Nomadic Housing

I've just created a new section for discussing Nomadic Housing.

I'm really interested in temporary dwellings like yurts, knock up knock down structures, tents, house on wheel, caravans, shepherds huts, all sorts of structures that are pertinent to the nomadic lifestyle. I thought this might be a fun topic to explore.

What do you think about when you think Nomadic Housing?

R Ranson wrote:What do you think about when you think Nomadic Housing?

I remember the sheep camps that came through town when I was a kid... They resembled covered wagons, except that the sides were metal instead of fabric, and they had modern rubber tires. I ate a meal in one when I was a child. We called the shepherds that used them the Basque Gypsies.

My mobile housing has often been a vehicle... A member of my family often used to say that I lived in my truck. Perhaps I did. I certainly carried enough food, water, clothes, and bedding in it at all times that I could spend the night wherever I happened to be without worrying about my safety or well being. My family has most often used camper shells that slip into the back of a pickup.

I'm also interested in this because in so many locations, permanent dwellings are taxed but temporary or movable ones are not. Eventually I would like the possibility of having more people live on our land, but by deed restriction we can't build a permanent dwelling smaller than 750 sq feet. And we're not supposed to live in mobile homes or RVs either, but yurts and tiny houses on trailers are not "mobile homes" or "RVs" (and it's not like any of the neighbors would actually care anyway).

It would be keen if there were groups of permies traveling the country stopping in to stay for awhile on other permies' land!

a farmer I know in my area has at least three old truck campers that he has spread out on his property for Wwoofers to have a home of their own while working at his place. I have one of my own. It's not an RV, or mobile home. It's a great option, particularly if the old camper still has enough integrity to put on a truck and move somewhere else on the land. I lived in my camper van, or my tent, or under a tarp for years, and have a school bus on my land, and an old motorhome. I'm well on my way to being a village without people. My land, apart from my occasional visits like tomorrow, is presently unoccupied, except by critters like voles.

I like the idea of the permie gypsy that Tyler brings up.

There is an actual Gypsy culture that is authentic, and some of them take offence to the appropriation of their name toward the generic nomadic nature that we refer to it as. Just thought I'd mention that.

As a retired hobo, when I think of nomadic living I think of what I can carry on my back. I have traveled all over the United States with an entire kitchen, including food and bedroom in a day pack.

For me, it's a van full of tools, with a bed. I've spent more than a decade all together, living in vehicles at demolition projects and other job sites. Vans beat cars, trucks and tents, in every way that I know of.

I always liked the idea of a caravan. I love the idea of a yurt, although my wife is prejudiced against round structures (no flat wall to put things against bugs her). Not sure how I would like the reality. When I was single, living out of a car wasn't too tough. I think it would be now, being older and less flexible. The biggest difference though in my thinking now is kids.

I think a single person or even a couple might be fine, but I wonder how fun it would be with several kids. I may find out when I retire. My wife and I are looking at selling out and heading out to Spokane or Couer de Len and starting a new permaculture homestead because it looks like all our kids are probably going to end up out west. Still have four kids at home, although that will probably be whittled down some maybe in two years.

This was the original plan for the group on my extra 5 acres. They would build tiny homes on wheels. some would move them to Arizona in the winter. During the 1960's we had our VW vans and busses which we could live in while we were back and forth between here and Glen county California.
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When I was growing up in southcentral Alaska in the 70's there were quite a few families, some with lots of kids, living in school buses in the area. They heated them with woodstoves.

I've suggested this to my wife but she isn't really sold. Whatever you do to them, most of them look like someone tried to convert a schoolbus.

They do have a couple of great advantages. Old ones can be price fairly reasonably and they have lots of floor space.

Gas mileage isn't that good though.

This is a great topic.
I am currently working hard to finish up my own tiny home, on the back of my one-ton flatbed truck. It even has a name, Oliver's Nest. Every unusual home should have a name, imho.

Where I live, you don't ever see nomadic people. Tiny homes are our version, I guess. Here in the Pacific northwest, they are getting more common, our way of expressing a desire for the nomadic lifestyle, I'm sure.

I have 20 acres of land over in Eastern Washington state that I'd like to see other people be able to enjoy, probably mostly in the summer months as it's in a mountainous and very snowy region. I'll be spending time there myself, when I'm not busy traveling and seeing new places.

When I first started my business many moons ago, I sold my yarns and handmade products at about 30 events a year. I bought a VW Eurovan (20 mpg) and a Panther pavilion, single pole, something one person can setup alone. I did shows across America from Phoenix, AZ to Trenton, NJ. Some were reenactments or renaissance fairs, some were art shows, and some Sheep and Wool festivals. As I've gotten older, a way to combine the two, like a gypsy wagon is more appealing. I've seen a few made where displays and living space are combined. Not sure if I can still find a reasonable vehicle to pull such a trailer but maybe someday. Shows change from year to year, online sales have replaced a few shows but nomadic housing is high on my watch and learn list. Pounding stakes into hard ground is not something I want to do each week as I approach 60 years old. Yurts for my use, are not practical as each square foot has a price tag set by the festival. There is simply too much wasted space. So I shall watch this discussion with interest.

Before we had kids we were on the road with an old farm 1&1/2ton gmc with a woodstove in the back that we traveled in with all of our belongings and foods as well as craft show supplies ect . Now I am on 5 acres welcoming people to come stay and help in exchange for rent free with food exchange for labor I have a cottage an rv and a pop up camper that I use when I travel . It fits inside a pickup and holds everything you need. the advantages is that it travels like a pickup not a camper and can be left in a spot and put the truck to work. . I spent my early 20s living very lean traveling all over the country .

My friend meets a variety of women at night spots. He's a skilled couch and bed surfer. He somehow manages to work his way from casual acquaintance to house guest, even when there is no personal relationship developing. It can go from a few days, to several weeks.

They should do a reality show on couch surfing. Love them or despise them, people would watch.😀

I love the different ideas on what 'nomadic housing' is. When I first started this thread, I was thinking of structural dwellings that would stay in place for a week or even a few years, but were easily (easy being a relative term of course) moveable from one spot to another.

The diversity of your answers to what nomadic housing is, is very inspiring.

No one's mentioned emergency shelters yet. I think there are some really interesting ideas out there.

Most of the SCA members I know here have their pavilion (big canvas tent thingy) as part of their earthquake kit. If their house falls down, the tent and other camping supplies are stored somewhere easy to dig out. They plan to live with their families in their pavilion which isn't as uncomfortable as it sounds as they have lots of experience using their pavilions in all weather settings.

A vagabond/homeless or lazy bones, squatters camp has sprung up in Victoria. Conditions range from squalid to splendid, depending on who you talk to. Some of the structures use wood scrounged from my demolition project.

My brother knows 2 residents. They hope to set up their own little country. Of course they'd need regular imports of food, clothing, fuel ... from Canada. 😂 Their chief exports seem to be muddy clothing, wet blankets and STDs (super tired dudes)

nomadic living, I think makes a person belong to the land rather than having land belong to them. I think nomadic means moves at least twice a year. (not by the dictionary, but by practicality)

in eugene there has been a lot of interest in making something for the homeless and itinerant farmer types.

one thing has been conestoga hut, please google conestoga hut, eugene oregon to see about this. it is a modern day version of the conestoga wagon, not always on wheels in eugene.

another has been a combination of a yurt and a dome, made from scraps of plywood. the bottom is round like a yurt up to maybe 3 feet and then the top is like a dome. I lived a 10 foot diameter in one of these over a winter and heated it only with a 100 watt light bulb. the coldest it got was 20 degrees and i am fairly tolerant of cold. no one believed me but finally someone said that dome's bounce the heat back into the space. the neat thing is that the pieces are small and therefore can be made from plywood that would normally go to the dump.

Hi All... I build Gypsy Wagons, that have solar power, lights , music, pressurized running water, (40 gallon water tank), propane stove, propane radiant heater and double bed, pull out table and small closet, with lots of storage under the bed.... They can be pulled by a 4 cylinder engine... light weight and easy to tow. In fact I am building another one now..... they sell for $10K- $14K sunnybabaspirit@yahoo.com

thanks sequoia, these are lovely. maybe a modified dome one one of these days to conserve heat?

Can't afford land right now so we went with the nomadic option as well. Couldn't not have a garden so we built a towable greenhouse!



Complete with solar electricity, solar heated water, full kitchen, composting toilet, outdoor shower, and five beds. Also runs on used cooking oil. Free (or rather cheap) travel! Still, wouldn't mind a larger garden.





Check out more photo's and info at LivingEarthEasy.org

Cheers!

-Reilly

Hi Everybody... Here are a few more gypsy wagon styles that I build... for the wandering romantic, who wants to be at Home, where ever you are.....

Sunny Baba wrote:Hi Everybody... Here are a few more gypsy wagon styles that I build... for the wandering romantic, who wants to be at Home, where ever you are.....

Those are gorgeous! Can you tell us more? What sort of system do they have, how are they heated, is there a kitchen? So many questions. Maybe you need your own thread to share with us how awesome your wagons are.

Hello again... just to answer a few questions about the Gypsy Wagons I build... I build them as simple or as complicated as you want to afford... they can be canvas covered, with just a single or double bed and a small closet and a small counter top with sink and a two burner propane cook top..... basically a camping trailer.... these run about $8K OR as complicated as a solid, wooden roof with skylights over the bed and the kitchen.... with 12 volt solar panel mounted on the top... 12vt pressurized running water at the sink,... 30-40 gallons water storage tank, (under the bed) and solar lights, music and computer power, propane stove with oven, 2 way RV fridge..... and closet, plus storage under the bed..... stained glass windows, as well as two fresh air slider windows.... and propane radiant Heater... pull out table top, with seats for two.... these run $14K-$15K..... or they can be anywhere in between these two... with different options installed.... all are light weight, built from the frame up... with a tubular steel framework... some are insulated, some are not... depending on how you want to use them.... all are street legal.... with turn signals, brake lights, running lights, ..... some have electric brakes.. etc. I have lived and traveled in these wagons for 15 years, camped by varies undeveloped Hot Springs, through out the western states..... so they are built from practical long term camping experience..... my contact info; sunnybabaspirit@yahoo.com Here are a few more photos....

IF this isn't appropriate, please move to where it belongs...it's an Indian design school using Bucky's ideas to make cheap, movable shelter.
http://www.chhat.org/

airstreem new basecamp tiny house




very slick, kind of space age.

This started as a school bus forum 10 years ago or so. It's been through some changes; also, I haven't visited for a year or so. But the people were good and some of the work was amazing.

https://www.nomadicista.org/

This has been my nomadic housing for awhile, a Glacier tent that is hexagon shaped canvas tent from Reliable Tent and Tipi https://www.reliabletent.com/products-page/specialty-tents/glacier-tent/



It has been a great tent for me, and I am using it on my property these days as temp housing until I can find a trailer to use for longer term temp housing while building a home.

I love the towable greenhouse! I would love to go travelling for a while (in 8-10 years or so), the only thing that scares me is the lack of a veggie garden. Wondering what you could grow in a towable greenhouse like that though?

Hello to everyone.

My family and I lived in a 29-square-meter yurt for many years. It is possible with children. My sister-in-law swears that you have to raise them thinking differently from the beginning, though, and that her children would protest loudly. My children are not attached to having a wifi signal or anything like that. We have never had a television. So perhaps our children would have been resistant, if they had lived a mainstream lifestyle before. I know other families that have dwelled in yurts, also, but I guess they are different, too, without a television and without a desire for one. My family went from two children to three in our yurt. It was only a year ago, with our children ranging from 6 to 14, that we moved into our home, even if we enjoyed our yurt. During the last year, though, we had realized our oldest son took up a lot more space than previously. He had not quite adapted to his increase in size with puberty and it was awkard in the small kitchen area sometimes, because he still moved as a child, when his size was a man's. We did not move for that,though. We purchased our home because we wanted solid walls and a permanent floor for heating concerns. Mass is not possible in a nomadic dwelling. We had to keep a constant, even if small, fire in the yurt and having my husband chop wood for the rest of our lives is not something I, nor he, wants. Plus, we squatted land when we lived in our yurt. The house we bought came with 3 hectares.

As far as the roundness of yurts, that's actually pretty uplifting, where a box isn't so much.

BTW, the term 'gypsy' is a misnommer that Europeans gave to Roma/Sinti, believing them to be from Egypt. Not all Roma and Sinti appreciate the term.

Tiffaney Dex wrote:Hello to everyone.

My family and I lived in a 29-square-meter yurt for many years. It is possible with children.
As far as the roundness of yurts, that's actually pretty uplifting, where a box isn't so much.

That is a nice home. I like the extra "lights" (wind-holes doesn't seem to describe these as well) daylight is something most "old style" (older than 300 or 400 years) houses lack. WIFI is not something a yurt stops one from having, but if it gets children outside... cut the cord

Sandrine Coosemans wrote:I love the towable greenhouse! I would love to go travelling for a while (in 8-10 years or so), the only thing that scares me is the lack of a veggie garden. Wondering what you could grow in a towable greenhouse like that though?

Maybe a greenhouse on top of a bus. Access it through the roof escape hatch. Definitely  could have your herb garden and some greens up there. Window boxes on the inside of the windows would suffice for some plants like New Zealand spinach that makes larger leaves with intermittent light.  Maybe add a chicken coop for eggs and use your veggie scraps..

I found that web page chat hopeless and unclear about anything.

Len Ovens wrote:

Tiffaney Dex wrote:Hello to everyone.

My family and I lived in a 29-square-meter yurt for many years. It is possible with children.
As far as the roundness of yurts, that's actually pretty uplifting, where a box isn't so much.

That is a nice home. I like the extra "lights" (wind-holes doesn't seem to describe these as well) daylight is something most "old style" (older than 300 or 400 years) houses lack. WIFI is not something a yurt stops one from having, but if it gets children outside... cut the cord

Thank you. We miss it sometimes. It is close to us and we spend time in it. But it's not the same as living in it.

r ranson wrote:
What do you think about when you think Nomadic Housing?

I think about a world that mostly no longer exists: hunter-gatherers and nomadic pastoralists. Oftentimes, these groups of people built makeshift shelters that were not meant to last, knowing they would move on and abandon the shelters. Then, too, nomadic tribes usually did not wander in the sense we think of wandering; their movements were more like migration, moving from one known locality to another, based on what was available there in which season. This meant that if they had sod or stone, they could build huts in different places and move into and out of them as the season demanded.

Swiss Family Robinson did this, too. By the end of the book, it will be recalled, they had a house in almost every part of the island they visited.

Tiffaney Dex wrote:

As far as the roundness of yurts, that's actually pretty uplifting, where a box isn't so much.

I'd agree with you on that. We've been living in a Groovy Yurt for 5 years now and now anything square feels awkward and alien. So many corners! Your kids were lucky.

Jason Hernandez wrote:

r ranson wrote:
What do you think about when you think Nomadic Housing?

I think about a world that mostly no longer exists: hunter-gatherers and nomadic pastoralists.

It's sad that nomads have almost been eliminated and that the U.N. is actively engaged in sedentarizing any that remain. But, I'm finding it enlightening and encouraging that many of the world's nomadic peoples are not remnants of prehistory but were at some point "civilized" but then opted out, fleeing back into the wilds to escape a life that was miserable, labor-intensive and unhealthy. James C. Scott's book "The Art of Not Being Governed" is opening my eyes to yet another myth that we've been misled to believe. Maybe we're on the verge of another wave of people reverting back to their true place on the planet, far from desks, asphalt and factories.

Hi guys,

My husband and I live in a van full-time. We move around every 2 days on average. Vans are very good for moving around in often and I would recommend them if you want to travel around a country at a reasonable pace. Although it can be rewarding it is mostly just a lot of VERY hard work.

My personal experience is that it can be very easy to get caught up in the romanticism and authenticity of nomadic living, but when you’re suffering from severe stomach cramps and shitting into a bag - I can tell you that there is nothing romantic about it.

Although we love Van Hausin and the freedom that he gives, it is a different type of prison! You have to accept your days as they come because you will be shocked at how little control you have over them. Tiny things determine your daily life. I can only describe it as ‘sever bipolar’ days. You can have great highs and lows multiple times in a day. It is fun at first adapting and figuring things out, tweaking things to work for you but it eventually erodes and leaves one feeling exhausted.

My best advice is to do it for the experience but to immediately stop when you wake up feeling anxious. Because being a nomad in these times, as we are, is very difficult without vaccine passports. We need health passes for every place we go in France. We aren’t allowed to go into swimming pools, camp sites, cafes or bars and a whole array of culture and social places. Perhaps your country is more tolerant and you won’t have the same issues as we have. When you’re a nomad you rely on society and structures more, so when you’ve been banished from them it’s very difficult to function at the base level of the hierarchy on needs.

If I were considering a moving structure I guess I would have to ask myself how often I want to move and what the purpose is? A bell tent that you move twice a year is going to allow you more stability and the ability to create structure and routine, which certainly has its benefits for mental stability and mood. Personally I would do that.

With love from France

Tara Kent wrote:Hi guys,

My husband and I live in a van full-time. We move around every 2 days on average. Vans are very good for moving around in often and I would recommend them if you want to travel around a country at a reasonable pace. Although it can be rewarding it is mostly just a lot of VERY hard work.

Thanks Tara, and welcome to Permies. Your first-hand experience and willingness to tell the unpleasant side of the story is helpful. Nomadic living IS wrapped in romanticism, and it may work for some people. This point in history is an awkward one, but that may just highlight challenges that would exist any way.