how to reconcile car-free life with the desire for the rural / more land

Hi,  There might be one compromise that I would like if I were in your shoes.  I would look into air powered vehicles. The Air Pod is close to a 3 wheel trike, a bit bigger and can pull a small cart.  I could then go the 40 miles into town for errands. And look, no co2 emissions.  I think it is less expensive than an e-bike. The MDI Air Car has been banned for sale here in the US. why I don't know.  (Maybe all the politicians are in bed with big oil.)

One thing I have learned through the years. Life is change, and it happens every second. I either embrace the change or try to influence the change so I can live with it.  Learning to live with new transportation challenges can be daunting. But there are way many more daily changes to be made when moving out of the city. One major change is to be self reliant for your own security-policing, medical-doctoring, maybe growing your own food, making your own shelter.  Many things change with the environment one lives in.  Be ready for stuff. have a resilient mind to overcome obstacles. The creator helps me to be ok with changes and now I can even ride a bike for fun and enjoyment.  (Can anyone say Megavalanche. What a blast. look it up on youtube.)

peace

There're underlying assumptions all through here which are simply not true. 1: rural life is often NOT quiet: I'm house-sitting now in a subdivision in a small city and it is quieter here than out on my farm property where lawn mowing (more grass), dogs barking, off-road motorcycles using the county road like a race lane,helicopters doing flyovers cause it's cool in the country ...and 2: rural life is not free of crime or just plain thoughtless neighbors. I do like that there is more solitude, and that I know all my neighbors within a mile or so, but it seems like you have family members who might not. So maybe as has been suggested: work with your neighbors to create the world you want your child(ren?) to grow up in. Not everyone can move out of the cities: it's already happened way to much such that a LOT of rural just isn't anymore, and it may not address your concerns.

My husband and I are taking a stab at splitting the difference- it requires a car but our day to day life isn't car-dependent. We live in the city still but have 5 acres outside of town that we visit about every other weekend plus holidays. We've been camping (there's a well on site that uses a generator to pump plus a simple Jackery solar system to charge tools) but plan to build a Passive House so we can stay for longer stretches and rent it out (selectively) for income.

This allows us to live a walkable/bike-able life for the day to day grocery store/doctor/school/work stuff and earn city salaries, but then we pop upstate and have hugelkultur gardens and mushroom experiments and apple trees and wild blueberry bushes. We have the car to get between the two but we rarely use it in the city, so we were able to make a low-mileage lease work no problem. Once the house is built we want to switch to a plug in hybrid or full electric vehicle, depending on where the technology is.

I don't want to in the country full time because it's at least 20 minutes of driving to get to anything and I hate being car-dependent and having a milk run or a soccer practice drop-off take the better part of an hour.

We got into permaculture concepts in part because we have to set things up to work with nature- we're not there enough to fuss with it.

move a few miles north to Woodland. real estate prices have, sadly, succumbed to the madness expanding outward from Portland, but all that may change soon. there's still some ag and undeveloped land within a couple miles of town. we could use more folks like you around here, too. help bring more reason and less the-way-we've-always-done-it to this place. can't say there's a lot of immediate gratification involved in trying to meaningfully change a place like this, but it has its rewards. when you miss Portland, there's a bus to a Vancouver park and ride with several connections across the river. there are also a couple routes to Portland that are still enjoyable in parts on a bike.

actually, find a place within Woodland city limits and run for city government. it'll be a hoot.

Hi, Timothy --
I live in Eugene and am in an identical predicament. Have always ridden a bike and walked, probably since before you were born. I own a small house and have constantly been subject to vandalism, trash dumping, fumes from illegal drug-cooking next door, motor racket, etc. Cyclists are vulnerable; here, it is a redneck sport to blast black exhaust fumes and spray noxious chemicals from gang vehicles at cyclists. I can cover twenty miles easily, but even the bike trails are pretty nasty here. I'd like to collaborate with a few like-minded folks, find some land, and start gardening. I'm in favor of chickens and maybe a goat, but otherwise, want the farm to be pet-free -- dogs and cats are harmful beasts. I'm vegetarian, practise yoga & meditation -- does any of that sound congenial to you? Perhaps you know others who might be thinking along the same lines? As for bikes, way-back-when, cars were smaller and drivers were more alert than they now are. I used to cycle for long distances on roads with no shoulder. A group of us might get one community vehicle for hauling and getting to towns.
 

Edge of small town: Conceivably one could find a few acres on a road that isn't a main through-highway and be able to comfortably human-power oneself into the town

 
Key center here on the Key Peninsula There are available lots on each end.  South end one is next to the library which is next to the fire department which is next to small office park with the thrift store which is next to the food mart and associated eateries. next to the lumber yard. Across  the street is the bank and nursery store  The other lot is on the cross street on the NE corner and the post office is a block further west.  PM me if you want contact information.

We live 5 miles from a village of 500 or so which has a good market, a beer store and a burger/bait shop. We live within a state forest on 50 acres. We’ve both had cottage industries which meant no commute. A city of 5,000 with feed stores, fleet farm stores, three grocery stores, a couple of hardware stores, and most else you could use. Even fast food joints. It’s 13 miles away. A lot of Amish in the area to buy from too. Still, I have a 4x4 tacoma and my wife has a Subaru Forester. I have a rad runner bike too. I’m also 73 years old.

is the goal 'car-free' or sustainable? They are two different things. You can get an electric truck and be sustainable. It isn't like they don't recycle well over 90% of a vehicles already.

Is the motivation behind this to 'save money'? You make it sound like you are financially strapped. And to 'move to the country' may not save any money, and you may save some money, but you end up spending more on other things.

If you want to maintain the 'car-free' lifestyle, buy another lot or three in the city, and convert it to an organic farm. There are numerous people who have done that successfully.

There is an illusion about moving to the 'country' that you can do anything you want. It is false. Other false illusions are drugs and theft, they both happen in the country. And a lot of the social networking is done through religious organizations.

It may also requires a vastly different skillset and toolset then you most likely have. Usually you need larger, more expensive equipment and tools. Maybe for a 1-2 acres you can get it to work, but it is more work.

Converting an old city lot or building to organic vegetable farm seems right down your ally, and can be fairly lucrative. You may just wish to find an investor.

I just have seen numerous people with these big goals and fall flat on their face. It comes down to skillsets, trying to be too diversified with too much work, and too little knowledge, and not enough seed money to get started. Otherwise, they are hobbyists that pick and choose 1-2 sustainability practices to save money or make their life easier ie maybe get rid of trash. Along with their day jobs.

I'm the same except in Australia. I've always hoped I could do urban permaculture by sharing with others, but it' very difficult to find people who want to do this, especially in small towns where people tend to be  conservative. I have an electric bike with a trailer (and kayak).

I do think the end of the private vehicle is coming and it will become much cheaper to summon a vehicle as needed, but for me this doesn't help with the isolation and lack of access to professional work.

Bruce Brummitt wrote:I’m also 73 years old.

Thank you for reminding me of a third reason that a vehicle may be required: if you are less able bodied (not than I'm suggesting that at 73 you're infirm, I have a good friend who still climbs mountains who's approaching 80!) However I did overlook those that for whatever reason would not be able to aspire to human powered vehicles. I apologise.
Here's a couple of relevant threads
https://permies.com/t/123410/permaculture-elderly
https://permies.com/t/280/146023/aging-homesteader
Being disabled is only a heartbeat away and can happen to any of us.

Nancy Reading wrote:

Bruce Brummitt wrote:I’m also 73 years old.

Thank you for reminding me of a third reason that a vehicle may be required: if you are less able bodied (not than I'm suggesting that at 73 you're infirm, I have a good friend who still climbs mountains who's approaching 80!) However I did overlook those that for whatever reason would not be able to aspire to human powered vehicles. I apologise.
Here's a couple of relevant threads
https://permies.com/t/123410/permaculture-elderly
https://permies.com/t/280/146023/aging-homesteader
Being disabled is only a heartbeat away and can happen to any of us.

Having a car (and driving) is not a solution for people who become 'disabled' or too old to ride a bicycle. When you're not able to ride a bicycle anymore, in many cases driving a car also isn't possible. In such a case you become dependent from the help of others. And then it's good to have helpful 'others' around you ...

Inge Leonora-den Ouden wrote:
Having a car (and driving) is not a solution for people who become 'disabled' or too old to ride a bicycle. When you're not able to ride a bicycle anymore, in many cases driving a car also isn't possible. In such a case you become dependent from the help of others. And then it's good to have helpful 'others' around you ...

I believe this is a factor that much of the U.S. is overdue to reckon with. In many ways we lead the world in accessible building and infrastructure thanks to work of disability advocates, and yet a half century of car-centered town planning means that that too many people can’t get from their modern, accessible housing to the modern, accessible stores without a private car.

I know an older couple, for example, who moved to be nearer their adult children here in Chicago. The elders were concerned that they would not be able to handle climbing stairs as they aged, so opted for a new-construction place in the suburbs rather than a “walk-up” the city. But living there means driving.

Hopefully, more communities will invest in more inclusive transportation options, and small town life will be a better options for those who can’t or would prefer not to drive.

Mk Neal wrote:

Inge Leonora-den Ouden wrote:
Having a car (and driving) is not a solution for people who become 'disabled' or too old to ride a bicycle. When you're not able to ride a bicycle anymore, in many cases driving a car also isn't possible. In such a case you become dependent from the help of others. And then it's good to have helpful 'others' around you ...

Hopefully, more communities will invest in more inclusive transportation options, and small town life will be a better options for those who can’t or would prefer not to drive.

I live near a small city with the badge of having the largest percentage of seniors in my country. Many seniors use mobility scooters to solve that problem, but they're not without their risks. That is something I think planners really need to start allowing for - dedicated scooter lanes!

Hi, Folks --
There are quite a few videos online about building car-free cities: Not Just Bikes is a good one. Car-free living seems to be possible in some urban areas, but less likely out in the sticks where cyclists have to deal with stray dogs, mammoth trucks, and tiny road margins. I'd like to find a friend for mutual support on a possible farm purchase project. No definite ideas or plans yet.

Jay Angler wrote:

Mk Neal wrote:

Inge Leonora-den Ouden wrote:
Having a car (and driving) is not a solution for people who become 'disabled' or too old to ride a bicycle. When you're not able to ride a bicycle anymore, in many cases driving a car also isn't possible. In such a case you become dependent from the help of others. And then it's good to have helpful 'others' around you ...

Hopefully, more communities will invest in more inclusive transportation options, and small town life will be a better options for those who can’t or would prefer not to drive.

I live near a small city with the badge of having the largest percentage of seniors in my country. Many seniors use mobility scooters to solve that problem, but they're not without their risks. That is something I think planners really need to start allowing for - dedicated scooter lanes!

Here in the Netherlands there are many of those scooters. They can use the wide-spread net of bicycle paths. But this country has the best bicycle paths of the whole world. That's also the reason why my choice is not to drive, but to ride a bicycle (for as long as I'm able to ... )

I love the idea of Mixed-Use Zoning and Sustainable Development Codes. Reforming small towns and suburbs into areas where people can live, commute, shop, and even grow food within a walkable/bikeable distance is a great idea. Throw in a bunch of worker-owned co-operatives with democratized workplaces and local currency, and you can make a really great community without the need for vehicles. There are a lot of folks interested in what a post-oil future could look like and are trying to lay out the plans to get there. There might be some ideas there as well.

Timothy, I’m relating a lot to your Post and have sort of begun the journey of developing a property alongside a bicycle trail in central Florida midway between Polk City and Mabel along the Van Fleet Trail.

It is 15 miles of flat car free riding to the nearest shopping in Polk City the property is basically viewed by the county as mostly unbuild able wetlands and there are access issues that require certain trips to be made under cover of darkness when there are not any trail users.

There is another nice bike trail nearby the Withlacootchee that might have semi wild areas for sale with less access issues and the potential to be on grid.

Florida right to farm act grants more leeway for building structures in areas with heavy land use restrictions, we are in the Green Swamp area of critical concern.

Nobody gives me grief about my garden gnomes or free range chickens, even have. A rooster who goes off predawn every day it’s awesome!

Hey there timothy. Don't let the petrol heads get you down.  Ive lived in rural Pa most of my life and have never owned a car or had a license. This is totally doable and I'm not dead yet. I lived in a small house with back to front farms on a smaller road about 10 miles from work for most of my adult life. And now I live in a tiny homestead (which i built myself) about 14 miles outside of the nearest large town. You can and should ride bikes in these places. It will requite more distance, more planning, more help, and yes you will probably end up going less places. The good news is that when you live the rural life there are less places to go so that all sort of works out. I manage all this by carefully planning my longer riding days. I don't for example ride into town just for milk. I don't go to the movies unless I'm also bringing home a weeks groceries. Since moving to my new homestead which I am only just getting started with. Ive had to move larger things longer distances. I use an E-cargo bike for this. Which works quite well so far.  So all of these things CAN be done. If you love to ride and are willing to give it a go I say go for it. If you need to rent a truck twice a year. Or bum a ride with a friend now and again. That's fine too. There are no rules. No one is in charge. And anyone who tells you otherwise is selling something.
Power to the peddle.  

Matthew MaC wrote:...Power to the peddle.  

Yeah!

More and more lately, it pops into my head that I wish I could get rid of my truck. It's older and I've babied it, so it's still in great shape, but the cost of vehicle insurance has skyrocketed. Considering, I only drive it to town approximately once per week (for supplies and to visit the post office), it just seems like a waste of money.

However, I am so rural that a vehicle is a necessity, even just for emergency medical purposes. Those services would never make it here timely, or even at all if it's been raining (takes 4WD after a good rain.) While I do have a hugely beefed up emergency medical supply kit, I'm a realist in that there may come the day when I'll have to drive myself to the ER.

And well, it's nice to have a truck to haul things. Some things are just too bulky and heavy to consider maneuvering with a bicycle or even an electric bike. Delivery for nearly everything is not an option, either. i.e. I brought home two 275 gallon IBC totes. And then there is firewood, propane tanks, building supplies, etc.

Anyway, for your situation, I thought of this video I saw a few months back. I cannot find it right now, but the gist is that the guy was operating an electric bike and was 'towing' behind him this modified dolly setup. You know, those dollies they use to haul furniture and heavy books around? Well, instead of it being straight up and down, he modified it so it was slanted more (so could hold more items without them falling) and he used what looked to me to be wheel chair wheels. And he attached it to his electric bike by this bar he welded to the dolly. It seemed like a cheap, simple way to create a trailer to use for moving more things around using only an electric bike.

If you type in, 'electric bike trailer' into YouTube, you'll see a variety of trailers people have either built or bought for this purpose. But nothing compares to the one I mentioned above, in terms of simplicity and cost-effectiveness, IMO. Could probably even fashion some sort of umbrella setup to help protect you from the inclement weather.

Outside of this, and all that the others have mentioned, the only other thing I can think of is maybe once you acquire your land, try to work out some sort of deal with a neighbor. Is there a skill you have that you could help him/her with, in exchange for rides for supplies, or even having the neighbor flat out get and deliver things for you? I know that if you were my neighbor and you'd be willing to help with projects around here, I'd definitely do that for you, especially since I'm already going to town anyway. And if you were a neighbor, it's not like I'd be going out of my way much.