Preserving sourdough bread in the freezer

Hello.

Since I can only bake once a week, I make a big loaf. Then, I slice it and preserve in the freezer, so I take one slice or two per meal.

Problem is, sometimes I have some old slices from a couple of weeks that get really sour after defrost. So sour my wife doesn't like it, and I admit it is a bit hard even for me.
I thought below zero temperatures would prevent fermentation, but apparently, whatever is creating that acetic acid is still working.
The non-sourdough white bread I buy at the store doesn't have this problem, and may be still fine after four weeks in the freezer.

I tried leaving the loaf outside the fridge, cutting the slices only when we are going to eat it. However, the third day it becomes too sour and dehydrated, it requires toasting to be edible again.

Is there a way to preserve it for longer without getting it too acidic?

Abraham Palma wrote:Is there a way to preserve it for longer without getting it too acidic?

I don't have an answer to your question.

My suggestion would be to eat more bread.  If it is too sour by the third day have you tried making toast?  Would it be less sour?

Turn your leftover bread into croutons or bread crumbs.

We have so many lovely folks who make sourdough bread that it seems someone would have the answer.

That's an interesting problem.

We regularly freeze sourdough loaves as my partner cooks 2 loaves at a time (to maximise on oven space use all the heat being generated) and we can only manage one every few days. I find the bread is a little drier once defrosted but I've not noticed any change in the flavour.

I wonder, is the ambient temperature when you defrost the loaf allowing wild yeasts to colonise and kickstart the fermentation again? Have you tried defrosting the bread in a fridge? It would be interesting to see if this helps.

In general, I wouldn't expect any of the yeasts to survive the cooking process. Once our bread is cooked, fermentation stops. We cook our bread at 240C.

Luke Mitchell wrote:That's an interesting problem.

We regularly freeze sourdough loaves as my partner cooks 2 loaves at a time (to maximise on oven space use all the heat being generated) and we can only manage one every few days. I find the bread is a little drier once defrosted but I've not noticed any change in the flavour.

I wonder, is the ambient temperature when you defrost the loaf allowing wild yeasts to colonise and kickstart the fermentation again? Have you tried defrosting the bread in a fridge? It would be interesting to see if this helps.

In general, I wouldn't expect any of the yeasts to survive the cooking process. Once our bread is cooked, fermentation stops. We cook our bread at 240C.

Thanks, this might be it. Maybe I'm not cooking the bread long enough. My oven has 8 positions, I suspect number 8 equals 240ºC. I've found that the bread rises more when at number 7 (210ºC, maybe?), but after 45 minutes I just turn on the grill a few minutes for getting a crusty ... crust. Maybe it need more cooking time and less grill.

For me, I cook bread at around 500~*F for 20 minutes than I turn it down to 450~*F for about 20 minutes ish. How I tell if the bread is cooked is by knocking on the bottom of the loaf. I am listening for a hollow sound. If it is a dud sound, its needs more time.
Usually I take it out of the bread pan and knock on the loaf. If the hollow sound is missing I will put the loaf back in the rocket oven without the bread pan for a few minutes.


Also when you start your sourdough are you starting with a freshly fed starter? Or are you adding to a starter which has old(sour) starter in it? Maybe the loaf tastes fine when fresh, however after 2 days or so its sourness becomes more noticeable?

Would you be willing to share your process for making bread?

Sure.
When I'm done with bulk fermentation, I take a spoon for next batch and keep it in the fridge for a few days. (pate fermentee).

Until very recently, I was keeping 80 grams of starter in the fridge, and mixed the dough directly. I am only allowed to bake one bread per week, so when we don't use the starter for a pizza, it tastes too much of vinegar.
Now I am only saving 10 g of starter in the fridge, and a couple of days before baking I refresh it twice at room temperature.

Sometimes I add a little bit of dry yeast, but very very little, especially when the starter is not ready when I need to mix the dough.

Hello again.
I've made a bit of a Google research and I've found this site:
https://www.the-bread-code.io/recipe/2021/10/24/all-you-need-to-know-stiff-liquid-regular-starter.html

The guy here made a small experiment with three different starters and made a claim. I'm not sure if the claim is accurate, he said in overhydrated starters (he says liquid starter) lactobacteria is encouraged over acetic and helps yeast the least, while the opposite is true for stiff starters.
Since I can only bake once a week, I've adopted his ideas with this schedule:
1st day : teaspoon of previous risen dough, keep it in a jar with lid.
3rd day: add 5 spoons of water (I think 4 would do too) and dilute the small ball of starter, until it looks like cream.
4th day: add 4 spoons of wheat, until I can form a ball that is 50-60% hydrated.
6th day: dilute the stiff starter in water again, until it looks like cream again.
7th day: use the starter for a new dough. After it has risen, keep it on the fridge to be baked on the 8th day.

So, it's two days of a stiff starter, followed by 1 day of overhydrated starter, and the dough is mixed the day before baking.
So far, the flavour is good and I didn't need to leave the starter in the fridge.
My hypothesis is that this starter is now full of yeast and lactic bacteria, while acetic bacteria remaining low. I've not yet tasted old frozen bread following this technique, but the one that I'm eating fresh is holding nicely without getting sourer.
Maybe not having to keep the starter in the fridge has made a difference too.

In case someone read this one year later.

My solution to the problem above is this: I keep just one nudget of starter in the fridge. I don't mind if it goes acidic. Once I want to make bread, I feed this nudget on the counter several times until it becomes very active, and I have at least 200 g for my dough. No foul flavours at all.

Luke Mitchell wrote:That's an interesting problem.

We regularly freeze sourdough loaves as my partner cooks 2 loaves at a time (to maximise on oven space use all the heat being generated) and we can only manage one every few days. I find the bread is a little drier once defrosted but I've not noticed any change in the flavour.

I wonder, is the ambient temperature when you defrost the loaf allowing wild yeasts to colonise and kickstart the fermentation again? Have you tried defrosting the bread in a fridge? It would be interesting to see if this helps.

In general, I wouldn't expect any of the yeasts to survive the cooking process. Once our bread is cooked, fermentation stops. We cook our bread at 240C.

I also bake two loaves at a time, and we freeze anything not used after a couple of days.  We've not had any issue with our loaf slices becoming more sour.  I will say that after preheating the oven to 500 I do bake at ~450 degrees F in a dutch oven with lid for ~40 min, then without lid from ~5-15 min to brown, then leave in oven with the door just cracked open for another 25 min to develop the crust before pulling out to cool on the rack for about 3-4 hours.  From freezer, we almost always toast it, as we just prefer it that way from the frozen state.  

I usually find sourness is a result of longer stretches between starter feeds.  A hungry starter seems to produce more sourness.

205 degrees.

That should be the internal temperature of your sourdough bread when it leaves the oven.  If you're worried about undercooking and continued fermentation, that should solve it. Digital kitchen thermometers are widely available if you don't already have one.

If it doesn't solve your problem, hopefully it narrows it down to other causes.  Good luck.

j

Abraham Palma wrote:Hello.

Since I can only bake once a week, I make a big loaf. Then, I slice it and preserve in the freezer, so I take one slice or two per meal.

Problem is, sometimes I have some old slices from a couple of weeks that get really sour after defrost. So sour my wife doesn't like it, and I admit it is a bit hard even for me.
I thought below zero temperatures would prevent fermentation, but apparently, whatever is creating that acetic acid is still working.
The non-sourdough white bread I buy at the store doesn't have this problem, and may be still fine after four weeks in the freezer.

I tried leaving the loaf outside the fridge, cutting the slices only when we are going to eat it. However, the third day it becomes too sour and dehydrated, it requires toasting to be edible again.

Is there a way to preserve it for longer without getting it too acidic?

Jim Garlits wrote:205 degrees.

That should be the internal temperature of your sourdough bread when it leaves the oven.  If you're worried about undercooking and continued fermentation, that should solve it. Digital kitchen thermometers are widely available if you don't already have one.

If it doesn't solve your problem, hopefully it narrows it down to other causes.  Good luck.

j

Abraham Palma wrote:Hello.

Since I can only bake once a week, I make a big loaf. Then, I slice it and preserve in the freezer, so I take one slice or two per meal.

Problem is, sometimes I have some old slices from a couple of weeks that get really sour after defrost. So sour my wife doesn't like it, and I admit it is a bit hard even for me.
I thought below zero temperatures would prevent fermentation, but apparently, whatever is creating that acetic acid is still working.
The non-sourdough white bread I buy at the store doesn't have this problem, and may be still fine after four weeks in the freezer.

I tried leaving the loaf outside the fridge, cutting the slices only when we are going to eat it. However, the third day it becomes too sour and dehydrated, it requires toasting to be edible again.

Is there a way to preserve it for longer without getting it too acidic?

Yes, it did!
I had to experiment a little with my oven. It finishes quite good in 1h15' at number 6 (out of 8), I suppose it's 180ºC.
With the lower temperature the crust doesn't harden too fast and, while it takes a longer time to rise, it ends up rising. Now the crust is crusty, and the inside tastes better cooked.
I have a gas oven and most recipes do not apply equally than the electric ones.