wheat a lot now too. I was constipated my entire childhood and gained weight, and not until I dropped red meat did I lose weight ( and fast ). However it is a different story for others, some people need red meat in order to break the bacterial adhesion to the intestinal wall which can lead to serious health and mental problems (O's).

I went organic and all of that but eating things that are specifically good for me instead of just avoiding poor food has made a bigger difference. It is better to treat yourself with food than it is to try and slow down poor health conditions by just avoiding a few things.

Hi Ludi, boy, there is a lot of good info on this thread!

In my 20's I thought I was having some depression problems and it turned out my issues were primarily physical. Here's what worked for me:

[li]hormones - I learned my "low" time of the month was the week right after I ovulated, the week before most women's PMS week. It was a progesterone imbalance that was reigned in with herbs (can't recall them now) and acupuncture.[/li]
[li]anemia - amazing how this depletes one's energy and mood. I treated this with supplements (my fave was Floravital or other iron absorption co-factors, not iron itself), herbs, diet, acupuncture and finally resorted to endometrial ablation.[/li]
[li]thyroid - this, too, was/is not functioning fully - be sure to have a doc look for T3 uptake, not just thyroid in the blood. I think years of hormone imbalances, stress, anemia and environmental/food toxins/hormones all contributed to damaging my thyroid.[/li]
[li]food sensitivities - eating wheat (and to a lesser extent cow's milk) makes me lethargic, cranky, tired and gives me sinus infections. Look up GFCF (gluten-free, casein-free) diet info on the web for how gluten and casein might affect the brain and serotonin levels. [/li]
[li]B12 - a friend was missing all motivation and didn't know why. Since I'd found relief from treating physical things, I encouraged him to get checked out. His serum B12 was almost non-existent and once he began taking B12 shots, he felt better, could concentrate and get things done again.[/li]

Back then, when I was eating wheat, anemic and had a hormonal "low," I would be curled up on the bathroom floor, sobbing, unable to function for about one day per month, and only partially "there" for days before and after. Then over the next two weeks, my hormones would surge up, reaching a peak just before my menses, and I would be bubbly-cheerful, energetic and active when most women are bitchy. I had no clue this was happening monthly because it was opposite of most women's mood-cycle combinations.

There is still so much more I have to do to improve my health, though avoiding gluten (most all grains now, actually) has been the single most life-changing, mood-enhancing thing so far.

Wishing you health and happiness, m'dear!

For food sensitivities/allergies, you don't need to do expense blood tests. An elimination-challenge diet is easy to do and doesn't cost a thing except some time label reading.

An elimination-challenge diet is used to test one food at a time. Eliminate ALL forms of the suspected food for one week (if testing cow's milk, eliminate it for two weeks). Read labels! You'd be amazed at the ways our processed foods hide wheat, corn, soy, eggs and dairy. (Those are the top food culprits, btw.)

Then you "challenge" that food by eating the pure food all by itself.

So, for example you'd challenge by eating cream of wheat, or a soft-boiled or hard-boiled egg, so that the wheat doesn't also have yeast, etc. and the egg doesn't even have butter on it from the frying pan.

If that food is a culprit, you will notice in a BIG way! Within 24-48 hours (though usually within minutes), if that food was causing something, that something will flare back up.

Low fat diets can cause depression as our brains need the fat to function properly. Do you eat enough fat? avocado, some nuts, bacon, cream etc are some things that can feed your brain.

sounds like you are doing a good job though. I know how hard it is to see a family member suffer with mental illness.

Thank you for all this information, everyone. I really appreciate it! 

Last time I had my blood checked my doc said "perfect, keep doing what you're doing."  The test prior to that showed some odd cells which seemed to indicate a deficiency, probably folate, so I started taking supplements and eating more greens (I prefer greens to pills!).  So probably not a deficiency as far as blood tests indicate.

I'm trying again to begin to limit simple carbs.  Been eating more nuts and avocados.  I don't eat dead pigs very often so bacon is out (though I love bacon, I don't agree with the way pigs are raised commercially and have no source for humanely-raised pork  I eat bacon maybe once or twice a year)

I have not tried food-elimination-challenges yet.

I have started to slowly reduce my anti-depressant and move toward these more helpful food choices.  Probably going to take it very slow.