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That is pretty close, Nicole. No shoulder capelet.
 
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r ranson, do I ever want to take classes from you! : )
 
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Nicole Alderman wrote:

Did it look something like this? (was looking Hudson Bay's Wikipedia site and saw this)



Lol i did exactly the same thing this afternoon and saw that exact same picture
 
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r ranson wrote:A few weeks ago, some people on the internet really pissed me off.  I went to a forum (not permies) to ask a very specific question about a project I wanted to make.  In response, I got hammered with a crap-load of everything I'm doing wrong and how my whole project is impossible. 

This kind of behaviour in public really bothers me.  It's not just that the poor poster will turn around and give up on their dream, but the hundreds or thousands of people reading that thread won't ever try it.  They will warn their friends about how impossible it is.  That it can't be done.

The funny thing is, humans, have been doing exactly this thing I wanted to do since... well you know that whole agriculture thing that someone thought up; take that day and go back three times as far, and you're almost there.  We've been doing this thing since then all the way through to the 1970s when suddenly - poof! - it is now impossible and everyone stopped doing it.  Everyone except the rest of the world who didn't know any better and kept on doing it. 

Thanks to the internet, I now know that it is impossible.  So what do I do about it?  Do I scream?  Do I stalk these people online and tell the world how horrible they are?  Do I sit and sulk?

Nope. 

I turn off my computer. 

It's been off for about two weeks now.  Every night, for about 4 hours a night, I do the impossible. 

I go to my sheep and ask him for some wool.


I take this wool and spin it into yarn. 


The yarn I make is handspun singles (which means it is unplyed).  This is the type of yarn that cannot be used for weaving because it is too sticky and weak.  The internet is animate on this "known fact".

I take this yarn and I put it on my loom.  I abuse it in every way, putting impossibly tight tension on it, beating it harshly, all the things that must never be done to non-commercial non-synthetic yarn. 



I have less problem with my handspun yarn than I've ever had with any commercial yarn. 

It's turned into beautiful fabric and I can't wait to make clothing with it.


My anger at these people is now transformed into proving them wrong.  By now, I've forgotten who it was I was so angry at.  I'm not even angry at them anymore because I have a beautiful fabric and I have loads of photos and I know at least two magazines that like my writing style and may be interested in publishing my story which will inspire people to stop believing the 'truth' about handspun yarn and start making their own beautiful clothing. 

All this because of what I learned on permies: How to make the world a better place instead of being angry at bad guys. 

Thank you everyone here for being so awesome!




Wow!  All I can say is that this post, that wool and that super sweet little lamb is just the best thing that I've read and seen for a long time.  Thank you for sharing R Ranson!  I would LOVE to have some wool like that.  Maybe one day I'll get a little sheep that super sweet loom and support your Natural Wool Cloth Making 101 Kickstarter video.  Hint, hint.  Love to you from "Southest" Georgia.
 
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Raven, I thought you wrote  somewhere that you are weaving on an Ashford table loom, and now I can't find where it "is" written.Maybe I made it up, but maybe not, so could you please post what kind of loom it is in these photographs, and did you also say it will fit under a table or bed or out of the way?  These are mighty attractive ideas to me. Thanks
 
Deb Rebel
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She mentions it about 2/3 down on the first page of this topic.

Ashford table looms....

https://woolery.com/weaving-looms/looms-by-manufacturers/ashford-looms/ashford-table-looms.html?gclid=COvi24-q2dQCFc62wAodvpYAag

Yewotch and DROOL....
 
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i'm convinced that hate is a very inefficient form of love.

Say that for some belief conflict - i hate someone. They despise permaculture, say. So i argue, i yell, i discuss, i bring proof, i.... you know what you do when you have to convince your important peeps - you do what you can to have them not make your life harder in permaculture.

As they learn something and start to mellow out - you (i) don't hate them so strenuously. As they understand the sanity of permaculture more and more (or Buddhism, or whatever floats your boat) you find their veiwpoints more in line with what you believe. They don't upset you nearly as much, nor you them. Soon you are at the level where you can discuss instead of preach and rant. If they end up going so far as to start studying and practicing permaculture - they become friends, and perhaps dear friends.

Look at all that time and energy we spent hating them and working SO HARD to turn them into people whom we would find it easy to love.

If i were halfway awakened, i'd just start loving those people that irritate me and then see if we can meet on the discussions and thought levels....
 
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Thekla McDaniels wrote:Raven, I thought you wrote  somewhere that you are weaving on an Ashford table loom, and now I can't find where it "is" written.Maybe I made it up, but maybe not, so could you please post what kind of loom it is in these photographs, and did you also say it will fit under a table or bed or out of the way?  These are mighty attractive ideas to me. Thanks



What I wave on is a four shaft, 32 inch, Ashford table loom with treadle stand.  I love it.  It's the perfect match for me.

I've had over a dozen looms over the years and all of them hurt me to weave on.  I gave up on weaving completely until I met the Ashford table loom at a festival.  No pain weaving!  Easy to use!  I'm in love.  It's small, portable, folds up, but is strong enough for daily weaving.  Finally, loom makers are starting to understand that people with limited space also want to weave.  Before, table looms were for workshops and children, but now, they are seriously awesome for daily weaving.

4 shaft ashford table loom

I got the 32 inch because I want to weave clothing cloth from my handspun yarn.  I think I could be content with the 24", but someone convinced me to go up a size.  The 32" has been quite useful and I'm glad I did.  It's about as wide a cloth as I need, and I can always sew two pieces together if I need wider. 

I may upgrade to a floor loom in a few years, if (big if) I can find one that doesn't hurt me to weave on.  On the Ashford table loom with treadle kit, I can weave for about 5 hours streight, on the floor looms and other table looms  I've had, I can only weave for about 20 minutes before needing to walk around. 

If you're ever in the market for a loom, try out as many as you can before investing in one.  Each loom is different and each make has it's own style.  It's really important to have a loom that matches you. 

Yewotch and DROOL....



Oh yes!  I did have to get a job to save up enough to afford it (only loom I've bought new) - but boy oh boy, it's worth every cent.  My loom is my independence - or it will be once I start making my own clothing.  Like khadi, it's my way of fighting against what I see as broken in our world.


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ashford table loom with treadle stand
 
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I read this post from top to bottom, it jumped around a bit, but was pretty good. From the managing anger by proving the people who say it can't be done wrong to the most wonderful picture of the Hudson Bay blanket coat. ( I am now inspired to make one out of one of the many wool army blankets kicking around here.along with a pair of basic wool pants. And not for looks lol ,,,larry
 
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brad roon wrote:i'm convinced that hate is a very inefficient form of love. ...
... Look at all that time and energy we spent hating them and working SO HARD to turn them into people whom we would find it easy to love.
If i were halfway awakened, i'd just start loving those people that irritate me and then see if we can meet on the discussions and thought levels....


Brad, this could well be right! I think that's a reason why Jesus said we have to 'pray for our ennemies' (and even love them! See Matt. 5:44).
Raven Ranson's way, doing an activity proving you are right, I think works much better than yelling, irritating, saying (in words) the other is wrong!
 
Thekla McDaniels
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Hi Raven,
Thanks for the great write up on the ashford loom.

I learned to spin on an Ashford wheel in about 1969, in Sydney New South Wales (Australia).  There was a woman in the basement of the department store demonstrating. I bought the wheel,brought her my first handspun and she coached me about dying.  (Eucalyptus bark or leaves,and I think no mordant is needed)   I brought her my first dyed wool as well.  Not a knitter,I had to make a loom to weave.... nails on the ends of a fruit crate for a placemat, then stretchingthe yarn across the room before returningto the end of the box,to make a longer warp.  I'm not sure where those pieces ended up, so many years ago,but I go way back with Ashfords, though I did not know about these looms.

Right now I have a nilus le clerc, second or third hand,I had to make repairs on.  I am weaving some old sllk on it,but think I'll pass it along.  It doesn't create pain in my body to use it,nor has any of the ~ dozen looms I've owned in the last half century, but I am moving to a much smaller place, and in the interim everything is going in to storage.

I have a friend with a smaller floor loom which is coming my way after the move, I can't remember make or size,but my guess is it is a "reputable" and old make in great condition.  

Your glowing recommendation, and great photos make this fold up Ashford table loom with treadle kit  mighty attractive to me,plus it is clear that you have a tremendous amount of experience and skill with spinning, weaving and probably much more,making it a safe bet you know what you are talking about when it comes to looms.

One more question:  would you say the set up you have can stand up to the heavy beating that goes in to rug making?

Thanks again.Thekla


 
r ranson
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Thekla McDaniels wrote:
One more question:  would you say the set up you have can stand up to the heavy beating that goes in to rug making?



Sort of.  It can take a heavy beating, but I wouldn't want to weave rugs all the time.

With a table loom, everything is lighter, so beating heavily takes more energy from the weaver.  With a floor loom, the beater is heavy so the momentum does a lot of the work.  For those of you who don't know what I'm talking about, think hammer vs mallet.  Hammers work great for nails, but for big pegs, they take more work than a mallet.

Also, the width of the loom makes it good for small rugs, but for larger ones, we have to sew the bits together. 

I wouldn't hesitate to say that it's good for the occasional rug. 
 
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brad roon wrote:i'm convinced that hate is a very inefficient form of love.



Many moons ago (about 2 decades) I took a psychology class where the textbook said that biochemically love and hate are the same, the difference is how your brain interprets it. I think there was a bit in there about that may be why some divorces are so nasty, passionate love turned to passionate hate.
 
Thekla McDaniels
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Thanks R.

As for the love hate discussion that is running parallel to the weaving discussion, I'll say this.  I've always thought that either love OR hate is just a measure of another's importance to us.  How important?  Very important. 

I was treated very badly as a child, (as in criminal sorts and degrees of abuse), and decided that I did not wish to spend the days of my life nor the passion of my heart on one who had treated me so badly.  Unrepentant, in fact outright denying any transgressions against me, he did not deserve any more of my time or attention.  It took awhile, but I came to the point that I neither loved nor hated my father.  He existed in the same world as I did, but I did not have to allow him any more importance than he had already had, as the "daddy" of my formative years.  It took courage, work, focus and concentration to hold to a course that was not influenced by him in the present.  My magic question to myself was always:  "What do I want the rest of my life to be about?"

And anger?  I have come to believe it is a matter of someone violating my values, and acts as a way of getting my attention, so that I can take what ever action I decide is best for me.  If I had done as Raven has reported, I would feel pretty satisfied with my efforts. 

Raven, I am interpreting your thread as evidence of your satisfaction with the outcome, and I hope you DO feel satisfied. 
 
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Just wanted to drop by and say that I love this thread and all the discussion going on !
I've come to believe that truly being told that something is 'impossible' can be such a huge push to actually make you do this very thing - quite often.
I do not like to hold anger too much neither, as someone said earlier in this thread : I consider that it takes too much energy to actually actively hate/be angry at someone/something... but this initial anger [I mean, we're all humans, right ? We can't avoid feeling angry sometime], if transformed in something else, can be turned into something quite interesting and positive. For example, here : weaving !
Maybe anger sometime is just this sort of starting fire and that it just is, a natural reaction to something, but that then it's up to us to see how we'll use it, either dwell in it and not do anything, or evolve this feeling into something else and makes something out of it... Just as fire can be used to keep warm or used for destruction ? Or something like that. Maybe it's too early here to be thinking about such huge subjects as 'anger' haha.
 
r ranson
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These last couple of weeks have given me both ends of the spectrum.

I met some people who were an absolute inspiration.  Every time they were told 'it's too hard' or 'that's impossible' they went and tried it for themselves and made their own decisions.  Brilliant!

And now I'm wrestling with one person who's leading a group into the 'it's too much work' trap.  AGAIN!  Well tough.  It's not too much work for me, but it will go one heck of a lot faster if we did it together.
 
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I love this fabric...rustically sophisticated. A throw rug for the couch would be great!
 
Deb Rebel
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So, RR, how is it going, what has happened to that gorgeous fabric.

One other I used to do and am getting back to. I buy 12 and 14 gauge bare copper wire (mostly 14 gauge). Then bend into various shapes, mostly repeating pattern in 5-7 inch lengths. Then. when I need some release, put on the hearing protectors, the face shield, and take them to the 150# farrier anvil I 'inherited' many moons ago (that was a very good swap trade),  and beat them into a curve, flattening the wire and putting a hammered finish to them, making them into copper arthritis bracelets. Massively good WHACKTHERAPY.

Second best to that is to get something sharp and go out and do the weeding. That one always seems to need doing.

Back to Topic... how is Larry doing, is he growing you another nice fleece, and what did you do to that fabric? Pictures dear, pictures.
 
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I do not understand allowing others to influence you.  Let knowledge guide you and not information as their is a difference.

A video to help put that in perspective by one drop forward.
 
Deb Rebel
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Well I found a whole bunch of bracelet blanks in a box so I went and did some righteous whacktherapy.

I found my ancient set of tablet cards I made out of old coca cola soda can case boxes. And a project I'd forgotten about. Trying to do the 'archeology' version of (emptying old boxes) to figure out how long that one has sat around. Looks like I was really going for it too. (acrylic yarn in light tan, black, maroon, forest green)

Any progress on stuff with that shop, or the publish effort, or even, what did you do with that fabric, RR?
 
Deb Rebel
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Been waiting for this... thought of Larry when I seen stuff about this and found the pictures again. Larry, meet Shrek. He is a wether merino that decided to hide out when they gathered everyone to shear. They had a master shearer drop his fleece and it was said Shrek was pretty good about it. (Shrek passed away several years ago at the age of 16. He had gotten something and treatment was too prohibitive so it was decided t put him down). That fleece would keep you busy for a while, RR? I think that's 5 or 6 years...

Larry is a happy sheep, well loved by the look of it, and he shared some great wool by the look of it.

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Front view
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Side view
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Peeling the sheep
 
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Raven, Deb, and others,

please hurry with those clothes you are making for me from your beyond-organic gardens.  This morning I found the following fine print inside my new shirt, sewn in with the care tags.  (Ok, it's mostly my fault--I knew I was buying a poly shirt.)

P.S.  this is the Being-angry-at-bad-guys Anonymous thread, right?
chemistry-shirt.jpg
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Shirt Chemistry
 
r ranson
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Oh WOW! 

That's some shirt. 

Thanks for motivating me.  I had best get back to my dye bath.  I'm finishing up some logwood (as disappointing a colour as it is environmentally damaging - never buying that again).  Then it's an indigo vat to overdye the sad logwood colour. 


I spent yesterday demonstrating spinning and weaving at the fall fair.  We get about 1000 to 3000 people at our demo each year.  I'm guessing about 2200 this year.  Over 80% had never seen this kind of crafting before.  Maybe 50% never imagined clothing could be made by hand.  5% had tried spinning or weaving before and 0.1% is interested in (re)learning how. 

That last number, that makes my heart so happy!  That number seems to double every year. 

 
Kerry Rodgers
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Oh, never mind--the US gov't says there's nothing to worry about:  link.  Ha!

Congrats on the fair, R.  I'm always amazed at fibre arts demos, myself.  I know lots of people ranging from moderately skilled to highly skilled at sewing, knitting, etc.--my wife for one.  And I know a few people who raise or have raised fibre animals.  But I only see those amazing people who can bridge that gap in the supply chain at fairs, it seems.  Too time consuming, too tedious, too many expensive+rare tools--you know the excuses. 

On a family road trip in 2012 we stopped at the Settler's Museum in SW Virginia.  They had an intriguing exhibit showing the steps to grow flax and make it into cloth.  They made it sound easy (at least, easier than I had imagined).

I definitely think there is a need for people like you to bring fibre more into the mainstream.  Book, online-course, I don't know...  But like someone said above:  Hint, hint!

 
Deb Rebel
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I took up torchon bobbin lace, and made three pillows. One is a huge fan with a couple of sliding block inserts to do the work on, the fan is to hold bobbins (400 pairs, it was a special project made on it) One looks kind of like an oatmeal box (it is) that spins at the end of a short pad to hold bobbins, and the third is a sliding block set with short pad. At outdoor events, take your cotton thread and run about 8" an inch wide, SEW the end and nail it down so it hangs down past the oatmeal drum. Let everyone finger that. It's going to get FEEELTHEEE (filthy) and you can work on the drum (smart me made a channel under to pull work back and stash it out of the way of grubby paws). LOTS of people will watch, and tell others there's someone making lace. Great draw. At the end of event, cut off that 8" and roll up the rest and sell it at the next one.

I'm wondering if some of that Larry wool you show, would work. It'd have to be thin single ply and pretty smooth.... hm. Wool lace. Would be unique.
 
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If one looks up on google:  "Hudson Bay Blanket Coat Pattern"  or simply "capote coat pattern", you will come up with enough info for the coats.  I have seen these made at primitive skills events, of which some rendezvous type folks attend and occasionally teach; the groups have a lot of overlap.  The events I went to were not black powder events, but more focused on Stone Age Skills, predating European contact.
 
Roberto pokachinni
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oops.  I didn't realize there was a page two.  People near the end of page 1 of this thread were discussing patterns to the Hudson Bay Coat. 
 
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r ranson wrote: - poof! - it is now impossible and everyone stopped doing it.  Everyone except the rest of the world who didn't know any better and kept on doing it. 



My parents have accomplished quite a few "impossible" things, and R. made me laugh above, because my Dad's response is always "I guess I was too stupid to know it couldn't be done."  hehe  Like the non-potters in the story a ways above.  Wonderful.

I've done my own fair bit of the impossible, too.  Healing teeth, was probably the most amazing to me and my husband.  It is remarkable how much people will cling to their beliefs and try to push their perception of reality on you.  I read somewhere that when people (especially family) tell you that you can't do something - it's usually because they themselves don't believe they could do it.  That helped me to have more compassion for people who try to discourage me.  Particularly family members, where I think most people are more sensitive.

One of my current "won't work/impossible" projects is making a shower and shower pan with a concrete finish.  I have talked to numerous contractors and concrete companies in my search for a good, code compliant product to finish the surface of the shower.  I've been told it's too porous, it's too soft, and "nobody does that".  My response to those guys has been to ask if they can tell me how most school showers are made?  Seriously.

In the end, I used a different method, one that has served me best over the years since the internet miraculously sprang forth.  I look for people who have done, or done something similar to, what I want to accomplish.  So, I went on houzz.com and looked up concrete showers, and searched through the tons of examples for one that was done in California and disclosed what product they used.  I ended up finding two products in my search, and two other methods that would work (in a less code-regimented region).

I do love the internet, even with all the bridges with trolls underneath them.    Remembering when my access to knowledge was limited to people I knew and the librarian's taste... ahh, this is so great now.  Thank you to all of you out there who continue to share about your impossible doings.

 
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I also mainly turn anger into making something... The problem is that is makes it so easy to act with this free fuel, that I have problems to use other fuels!

Travis Johnson wrote:when a caring person is accused of the opposite, it can make you mad. I say this because I know.


Sometimes I think that it is not even worth the effort to behave well, as there will always be somebody to accuse you and "kill" you.

Travis Johnson wrote:My only outside-the-box advice on anger might be to look into medical causes for rage and anger. I know I was seething inside for a long time and thought MAYBE my anti-seizure drugs were to blame, but that was not it. Ultimately I found out my Pituitary Gland is not functioning which is causing a loss in hormones which is causing me to be extremely agitated. Now I say all this in the present tense because my hormone levels are not right yet and I am better, but not where I should be. So it might be a medical condition causing irritability too.



There is something even easier, as all hormone system is triggered by the autonomic nervoys system (ANS). There can of course be some medical causes, but usually, the medical cause comes from the bad state of the ANS!

Rage is just a higher temperature of anger. What is anger? A fuel to get a better fight response. So it means that the fight response failed, was unefficient or impossible (even if you have a good reason to fight, you might end up in prison, so you don't, also when you are a bit human with fellow other humans...)
Now just look at fear: a fuel to better go away! Flight response. If you are efficient at fleeing, you have no fear. if it does not work...

If anger tends to stick to you, look at the underlying level: it just means you have some fight response still running on at autonomic level. Somatic work frees the bound energy and give it back to you for being creative. Conscious and unconciuous parts of us have to work together for doing it.

It is IMPOSSIBLE FOR MOST PEOPLE, but animals are able to do it! (Don't say you have done it, animals do it 20 times a day, it is never done forever.)
 
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chicken food preservation hugelkultur
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I'm glad you didn't listen to them. That looks similar to something my mother has done in the past. Keep it up the great work.
 
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To the OP.... this is my first post on this site, and you have inspired me to try weaving with some singles that I've spun. I've also heard that it can't be done.  If my two ply handspun can stand up to weaving then why can't my singles?  after all, when you ply, you are taking some of the twist out of the singles, so they should be about as strong as a two ply.  expecially if you are worsted spinner.
 
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This video spoke to me :  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOubCHLXT6A
It advocates "exiting" from negative situations, just as you did when faced with negative comments, by shutting off your internet access.  Such exit strategy can be as drastic as emigrating from a country with a repressive regime, or as minor as shutting off one's internet access for a time.  People who have never tried something are often quick to say it can't be done.  I crocheted a bunch of hats a decade ago from dog fur wrapped around a single strand of acrylic yarn, entirely by hand, literally using only my fingers, no spinning wheel.  They are the warmest hats you could ever imagine.

Your yarn and woven cloth are beautiful, and so is your volunteer sheep.
 
r ranson
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I had an event today that reminded me of this thread. 

This time last year, I got in trouble because I had a success at doing something and this made people feel bad.  They got pretty grumpy about this and a whole bunch of pains and things followed. 

For a while, I felt this was my fault.  But then one day I had a dream about it and woke up understanding I was just doing what I was asked.  It's not my fault they didn't ask this other person who felt she deserved to do this thing.  Nor is it my fault that I did the job so well, I now have other people asking me to do this task.  Many of them repeat customers.

I am starting to suspect that I might not suck at this task.

Or maybe not suck as much as I thought I did.

And yet, whenever certain people discover I'm succeeding at these tasks, things happen from them that are designed to make me feel small. 

The actions of two people, in particular, destroyed something that was beautiful and had the power to change our small corner of the world for the better.  This makes me miffed. 

I've been miffed about this for about a year now.  But last winter, I got angry... and this was good.  Because that anger then transformed into something I think is amazing.  It's been a lot of work creating this.  I was beginning to wonder why I was doing it.  But then today happened.  Now I have all the energy I need to see this to the end. 

Thank you, humans, for being so... human. 
 
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