Advice for sharing garden space with friends who have different gardening philosophies?

We are somewhat new to the area, this is only my second year gardening at our farm (we are still building farm infrastructure, but the garden is not an income stream).  We have unimproved clay soil.  Last year I mulched heavily with cardboard and wood chips and had some decent success with the few things I threw at the garden patch. I used some plastic sheeting last year to kill off a new area of grass and have made some narrow rows with my broadfork, added some bagged compost, raked it in, then sprinkled worm castings over the planted areas.  I just got more wood chips to go down in the paths of that garden area.

Our friends are moving in from out of state, and have moved from a decently large piece of land to a house in the suburbs so their kids can be in a good school district.  They are looking for land but expect to live in that house for the next decade til their kids are out of school. We are good friends and likely for the next several years, we plan to share garden space at our farm. Their previous garden space was tilled every year, they laid down landscape fabric in all the paths, they used things to control pests and weeds that I'm not super comfortable putting in my food production areas.  Those methods will not be employed in my garden, however I'm trying to work out ways to gently educate and let them know that they're not getting judgment from me for how they grew, but building soil health is a priority for me, and the way I want to grow things is how I plan to do. Does anyone have any input regarding sharing these methods while also sharing garden space and allowing our friends to take some ownership of the garden space?

Personally, I would explain to them how you feel about pesticides and herbicides, and explain that you would rather not have poison on your food.  That would be a deal breaker for me, and I wouldn't be able to share a space with someone unwilling to concede that.  If they agree to that, I would leave them alone to garden any way they like.  My parents grow a beautiful garden every year.  My father rototills every year, multiple times, uses conventional fertilizer, and doesn't agree with my gardening methods.  He still grows hundreds of pounds of food that is healthier and tastes better than anything he can buy in the store.  Anyone that grows their own food is on the right path.  At the same time, I would continue to garden the way you do.  Maybe they will see the way you do it and find benefit enough, or to become curious enough, that they will try it.  If they do, fantastic.  If they don't, there is a lot of room in the world for different opinions.  I long ago gave up the idea that mine was the only, or even the correct, way to do things.  I do what I am comfortable with and what makes me happy.  I feel like everyone else should have that same opportunity as long as they aren't doing damage to me.

Trace Oswald wrote:Personally, I would explain to them how you feel about pesticides and herbicides, and explain that you would rather not have poison on your food.  That would be a deal breaker for me, and I wouldn't be able to share a space with someone unwilling to concede that.  If they agree to that, I would leave them alone to garden any way they like.  My parents grow a beautiful garden every year.  My father rototills every year, multiple times, uses conventional fertilizer, and doesn't agree with my gardening methods.  He still grows hundreds of pounds of food that is healthier and tastes better than anything he can buy in the store.  Anyone that grows their own food is on the right path.  At the same time, I would continue to garden the way you do.  Maybe they will see the way you do it and find benefit enough, or to become curious enough, that they will try it.  If they do, fantastic.  If they don't, there is a lot of room in the world for different opinions.  I long ago gave up the idea that mine was the only, or even the correct, way to do things.  I do what I am comfortable with and what makes me happy.  I feel like everyone else should have that same opportunity as long as they aren't doing damage to me.

I appreciate this.  We are clear that herbicides and pesticides are not going in the garden.  I think the struggle is that we will be sharing the garden, including crops grown in it, and as we build out the garden and expand, I want to set it up for long-term success in a way that I will want to continue maintaining it.  I don't want landscape fabric out, it breaks down and ends up in the soil, it's a nonstarter for me.  They are open to permaculture techniques and it seems they're fine abiding by the ones we've discussed, however, I worry that I will unintentionally cause offense when discussing keeping things out that i want to keep out (pesticides, plastic, etc).  I'm hoping that over the next few years my methods begin to speak for themselves.

Trace Oswald wrote:Personally, I would explain to them how you feel about pesticides and herbicides, and explain that you would rather not have poison on your food.  ...  If they agree to that, I would leave them alone to garden any way they like.  My parents grow a beautiful garden every year.  My father rototills every year, multiple times, uses conventional fertilizer, and doesn't agree with my gardening methods.  He still grows hundreds of pounds of food that is healthier and tastes better than anything he can buy in the store.  Anyone that grows their own food is on the right path.  At the same time, I would continue to garden the way you do.  Maybe they will see the way you do it and find benefit enough, or to become curious enough, that they will try it.

My thoughts exactly! Well said, Trace!

Perhaps you could also add something of a rationale that is not an implied criticism. For example, tell them you want the garden to meet the certified organic standard in case you decide to start selling vegetables down the road. That requires something like 5 or 7 years of being herbicide/pesticide free. The organic veggies fetch a much better price.

Edit: I like garden paths too. Instead of landscape fabric, show them how cardboard and chips work as well (or better).

Yeah, pesticides should of course be a deal breaker.  It is your soil after all.

I think it might be an excellent way to compare two different methodologies and philosophies of gardening, by literally having them side by side.

I wonder what would happen if you produced more and/or better food than they did, would they be open minded and adopt your methods?  What would happen given the reverse scenario, would you be open minded and adopt theirs?

I would try to get their buy-in to play a gardening game. The most important thing is that we get a lot of food off the land. The second most important thing is that we see how few inputs (of all kinds) we can use. Games are fun!

The gardening game/challenge is a good idea.

It's important to pick the right metrics though. Simple weight of produced veg is sort of a con. That can be done in a hydroponics operation using manufactured fertilizer (which some have argued describes California commercial production).

So, in addition to simple volume of veg produced, I would argue for these points to qualify for excellence:
- organic matter added, for long term increases of soil fertility
- quality of produce, taste and texture
- hard cash expenditures: labour, fertilizer, fuel, maintenance
- 2, 3, 5 year comparisons to average out the real numbers

It's really hard to change people's way of thinking when it comes to gardening.  My father-in-law balked at the idea that I refuse to use chemical fertilizers and told us we were wasting our time.  Once I planted beans in his garden and brought the same bean seed here and planted the very same day.  His beans were spindly and insect-ridden while mine produced the entire summer, but still we couldn't change his mind.  My parents are the same way though mom is doing raised beds and forgoing chemical fertilizer in her small garden.  

But I was also raised to respect the property of others, so I reluctantly used fertilizer in grandma's garden at her insistence and watched  the quality of the plants and produce diminish yearly.  If someone were to utilize part of my property to garden, I'd expect them to keep it chemical-free as well.  Tilling wouldn’t be a deal-breaker for me, but they would know to stay clear of my growing area.

The fact that you are willing to share your land and worried about hurting your friends feeling says a lot about who you are.  I think if you explain what you want and don't want, and a brief explanation why, hopefully your friends will understand it's the way you live and grow, not a criticism of how they live.  You never know for sure about people, but one would think your friends are grateful to be able to live where they want and still grow food on your land.  If they know you, they probably knew you had a different way of doing things then they do, and expect to have to make some changes.  Up front communication seems like your best bet.  Maybe tell them about Permies, it changed my life, maybe it will change there's.
I think you are a generous and amazing person. Hope everything works out for you and your friends.

Laurel Jones wrote:...however I'm trying to work out ways to gently educate and let them know that they're not getting judgment from me for how they grew, but building soil health is a priority for me, and the way I want to grow things is how I plan to do.

First of all, are your friends the kind of people sensing undercurrents of judgment when discussing things and making plans? If they are, you'll want to be extra positive about the "discoveries" you've made about gardening in natural ways: gardening with nature to restore the ecosystem AND to receive a more bountiful and nourishing yield. If they are not judgment-sensitive types, perhaps handing them a simple checklist about your gardening standards, with relevant info/links/stats if that would help provide context, would establish a solid foundation for the next season.

Laurel Jones wrote:Does anyone have any input regarding sharing these methods while also sharing garden space and allowing our friends to take some ownership of the garden space?

   I would want to have distinct areas for their garden versus my garden; i.e., not having everyone vaguely equally responsible for caring for the same areas, and then dividing up the harvest mathematically in half when the time comes. In my opinion, each gardener should have a distinct space to feel the responsibility for, and to make decisions about (--within reason, and within the standards of the property owner, of course). That way the growing season doesn't have to become a series of weekly negotiating sessions, etc., and everyone can experiment and enjoy.

Educating by example is the most powerful way to teach something, and by sharing gardening space, tools, and ideas you will do just that!

I like everything Rachel said.  Laurel, it sounds like your priorities are:

1) Building and protecting healthy soil; chemical free
2) Helping your friend grow:
   a) Literally - by providing land for gardening.
   b) Relationally - with you.
   c) Educationally - by sharing your permaculture gardening beliefs and techniques.

I would just offer a list via a letter.  

sample letter wrote:Dear friend,

We're super excited to share a gardening space with you!  We have a spot ready for you out back!  Here are a list of things we don't allow on our farm:
1)
2)
3)
...
And here are some gardening techniques and websites we really enjoy!
1)
2)
3)
...
Lastly, here are some things that are okay in moderation.  But please give us a heads up first before purchasing or using these products and techniques in your growing space:
1)
2)
3)
...

Happy Gardening!
~~~~

P.s. I have attached an envelope with some seeds for you which we saved from our land last year!  Enjoy!

I wouldn't even explain "why" you don't like things, at first.   Education is a lower, long term goal.  Priority 1 is keeping you, your food, and your land safe, according to your world views.  Plus, it opens up a rationalization game:  If someone says "I don't like A because of B" and the other person doesn't believe in or refutes the existence of B, then that second person now thinks A is fine and dandy, regardless of the first person's belief system.

It's your land that you are stewarding, and if certain things are non-negotiables, then no worries.  But it may take some time to reflect on what those non-negotiables (or negotiables) are.  And it may take even more time to communicate them in an honest, firm, concise, and friendly way.  Who knows, maybe even after reflection, your list will have changed, too!

Jen Fulkerson wrote:The fact that you are willing to share your land and worried about hurting your friends feeling says a lot about who you are.  I think if you explain what you want and don't want, and a brief explanation why, hopefully your friends will understand it's the way you live and grow, not a criticism of how they live.  ,,,.

I agree with Jen here.
They are your friends, so I suppose they know you. They will understand you have certain opinions on what you want and what you don't want in the garden. If they are willing to do the gardening together, I think they understand you are the one whose 'rules' they'll have to follow. And if you explain why you have those 'rules' (in fact principles), maybe it's something new for them and they are glad you told them.

As someone who grows about 1/2 of her food on shared land, I really appreciate the amount of thought you're applying to this situation. I'm in a situation where myself and another person are growing on a lovely neighbor's land, who despite being a stranger doesn't ask for anything, not even a single tomato (although of course I share my harvest with her and bring her sourdough over the winter).

The other gardener is pretty absentee, and while myself and the landowner have been in a battle with Italian arum popping up literally everywhere, she's been nowhere to be found, despite regular pleas to keep her plot somewhat weeded to prevent it spreading. I have already weeded her plot several times. The woman who owns the property has just had a knee replaced and doesn't really need any extra work. She was even thinking of spraying roundup (I promised that I would weed everything to prevent it). I think that a clear agreement made at the beginning would really help as something to lean on when people have different approaches or aren't doing things to your standards. Especially when it can have an effect on the land you're growing on.

On the other hand, I love gardening with my neighbor. We have a quick chat and catch up and then work alongside each other, we share seeds and plant starts, text each other when we hear of a good deal, etc. Definitely worth doing with the right people.

Piggyback on the fact they moved the family to get the kids into the best learning environment that they are able to at this time. The same applies to growing your food supply, you want what’s best for the plants as well as the kids. Also tie it into nutrition, fresh food and the outdoors.

Well, Laurel, how much do you value the friendship and what does your mate think? How much support could you get there to put an end to the 'deal'?
Call me anti-social, call me selfish,  but I would not have offered to share my good gardening soil that I've worked hard to improve, knowing this, to start with, but if it is 'done', it is done.
The situation is just too fraught with potential conflicts, and the fact that I sense some reticence on your part tells me that there is serious trepidation on your side about that.
Take the problem backwards: If push comes to shove, what do you value more: Good food and the ability to grow good food as you see fit, be free to do as you wish on your own land?... or the friendship?
Note also that the idea that your friends would live there only for a while is not a contract you could enforce.
The French have a saying, "Rien ne dure comme le provisoire," meaning "nothing lasts like the temporary."
The constraint that you want to accept now  to nurture the friendship as 'temporary' may last, and last, and last...
In Wisconsin, for example , if you 'allow' your neighbor to use a path on your land for 7 years, it becomes expected that s/he will continue to have the enjoyment of it. You just might want to ask informally what the Law says in your area.
Do you and your mate have the diplomatic skills to "put your foot down" now, before they move in and keep the friendship intact?  I can assure you that this kind of agreement rarely ages well.
You are a kind person and I pray that you do not get taken advantage of. If to safeguard the friendship you go through with it, you may want to put it in writing, like a regular, enforceable contract as someone suggested before.
Yeah, I know: From afar, we can give advice easily, but we didn't sign any "prenup" either.

Laurel said, "Does anyone have any input regarding sharing these methods while also sharing garden space and allowing our friends to take some ownership of the garden space?

Laurel, I would like to ask what are your plans or dreams for the future?

Do you hope one day to have a market garden and hopefully get an organic certification?

Every time I read this thread I want to suggest sitting down with your gardening friends maybe having coffee or tea in the garden, and telling your friend/friends about what your hopes and dreams are for the future.  Especially if your dreams are to include that organic certification. Maybe after explaining about trying to get a certification will help them understand the reasoning as to not using those nasty chemicals in the garden, etc.

You have been given some really good advice regarding your question and I hope all this will help you decide how to proceed. Best wishes for the future.

Me being a new mom, am taking the same approach for general health for my daughter's sake.

It might be hard, because herbicides are very common, but it is YOU who is tryin to CHANGE things for your children. Do not be afraid to stand up for what is right and that is clean food, etc.. you got this.

They need to learn :-]

It's clear that you value your friendships and land. One thing to consider is that if you're not very clear about what you are and are not comfortable with up front, any residual discomfort about what your friends do on your land will likely poison your friendship over time more effectively than confronting those differences at the beginning.

I like the idea of putting your rules in writing, just to be very clear about what you want. It helps clarify it in your own head for starters, and will reduce any confusion about the rules further on down the road. It also provides a place to start discussions about your choice of gardening practices.

I've had to tell a neighbor to not spray knapweed on the private road on our property. They have an access easement, but they do not have the right to spray or do anything to the land. He was fine about it and just assumed that everyone was ok with spraying knapweed (there was one plant and it hasn't spread since the soil is improving in that area). He hasn't done it since, and we had a lovely conversation that ended up on his property showing me his beautiful garden, so it worked well in this case.

Good luck!

My garden has permanent raised beds. If i were to share it iI I would certainly spell out prohibitions of pesticides and fertilizer. I have one patch kept flat, mostly for corn and sorghum; I do till that annually. But the other two with the raised beds, I found even a Mantis tiller just didn't work well, so my guests would find the same thing. I do use a shovel, about once a year. But I would not go for an arrangement where we all use all the garden and share all the produce; unless they are willing to take your lead, that is not going to work well. Giving them a section for their own use (assuming you can spare it!) I think a better approach. And you could try the "games' approach--you plant a bed of say seed potatoes on your side of the line and they plant potatoes out of the same bag, the same day, their way, and compare the results. I have a lot of friendly arguments with my neighbor, who doesn't believe in adding sand to clay soil and doesn't believe in tilling, and does a cover crop of rye and hairy vetch every year. He also doesn't do permanent beds. Trouble is, although our gardens are only 700 feet apart, he has sandy soil and I have clay soil, so what works for him--like the rye--it's a nightmare to get rid of the rye in spring, but pretty easy for him. He believes the story of clay+sand=bricks while I know from experience that adding sand helps. We both really enjoy conferring about garden matters--but i think we might enjoy it less if we were trying to share the same ground!

I suggest removing "yourself" from the equation, beyond stating "I'm going to develop this patch of land using these established and well-documented methods, and you're welcome to participate and share the proceeds".

By "removing" I mean that nothing is presented as being a personal preference -- you are simply bound by the rules of the development method that you have chosen. Expressing things in personal terms of "I want/hope/prefer" implies that the terms are kinda squishy and negotiable.

The removal also shifts the "blame" for enforcement onto the method, rather than onto yourself. If your friend says "why not do this instead?" you can respond "the method requires that we do it this way" rather than "because I want...". Sorta like the bankers in Steinbeck's Grapes of Wrath who, when telling the sharecroppers to vacate, invoked the overarching system (AKA The Monster): "It's not us, it's The Monster. Something's gone wrong with The Monster".

There is a rule among at least some parents, that says “My house, my rules.  Your house, your rules”. Pretty clear.  

An examples:  if you allow jumping on the furniture, and I don’t, then at my house, your children will not be allowed to jump on the furniture.

That agreement was easier than long discussions, and did not involve efforts to convince one another.  It’s clear and respectful

You will have to make your own decision, obviously.  My vote is a clear statement of “my soil, my garden, my rules.”  End of discussion, and you are free to spend your time together enjoying what you enjoy.

Best wishes

Everyone, thank you guys so much for your input.  I'd like to clarify that I do not foresee this becoming an issue, I just want to be extra sensitive to it.  Our friends are wonderful, however most of my interaction has been with the husband of the couple (he is the primary in our friend group, the wife comes to gatherings when she is able to get away from their kids and her demanding job).  In a brief discussion about woven weed fabric I mentioned that I totally get the utility of it, but personally don't like to use it in the garden as it invariably breaks down and leaves chunks/strands around, and then you've got microplastics in the soil forever (albeit, this is old cattle farming land, I'm finding random trash all over the place, and doing my best to pick it up as I find it), and she might have just been emotionally charged from a stressful day, but it seemed that she got defensive about her use of it in their own garden.  As they will not be in town for garden setup time, we will be working together and sharing the harvest. I don't foresee any issues "enforcing" these rules, I just want to be very sensitive to how they may take my requests.  

Laurel, you're clearly a caring and sensitive person to even be considering this, so I bet you'll do fine. I totally get your concern over them taking things personally. I think sometimes the people close to us can perceive us doing something a different way than them as a threat to the connection and/or as a judgement and react in super weird ways. Figuring out what is at the root of the reaction might help to diffuse it. Something I try to say when someone is clearly misunderstanding me and likely reacting to a story in their head is, "What did you hear me say?" Often times, the response will make it pretty clear we're not talking about the same thing and that there might be some hurt, which can then be addressed and resolved. This isn't the easiest practice, but it can help. You probably already thought of this, but just plainly stating that you value the friendship and aren't judging them for having a different approach could be helpful. Perhaps making it clear that you'd like them to talk with you if they're ever feeling judged so it can be cleared up.

I think the advice to set out in writing what is and isn't okay on your land is a good idea. I understand the desire to avoid offense by making requests rather than setting rules. I also think it's good to remember that setting forth clear boundaries is an incredibly loving act. When we aren't clear, it can open the door to situations that create resentment and it's obvious that you don't want that. I like to remember that no one can trust me saying "yes" if they can't trust I'll say "no" when I mean it. I don't think you need to explain or justify the reasons for what is and isn't okay for you. As has been mentioned, that may actually create more chance for debate that could lead to offense. You have a right to steward your land the way you feel is right.
I bet if you're clear in your needs, they will respect them. Hopefully they'll see how you're doing things and get curious about why you're taking that approach.