watercolour questions so beginner, I'm almost afraid to ask

Just a little thing, but I have seen a number of people using plastic gum packaging for custom paint pans. You can either load them with homemade paints or the tube stuff. Seems to work and is a nice upcycle of garbage. ( they seem easy enough to cut apart if needed too)

I think that's the same set as this - still pricey, but less so: https://www.dickblick.com/items/winsor-newton-artists-watercolor-field-box-set-set-of-12-assorted-colors-half-pans/

Carla Burke wrote:I think that's the same set as this - still pricey, but less so: https://www.dickblick.com/items/winsor-newton-artists-watercolor-field-box-set-set-of-12-assorted-colors-half-pans/

It doesn't say which dollar,  so I'm guessing American.   Plus shipping and customs...amazon.ca ends up cheaper.

But nifty shop!

And I can improvise something for a while

I tried to paint a flower today, but it kept moving while I waited for each layer to dry, so I gave up and am enjoying a glass of wine while waiting for the cup to dry so I  can put the dots on it.

you know those ink sticks we use in Japanese caligraphy?  can we use them like watercolour paint and re-wet them with a brush instead of having to grind the ink to active it?  

I actually used to own a set of chinese watercolor sticks. just like the japanese ones, only in maybe 6 colors. They needed to be ground, and even worse, they each needed their own inkstone (didn't stop me from buying them though, in my art-supply-hoarding mode)...
I am amazed to find they still sell EXACTLY the same set.
https://www.jacksonsart.com/en-us/studio-essentials-chinese-painting-coloured-ink-stick-pack-of-5

Edit: occurs to me my trip down memory lane bowled over your question. I think it would be so amazingly dilute as to be frustrating. To get a nice dark tone you really need to grind the crap out of the stick, and it's easier with the lampblack ones than with the colored ones. But if I had ink sticks laying around you bet I'd try it.

can one watercolour paint on not-paper?  

You can generally paint other surfaces using watercolours but they don't stick as well to some of them. You can also have issues with the thinner dilutions just beading on non-porous surfaces. I've used them, for example, on antique ivory and while they work, you can just rub, wash or scrape them back off.

Is there a primer for watercolours?  Like gesso?  To  be a glue between the paint and surface?

Hi, nice to see a fellow beginner painter online.  I quite like Beam Paints : https://www.beampaints.com/ as they are plastic-free, relatively local and colour safe.  Happy creating!

r ranson wrote:Is there a primer for watercolours?  Like gesso?  To  be a glue between the paint and surface?

now you're getting closer to areas like gouache, or egg tempera-- instead of using a primer and painting on top, you mix your watercolors into these binders so it can stick but you can sort of use the same techniques as watercolor. but depending on what your surface is, it might not stick, and also gouache can be very like watercolor but also sometimes not quite (you can use washes and gradients but because its opaque it doesn't always come out exactly the same).

all very fun to experiment with.

I'm just wondering if you've seen any of James Gurney's videos?  Here's his watercolor play list
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLRba1gHgLtJB5NpHFmnZLhXuN_kdAyLae

I'm more into pen and ink, but I love watching him.  I'm not sure if he's the best thing for beginners, but he does a lot of experimenting with different techniques and materials.
You mentioned what to use when tracing your design.  I know he often uses a watercolor pencil, which runs when wet and blends into the design- which might be trickier for a beginner, I wouldn't know.

Mary Duggan wrote:Hi, nice to see a fellow beginner painter online.  I quite like Beam Paints : https://www.beampaints.com/ as they are plastic-free, relatively local and colour safe.  Happy creating!

They look amazing!

Maybe one day.

I ordered a small set of handmulled paints from a local maker.  I'm so excited,  but also afraid that I won't want to use them for fear of not being good enough to be worthy of such colours.

Elena Wulf wrote:I'm just wondering if you've seen any of James Gurney's videos?  Here's his watercolor play list
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLRba1gHgLtJB5NpHFmnZLhXuN_kdAyLae

I'm more into pen and ink, but I love watching him.  I'm not sure if he's the best thing for beginners, but he does a lot of experimenting with different techniques and materials.
You mentioned what to use when tracing your design.  I know he often uses a watercolor pencil, which runs when wet and blends into the design- which might be trickier for a beginner, I wouldn't know.

He's fantastic!   Thanks for the playlist.

I'm gravitating towards ink and wash, but I want to use a dip pen and haven't yet found a ink paper combination that works.  Either the ink isn't fully waterproof or it bleeds on the textured watercolor paper.
 So far I've been using a fine liner as it's more portable.  

I've painted for over 40 years, mostly in oils but also took time to gain some mastery over the mediums of pastel and watercolor.  I love your questions! They're the same ones we all have in the beginning.
My advice to you is to paint flat. You can always experiment after you "get good" with painting vertical, but there's good reason why a "watercolor easel" allows you to lay the paper surface flat. But in order to gain mastery of the medium, you really need to eliminate unnecessary challenges. Why make it harder?  Painting flat gives you control; you can tip the board to direct where you want a wet application to dribble toward, or to avoid a dribble, etc. (typically you would be taping your wc paper to a board for this reason, and also to keep the paper from buckling).
And why, an inquiring mind would ask, would my paper be inclined to buckle?  The answer is that the true magic of watercolor is the water! A ton of new painters apply the paint in a fairly dry manner, as if they were using tempera paint or oil paint, etc. That is not the idea with wc (although you can certainly utilize that technique, the result will look "dry" and sketchy, rather than wet and lush. The idea is to get the paper really wet, and then paint onto that wet surface, controlling what the paint does by how much you let that spot dry before painting onto it. Sometimes it is appropriate to really soak the entire sheet (you can dunk it in the bathtub or sink!), other times you can simply "paint on" a coat of clean water wherever you need a wet area to paint in.
I haven't read the entire thread, but from my teaching days I can guess some other questions that might arise.
Smooth paper (hot press) or textured (cold pressed)?  I recommend cold-pressed (textured) paper. It is more forgiving in that the texture slows the flow a little, and mostly because it is more absorbent, so the paint and water-washes tend to stay where you want them better.
"Student-grade" (ie, cheap) or top-notch paint?  This really depends on your budget.  If you can realistically afford to buy good quality (not super expensive boutiquey brands where you pay mostly for the hype, but just good) paints, and your budget is such that you won't subconsciously skimp on paint because it seems so wasteful, then get a basic palette of good basic paints.  Winsor Newton Professional WC is good, as is M. Graham, Daniel Smith, and actually Dick Blick makes a good line for a little less money. It's better, I feel, to get fewer colors of good quality. You don't need that many colors, really, because the number one skill to learn in any form of painting is accurate color mixing. If you buy a warm-leaning and a cool-leaning version of each of the primary colors (in light-fast pigments, preferably), plus black and a warm-leaning and cool-leaning brown for convenience, you will have all you need.
And speaking of lightfastness... I'm sure by now you have been caused to wonder about pigment toxicity. Yes, the very best warm-leaning reds (and therefore orange) and the best yellows (and therefore greens are the Cadmiums. And yes, Cadmium is toxic if you eat it, sand it down into dust after it's dry and breathe it, or put it into a cut on your skin. So don't do that. Same with Cobalt. Don't put your brush in your mouth. Just don't. And also, yes, true Alizarin Crimson is still the very best cool-leaning red you can get, and while not toxic, it's also known to change color in direct sunlight. Never hang an original watercolor in direct sunlight!  The fake Alizarins don't make beautiful reds or violets. They are based on printer's inks, and they look it (IMHO). I have done testing for lightfastness putting Alizarin up against all the modern substitutes. They all change over a period of 2-3 years in direct sunlight (even sooner in Texas), so don't put the paintings there!
As for painting outside (we all have romantic ideas about how cool that is), again, I would urge you to work on your skills indoors in controlled conditions, and once you have amazing watercolor skills there, you can take your paints on location and watch your skills disappear. It's a whole other animal, painting en plein air. There are so many more variables, wind blows your stuff away, easels fall over, bugs and dirt end up where you wish they wouldn't, "well-meaning" people walk up and give you unsolicited (and unqualified) advice, the light on your subject matter changes so fast you can't keep up, or sometimes you just lose it entirely and it rains on you instead.  
As for drying your palette, I recommend that you get one of the large plastic wc palettes, that have little "wells" around the edge to squirt your regular colors into, and a flat open mixing area in the middle, and a lid to keep them clean between uses.  If you only paint occasionally and the paint puddles in the wells get dry, so what?  You moisten them and they are good to go again. Dick Blick has these palettes, and for that matter so does (I assume; they used to) Hobby Lobby.  Or you can use a sealable sheet cake pan, like Rubbermaid or something until you're ready to spend the $25 or so for a palette that will serve you as long as you are a painter!
Although a lot of folks start in WC because they think it is either simpler than oils or less expensive. Neither is true unless you plan to cut corners on quality or skip basic skill-building. WC is actually a more difficult medium to MASTER, it's just that a lot of people don't associate WC painting with mastery, but more with dabbling.  You can dabble in any medium, but for mastery, WC has more variables to control, and allows fewer ways to cover or correct boo-boos.
This is getting to be a very long reply, so I'll spare you further musing from me, but hopefully this helps you get started.  It's a rabbit hole.  Have fun falling down it!

My 15 yo has been teaching herself watercolors for the last 6 months and she has come up with what I think is a genius way to experiment with techniques and paints and brushes.

She has been cutting up watercolor paper into bookmark sized strips and tapes several down. She likes watching Pinterest for short bite-sized technique tutorials. I think the small paper allows her feel free to try and mess up and try again and again.  And whenever she has a friend with a birthday or just wants to let someone know she's thinking of them, she gives them one of her bookmarks, sometimes with a quote lettered over the top (she's starting to teach herself calligraphy too).

Another way she enjoys experimenting is by taping a grid on a larger sheet and then painting something in each box.

r ranson wrote:Is there a primer for watercolours?  Like gesso?  To  be a glue between the paint and surface?

Watercolour ground might be what I'm thinking of.

I have used watercolour with good results, but then I stumbled upon alcohol paints.
I mix the pigments myself with denatured alcohol.  The results are so interesting. It required experimentation.

They in some ways are similar to watercolour but with deep saturation. However, they need fixative. I can add alcohol to a brush and change things. It's fun and brilliant in depth and color. Yet is that wonderful liquid as in water color - depending on your mix - on you preference.

Everything else is just play for now while I try to find out what I like and what I don't like...
R Ranson, you've just solved all of your water color mysteries with this thought process...You can read & study for an eternity but, at the end of the day it's what feels "right" with you. Practice & play, experiment & take chances outside your comfort zone...Water colors are a very forgiving media;

Today we went to a local park to see if I could find the place where a painting was painted 100 years ago.  It's hard as there's a lot more shrubbery now that it's not an active military base and they've done a lot of changes to the shoreline since then.  So I decided to try and sketch some landscapes instead.

And I learned that I really need a floppy big hat if I'm going to sit on the seaside in the blistering heat.  I lasted 10 minutes and I'm very glad I stopped as I don't think it would have taken much longer to get a sunburn.  

This nature sketching (ink and watercolour journaling) is harder than it looks.  

Do get a straw or other breathable hat with a brim.
A frozen towel or ice behind your neck will work miracles
Cheers

oh, that's very interesting.  I took a bunch of photos of the sketch I was working on with the idea I could finish it at home - and maybe do a bigger one if it turns out.

But the camera can't see all the things I saw.  The mountains are missing because of the haze and I guess it didn't have enough colour or value difference from the sky.  The boats have lost all their colour and are almost neutral tone.  There's just so much information lost in the photos.  

That reminds me of the reason I took up photography - to try and share the world as I see it.  But it has a much smaller dynamic range than the human eye.  I knew that logically but never saw such a good example of it before.  

I'm just going to have to go back with a sunhat and spend more time painting and less time taking photos.

Also, art supply stores are dangerous.  I'm very glad I don't live too close to one.  

I got a special treat and went in the local shop.  Oh my!  So many options.  I'm very glad I had my wishlist narrowed down (and checked the prices against Amazon) or I would have spent all of next month's money in one go.  


Got my Christmas present early and now I get to experience what it's like to paint with watercolours that aren't half chalk.  We got some student-grade colours!  I feel like I finally made it through the tutorial and am starting level one!  But I also feel I need to use up the starter paint I have out so there's a bit of don't-waste-it-guilt getting in the way.  

r ranson wrote:
But the camera can't see all the things I saw.  The mountains are missing because of the haze and I guess it didn't have enough colour or value difference from the sky.  The boats have lost all their colour and are almost neutral tone.  There's just so much information lost in the photos.  

I know exactly what you mean. I remember when I discovered that same idea. I was a high schooler on an exchange in China. This was before digital cameras were a thing. My host mother took me on a picnic on a mountain side in the spring. It was a terraced mountain and all the hillsides around it we're terraced as well and they were planted with peach trees. Everything was in bloom with pink blossoms. It was like eating lunch in the middle of a pink cloud.

I had my sketch book and did a few sketches for my art class homework. I also took several photos with my film camera. When I got my photos developed a few weeks later, I was so disappointed to look at my mountain photos. I had neglected to take any up close photos and only took a few pictures of the larger landscape (film was expensive so I had to be selective). None of the photos showed any of the peach trees. Instead of a pink flowery cloud, it just looked like a gray haze. You can't even see the mountains that were further away.

Playing with my new student grade paint today.   It's like an entirely different medium!

I can do light washes now!  I was experimenting with how to paint our sea horizon.   Each explores a different moisture management to see how the paint behaves.

And (almost)  all my new colours!

More than I ever expected to want, but I'm excited to see what they all do.

What is the stiff stuff on new brushes?

Interesting question! I want to know also

Regarding the shore, the ocean waves, it doesn't matter if the waves are crashing or peacefully rolling -

The clouds - mimic them. It's incredible. Sometimes you have to invert the colors.

I only use 2nd hand and up-cycled items as a "canvas"

My favorite is paper bags. The color makes such a wonderful background and it's absorbent and sturdy.

Peace,
Jo

r ranson wrote:
1. paint flat on a table or use an easel?

2. when using a sketchbook for painting outside, how to safely close it at the end?

3. am I supposed to be doing something to re-dry my palette after painting?

4. what other questions do I need to be asking?

Sorry I didn't see this thread before.
Now I want to answer your questions ... but I did not read what others answered. I'll read all after giving my own answers ;-)
1. I prefer to paint flat. If there's a table I'll use the table, if there isn't a table and I sit on my folding chair, I'll use my lap.
2. yes, there's always a part where the paint hasn't fully dried. And still you want to end painting and leave that spot. It helps fairly good to put a clean tissue or 'rag' in the sketchbook before closing it.
3. I don't do anything with my palette and never had any problem. It seems some brands get mouldy if you close the pallette while it's wet. Not the brands I use.
4. you can ask any question you want, at any moment.

r ranson wrote:What about paint safety?   Some of the colours are named for toxic substances.   Do they use cadmium in paint making?   Or is it just a name?

Cadmium was used, in the past. But since a few years all that's left is the name.

Mark Reed wrote:...  Anyway, here is the crappy "Moon Over Water".  

Mark, this doesn't look crappy to me! The person who saved it from the trash was right.

r ranson wrote:...New question.   Why do they tape the paper edges?  What are they taping it to?

Taping is when you use loose sheets of paper, not a sketchbook. It's done to prevent bulging of the paper (especially in thinner papers).
If you want that you need a large enough piece of a waterproof material (like plywood) to tape your paper on.

r ranson wrote:Is it normal for paintbrushes to have one or two hairs 1/8th inch longer than the rest?  They seem to get in the way of accuracy.  Are there paintbrush police,  or is it okay to cut the offending bristles?

Brushes made for watercolours are pointy. That means: not all hairs have the same length, the hairs in the middle are longer than the ones at the edges.
When the b rush is filled with wet paint you can make a large 'blob' by pushing it on to your paper, but you can also make a thin line with the point. Or you can combine both shapes to make a 'leave' shape.

r ranson wrote:Thanks for the link.  That's a great resource.  

and thank you for the help.

The bristles that stand out are a bit bent and curly so I can't convince them to put a line where I ask them to.  I think I'll cut it down so it's less than 1/16th of an inch longer.  1/8th to 1/4 inch is too long for my current skillset.

That I bought the brushes in a 12-piece set tells you pretty much all you need to know about the quality.  But they are hair/fir instead of nylon.  Although the description kept switching between squirrel and sable so I think they were having spell-check trouble as well.  They were affordable, and if I waited to save up enough to buy good quality stuff, I would never get to start.  

Of course you can do what you like, R. But still my advice is: start with buying one expensive watercolour brush. The best one you can afford, not too small and with a sharp point. Learn how to use it by practicing a lot. After some practice you can use a good brush for almost everything! Cheap brushes are frustrating!

r ranson wrote:Another question:  If you could only have 3 colours, what would be your favourite?

and the same for 5 colours?  

I'm looking to create a smaller pallet so I can travel with it easier and learn colour mixing.  

In my travel pallette there are 7 colours. Three is the minimum: red (I'd use magenta), blue and yellow. What blue and what yellow depends on your mood/ taste... Then I add a green (the kind of green that's hard to mix), a 'burnt umber' (that's a special kind of dark brown) and a 'gold' (that special shade of dark yellow, it can be ochre too). The seventh one is a kind of purplish grey.

r ranson wrote:Another question

So I paint a shape with water, then dab in wet colour.  The tutorials say the colour is supposed to spread around and some of the colours in this set do.  but a lot of them don't.  Most of them just stay where I put them and I have to flood the paper with an excess of water (make a big dome and risk the water running away from my shape).  Even then, I have to push the colour around as it won't spread out like on the tutorials I watch.

(edit to add: I tried different water colour paper - the one I know for sure is 110lb/230gsm)


I'm pretty sure I'm not supposed to need this much water.

Is it me or the paint?  

It can be the paint, or the paper. I found out that cheaper paper doesn't let the paint flow out very well.

I don't often use that method you describe. I mix my paint with a little water on the pallette and then start painting with it. Sometimes I wet the paper first, but most of my paintings are on dry paper.

r ranson wrote:Here's the latest - and yes, this is probably what I get for buying amazonbasics - but at under a dollar a tube of paint... well, got to start somewhere.

I opened the paint a few weeks ago, put some in my pans on my pallet.  Now I'm ready to refill some and I get the tubes, open them up, and the paint has separated.  The binder falls out of the tube, but the paint is icky.

I tried re-mixing the binder into the paint, but now the result is shiny paint which isn't what I want from watercolour.  

blotting out the binder juice and the result is hard to re-wet and doesn't flow in the water like it used to.

What's the solution?
if the only solution is to buy better paint, maybe check this out first

Yes, cheap paint is frustrating too, just like cheap brushes and cheap paper. I am sorry I was late in this thread. My advice is always: do not buy much, but buy the best (most expensive) materials you can afford. One small watercolour block, one brush, three colours of paint (can be in pans or in tubes), you do not need more to start with ... but they have to be of good quality.

r ranson wrote:can one watercolour paint on not-paper?  

You means something else that isn't paper? Yes, there's canvas for watercolours (looks like canvas for oil paints, but it's different) and there's some kind of plastic material to paint on. Both are very expensive.
You can paint on wood with watercolours. Maybe you can try that (any wood will do, I think)

Going on reading I saw you did already buy better paint. Now you have much more colours than I ever had! But I'm a typical 'outdoors' watercolorist (or even an 'urban sketcher'). I don't want to take more stuff with me than I need.

You are right you need a hat against the sun. If possible it's even better to sit in the shade of a tree or a building (but maybe then you do not see the view you want to paint).

Do you like to watch youtube videos? There's someone from the Netherlands, but she speaks good English, she has nice short videos on sketching and watercolour painting, her name is Koosje Koene. Some of her videos are tutorials, others are only 'tips', or she shows her sketchbook. https://www.youtube.com/@KoosjeKoene