Should I quit this position?

Hey everyone,

I do not know why I am having such a tricky time making this decision. I had been working doing farm projects for a wealthy couple up the street from where I live. They then asked me to be there farm manager and I said, sure? I have been a farm hand on and off for many years and love gardening but I have never been the one "in charge."  At this point there really is not that much to be in charge of. I am the only staff and the place is at ground zero. The couple wants cut flower and  pumpkins  for people to come and pick. The projects will expand from there.  The couple is nice enough but  a lot of what they want doesn't seem to have any real purpose, and they are always changing their minds. They use a lot of this "farm" for online content, making videos and taking photos and I don't mind I am sure not sure their property is where I want to be putting a lot of my time and energy. There is quite a large learning curve for me, I need to figure out the irrigation, how to drive a tractor, how to use implements, setting up a greenhouse...it is all stuff I would love to learn but for some reason it just doesn't feel right with them and I am having a case of imposter syndrome. I have told them numerous times that I don't  have a lot of experience being the "decision maker" but they don't seem to mind.  I don't know if I am just scared and making excuses or if I should tell them thank you for the opportunity but I don't think this is the position for me.  I feel like if I walk away I will be turning down a great opportunity but on the other hand I want to be working with like minded people, not mostly alone farming for people who might not care as much as I do. I sound like such a ninny but it would be great to hear peoples input. Perhaps you have been in a similar situation?  

It sounds like a good opportunity to learn new skills in a low pressure setting. You'd also have a management position to put on  a resume. Then you can take those skills to a job you actually care about. That's the practical part of me thinking.

On the other hand, I've never stuck with a job I didn't like for very long. And I've never regretted leaving.

To me, it sounds like you liked the job until you were given the decision-making aspect of it.

Taylor said, "I feel like if I walk away I will be turning down a great opportunity but on the other hand I want to be working with like minded people, not mostly alone farming for people who might not care as much as I do.

If I felt like you do about wanting to work with like-minded people then I would try to help the people I work with to become like-minded.  

I also would feel lucky to have a job like yours.

I would try offering some suggestions for projects that I want to do.  It can't hurt and all these people can do is say yes or no.

I like the idea of selling cut flowers and pumpkins though I am not sure about the "the people to come and pick" aspect.  I would suggest having a farm stand to sell them or find a market to buy them.

Taylor said, "There is quite a large learning curve for me, I need to figure out the irrigation, how to drive a tractor, how to use implements, setting up a greenhouse...it is all stuff I would love to learn but for some reason it just doesn't feel right.

For the irrigation part, I would study what I could find on the internet for "how to install an irrigation system", then I would go to a big box store to the irrigation department and look at what parts are for sale.  When the salesperson asks if they can help then I would ask lots of questions.

So these people have a tractor, I would then ask if they know how to drive a tractor?  If yes, then I would as them to show me how to drive it.  And the same with implements.

Okay for learning how to set up a greenhouse I would ask questions here on the forum.

You could almost ask questions here on the forum to learn all that stuff, too.

I think you have great opportunity your employer must see something in you I think you've a case of cold feet . Do your reasearch plan everything out basically think it thru you will be amazed at what your capable of if try.

...a lot of what they want doesn't seem to have any real purpose

Purpose is an interesting word, Taylor! The origin of the word relates to what one intends to do or be. Maybe imagining your ideal future would help you decide if this job will help you live into your purpose. Right now it sounds like you live down the street from the wealthy couple. Is your heart telling you to stay close to home or go on some adventure farther away and get new information? Are you happy staying on your street or are you restless and looking for new possibilities? Will you meet new people with this job or are you isolated? Without divulging too much personal info, what is your dream?

Have you seen the stuff from Joel Salatin?

He has a lot of specific content about pastured chickens etc... BUT there is also some content about his apprenticeship programme. He tasks his interns/apprentices with finding some way of adding additional income to his land. It is a key part of his mentorship, that they learn how to take ownership of an enterprise, and add value to it.

You aren't in love with this job because you have responsibility but not the control. Maybe ask if you can - within the remit of your job - add something specific that you care about that can add value?

You gain ownership of something you care about. They gain a new revenue stream that is valuable to their online presence. You keep the profits (share of?).

look i'll be honest... it sounds like they trust you and therefore are willing to throw $$ in your direction to keep up their "farm"

GOLDEN opportunity to learn any and all and get paid.. i think you are really just there to "keep the dream alive"... imposter or not i would double down, realize you are gonna make a BUCKETLOAD of mistakes without too much blowback or it affecting your bottom line..

BEST way to learn these skills... it is literally impossible to become adept at permaculture/homesteading/whatever without having an impressive list of failures.. in many cases mega-fails.. these add to your "pedigree" - stories to be swapped

so if you can get a jump on that list with minimal personal risk... i would go for it!!

you can meet plenty like minded people here when you post  "HELP!! I JUST BROKE THE ..."

i'd stick with it another year and then reassess - DO be careful not to injure yourself though -  best of luck!

^^ +1 on what James said ^^

What would you be giving up if you took this assignment? A better job perhaps? It's hard to beat a short commute like that.

The best way to learn management & leadership is to manage & lead.

My guess is you're more valuable to these folks than you realize. Don't sell yourself short. I think unless you just hate the job or have something better in mind give it a try to see how it goes from there. What do you have to lose?

I agree with the gist of the replies so far.

Try to re-frame the situation for yourself. Can you bring what you want to do into this situation? Think about your own goals, and talk to the owners. They might be interested to hear your ideas and supportive of taking it in a direction you are interested in.

I can understand the reluctance to making decisions when it's not "your" property, but if they're open to it, then you probably have a lot more freedom than it feels like.

I can hear your misgivings over this couple changing their mind a lot and not being like minded.  Maybe their business ideas won't work.  But it seems to me like you don't have much to lose.  What is the worst that can happen?  If it doesn't work out, you can leave, and you will have gained some useful experience even if it's confirmation of your gut feeling that it wasn't going to work.  You can put a positive spin on it in your resume.

I have been in a position myself where I worked for some people who were not like minded.  They did not respect or care for their animals or customers, but I was young and it was a valuable experience.  It was frustrating seeing how I would do things differently, though I did take some opportunities to try out my own ideas - they didn't care too much so long as it was cheap.

Maybe the only snag I can see is if you work for them for a while, then leave, you are looking for work locally where they have a poor reputation, and folk tar you with the same brush.

Or if animals are involved and you feel responsible and can't walk away.

Hello,

The main risk is lack of clear expectations,
You will need to set up clear expectations and talk about what you need to undertake the task properly!
I also recommend taking a 1 to 2 week break from your current Job to trial working at people up the road.

This will reduce risks!

I also recommend not burning any bridges with your current employer!

As to what you choose, Keeping clear expectations, ensuring you are provided with the resources and support to work properly is essential.

As is maintaining positive relations with your current employer is important!


Regards,
Alex.

I recently left a company which was like family, to go work at a company for really good money and opportunities! I found the new company to lack integrity and Respect. I found myself being publicly insulted for no reason by a senior, in terms of slander to my work ethic and sexist and homophobic remarks. I was then threatened for following directions. A director called me to his office and threatened termination based on what the senior staff member had said, so I just stood up and said thank you for the opportunity my gear will be in the store room and I will flick an email to accounts to let them know and Ill check right out of the Hotel!
Then did so, and emailed my past employer to let them know because they are listed as my references.
I have no Idea what was going on with that other company and that senior staff member and I do not care!
I could afford to be unemployed for a couple weeks and find new employment!

It is not uncommon for companies and people to not be a good fit!

I am also sure you know of many new owners and farmers employing staff and finding them to not be the right fit!

These reasons are why I suggested as above!

It sounds like a great opportunity but one that I think you need to be wise about!

It sounds like they could benefit from your influence. Propose what you want to do, what you would do with the place that would have 'purpose' in your eyes (in combination with their goals of cut flowers and a pumpkin patch).

If you aren't comfortable being the decision-maker, ask them to sign off on things - at least higher-cost or higher-risk decisions.

If you want to work with like-minded people, let them know that some tasks will require a second pair of hands (other than theirs? do they work off-site?) or someone with experience you don't have yet but could learn from, and then recommend a friend or two you'd like to work with at least occasionally.

It does sound like a good gig. Push yourself and gain those skills. You could even treat it like an internship and privately set a timeframe - 9 months, a year, 18 months. Learn all you can, save up some of the pay, and then you're in a better position to put your energy into what you actually want to do, whether at your own place or with another employer.

Hey Taylor, you've gotten a lot of good advice already, but I figured I'd add something about imposter syndrome.
When you work alone (or without a lot of helpful supervision, like constructive criticism, guidance, etc), imposter syndrome is a real thing. My field is famous for it (since most of us work independently with very rare feedback), and either we are a bunch of megalomaniacs or entirely consumed by our insecurity. It only took me about 10 years to get over it and realize that I do, in fact, know my shit and even if every once in a while a client is an absolute idiot, that rarely has a damn thing to do with my abilities.
If I were just starting out, I would try to do whatever I could to expand my skills (just like you're doing now, learning how to do all this new stuff) and document it. How about BBs or PEP badges? Or even just keep a diary of all the things you've learned how to do. Worst case scenario, you use this list to make your resume for the next opportunity; best case scenario you have a reminder that you do, indeed, know things. Many of us find ourselves in fake-it-til-you-make-it situations and after a while you figure it out and have a bit less doubt. Hang in there!

A lot of really good advice that are things I would have said if someone hadn't already :)

I think you're just nervous about having to learn a bunch of new things.  I've been there.  Every time I started a new job I felt that way for about a week or two until I got comfortable.  Not to invalidate your feelings at all, but I can tell you, the things you mentioned are not hard.  You can learn to drive a tractor in literally 10 minutes.  Will you learn to do it better and get more efficient?  Sure.  But the basics take next to no time.  Irrigation is pretty darned simple to.  It's just a bunch of hoses, either flexible or solid, and a mechanism to control the timing and amount of water.  I think it's just the title that scares you.  The job probably isn't much different than you are doing right now.

I learn a lot by doing. It holds my interest far better than just listening to someone ramble about what I want to do.  Watching them do is far better, but hands on is, when practical, safe and possible, the most effective method for me.  

For example, around thirty years back, I came to understand justice was a purchased thing. I knew I couldn't afford to purchase it.  I had figured out competent attorneys were a VERY rare thing, and that even competent ones tended to be only only as competent as they were paid to be. Subsequently, I did the only thing that was practical for me - I started teaching myself how to practice law.  

In the course of learning to practice law, I started a parents' rights group.  That involved teaching others. I learned a lot from teaching others. Things such as how to write documents, how to type fast and well, how to form arguments (how to BS better), how to research, and so on.  

COINCIDENTLY, around the early years of my self teaching, about three decades back, a man I'd helped escape the clutches of a dirt bag prosecutor asked me to watch his two hundred acre farm. My response was, "[n]o problem, where's the switch"?  

I spent the first several months, beginning at planting season, running the place. It was under two circles and included just enough orchard to be called an orchard. As such, I had to learn how to contract other farmers to plant the corn, write twenty thousand dollar checks for the electric and water deposit (i.e., got a REAL good idea of what it costs to make a little money), call in agents for fertilizer advice, sell hay and so on.

It was a real trial by fire, but it went well.  The farmer even said he did better on the orchard than ever before. I was quick to remind him of how good it could have gone - had he not had an idiot managing the orchard, he would have seen some real profits.     If nothing else, that part of the experience taught me a mere five acres that produced twenty thousand translated to a LOT of money, if one of the row crop fields was converted to orchard (e.g., nearly a half million, a few years in).

To paraphrase the above, if you invest yourself, this is a remarkable opportunity.

Hi Taylor.  

I'm curious, are you still mulling over your decision?      

Here are my observations, trying to look at items not yet covered by other posts:

-My 2 cents is in framing this in terms of your personal risk for income (i.e. this is your full time job and income), or your health. If something goes south with your relationship, what happens to you?   If this is part-time or volunteer on your part, this risk is minimized.   Is this a formal position with job responsibilities?  

-If you get hurt (or crash the tractor), do the farm owners have insurance that covers these?   Or are you an individual worker that the risk is yours?

-Things like the tractor require regular maintenance (greasing every xx hours), will this be your responsibility and do you know which things you are responsible for?     If, for instance, there is a mower that the owners also use for their lawn (I'm imagining they have a house on the property), then if you use the mower for the farm who is responsible for the maintenance schedule?

-What *are* their priorities? If it's so they can post a social media post every xx days, then knowing that might reduce the see-saw of decision making --- after all, any project on the farm that takes longer than they expect might require you to QUICK find another thing they can post on (which would in this scenario explain some see-saw decisions, and would also help you propose projects or steps that support their schedule).

-Assuming they are paying you, will they pay you for the time to do the research? If they keep changing their mind after you've started research on a project, this could be very time consuming on your part.   Are they paying you for successful outcomes?  For instance, I pay the plumber to fix the toilet, not to learn how to fix the toilet or to fix it only to have it not work again shortly thereafter.  Think about how you set their expectations for outcomes when it's something you're also learning...

-If you decide to go ahead with it, there's a possible way of managing expectations -- and I believe it's in use at Wheaton labs --which is a "Kanban" style of prioritization that clearly shows what's in progress.   This *might* be a good way of keeping up with their shifting priorities, since they can easily shift the priority of anything that's unstarted with no impact, but if it's something you've started they at least see what other tasks they are impacting.  

 

Hi,  There has been a lot of good advise people have given here.  Something to consider. What is your relationship to the "Wealthy Owners."  Are they a sweet old couple you like and like to be around, but do not want to jeopardize the relationship? Are they aloof?  Do you get along with them with some friction involved? I assume you like working for them and they like you.

Yet there is a difference in working for someone and working with someone.  There is also the inbetween.  While working the flower and pumpkin ideas, maybe you can improve the farm with sustainable ideas and maybe improve profits. Or maybe the farmers do not care much about profits and are using the farm for community enrichment.

So, find the why they are farming, and does your why fit with theirs, even partially, and maybe by working With them your why and theirs will become closer and you have a dream job.  Remember, anyone can work, manage, make a profit.  Doing it while having Peace and Joy, even in the bad places, is worth more in life than anything. Therefore talking with them and being open and honest is best.