permies + kickstarter + apple fancy security email addresses

UPDATE!   The "secure" email thing from apple is a mess. You can read exactly how it is a mess a few posts down.  We have come up with a workaround, that requires some manual fiddling on our part.  Post a reply to this thread, and we will get started.  After we have repaired what apple broke, it would be nice if you give the volunteer that did the work a piece of "PIE" (click on the pie icon on their helpful post).  





Today I heard from a second person that says they backed the kickstarter, but their kickstarter account uses a "secure apple email".  

We base all the goodies on the kickstarter email address.   For every goody we hand out, if the email address is not in our database, the backer gets an email with instructions on creating an account or adding this email address to an existing account.

So, your "secure apple email" should forward to your real email address and all is good.  We will make any email address a "secondary" email for an account.  All sorted.

Unless, of course, the security is so extreme that emails from kickstarter or permies is not relayed.  Your fancy secure email has sorta locked you out of your own house.  Quite secure, but where ya gonna sleep tonight?

I am starting this thread in the hope that people that know more about this apple email stuff might be able to say something here so we might learn to make the best of what appears to be a really awful program set up in the name of "security".

Anybody have experience with this?

I do not have any experience with receiving email using an Apple email address, but I have never been able to send an email to any of my friends with that type of email address. I've even tried sending email from different domains, with no success.

I’m experiencing this issue where I’m not receiving email communication from the project creators since my kickstarter account was created using the Apple ID alias feature. According to the article linked below, there isn’t a workaround through kickstarter and you have to contact the project creator directly to update email for any communication outside of the kickstarter platform.  
Per the Kickstarter FAQ re Apple ID:
“Please note that the unique relay address tied to your Kickstarter account can only be used for communication with Kickstarter. This means that any communication sent outside of our platform by the creator will unfortunately not reach your inbox.  In this case, we'd recommend reaching out to the project creator to clarify the situation and to request that they update your email on their end. “

It’s a bit of a pain, after I resolve some of the projects I’ve backed with this account, I plan on deleting it and starting again without the Apple alias this time.

https://help.kickstarter.com/hc/en-us/articles/360051735993-What-is-Sign-in-with-Apple-and-how-can-I-use-it-to-create-an-account-

I guess the security is working the way it was designed.  They have successfully set it up, so that if somebody tried to take your email address and be naughty with it, then you are safe from that naughtiness.  And, at the same time, if somebody tried to use that email to give you your product, you are safe from that as well.  

And if you contact them and say "permies.com is good, please pass that through" they will say "we don't have that feature, so ... no."

Nicole has been looking into manually handing out each thing.  I suspect it would be more than an hour.  More likely pushing two hours.  And that's just for one person.

I just feel like this is a really poor feature design.

I have an idea, but it will require a modification to the permies.com software ...

Having the same trouble with the AppleID issue. First time using it on kickstarter! Wouldn't have used it is I knew it would lead to this.
In fairness its doing what its meant to do.
Hope there will be a workaround without too much trouble on your side. If me opening a different account on permies would work? Let me know.
Thanks

Arjenn Penndari- wrote:In fairness its doing what its meant to do.

If what it is meant to do is to prevent you from getting your rewards, then, yes, you are correct.

The way the secure email thing should work is you have a configuration that looks like this:

    domains that you have approved for use with this email

            kickstarter.com     [block]

    domains that have tried to contact you with this email

            permies.com       [approve]    [block]


    add more approved domains

            ___________________   [submit]


And done.  

But they left that out.  




Devaka is in the middle of lots of projects, but he and I put our heads together and came up with a workaround on our end for apple's bugs.  We came up with an idea where staff could manually add secondary email addresses and NOT require validation.  If there are just two or three people that need this manual help, then the effort on our end would be small.   Or, at least a lot smaller than what Nicole was about to do.

Devaka has now done the dev work and it might be deployed into production later today.

paul wheaton wrote:
Devaka is in the middle of lots of projects, but he and I put our heads together and came up with a workaround on our end for apple's bugs.  We came up with an idea where staff could manually add secondary email addresses and NOT require validation.  If there are just two or three people that need this manual help, then the effort on our end would be small.   Or, at least a lot smaller than what Nicole was about to do.

Devaka has now done the dev work and it might be deployed into production later today.

Thank you so much!!!

Drew,

You are the guinnea pig.  I added your goofy apple email address as a secondary email to your account.  It looks like you now have lots of stuff.  Can you click on "my stuff" and see lots of stuff?

paul wheaton wrote:Drew,

You are the guinnea pig.  I added your goofy apple email address as a secondary email to your account.  It looks like you now have lots of stuff.  Can you click on "my stuff" and see lots of stuff?

Thank you, Paul!  I'm a happy guinnea pig--it looks like it worked.  The attached shows maybe a  third of the goodies I have access to now.

Arjenn,

I now did it to your account.  Do you see a bunch of stuff in your "my stuff"?

Nicole, I think you have access to this tool also ...

paul wheaton wrote:Nicole, I think you have access to this tool also ...

Oooooh, awesome! I'm going to go see if I can get it to work for Arjenn!

Nicole Alderman wrote:

paul wheaton wrote:Nicole, I think you have access to this tool also ...

Oooooh, awesome! I'm going to go see if I can get it to work for Arjenn!

I already did.  ??

Looks like someone already beat me to it, or my previous attempt somehow just worked, because I'm seeing lots of stuff in his My Stuff.

Arjenn, can you see all your goodies?

Yes I can see all the items in My Stuff.
Thank you for sorting out the issue!

Hi, I thought it worked for me too, but then got caught in the apple-defence-fence not letting the verification email through. Could one of you maybe help me to add my secondary email again without the need to verify it?

Apple email security is like

Marvin Stahlhacke wrote:Hi, I thought it worked for me too, but then got caught in the apple-defence-fence not letting the verification email through. Could one of you maybe help me to add my secondary email again without the need to verify it?

I had a look, but I can't do this as I don't have a way to confirm the two accounts belong to the same person.  Without that ability, it pretty much nullifies any security that this apple system says it provides.  It becomes less secure than using a normal email.  

It looks like the kickstarter team will have to go in manually to do this individually.  

From my own kickstarter journey, the focus is to get most of the rewards to the most people as fast as possible, then come back and manually process the time-intensive individual issues (like apple-security) afterwards.  Alas, it's like an extra fee you have to pay for using the flawed system by having to wait longer to get the rewards.  

But I haven't been following Paul's kickstarters closely so I don't know what path they are taking.  

Thanks for looking into it r ranson. Had I knows this was such a trouble I wouldn't have used that feature/bug... From what I read on this thread and from checking the Apple-ID settings, there is now way to get Apple to send on emails from permies to the same address used on Kickstarter.

If it's just a question about checking who is owning the kickstarter account and matching it to my permies account, I have a pretty unusual combination of first- and last name, unique in the world to my knowledge. And unless someone was so kind to make a $300 donation to the kickstarter campaign in my name I'd say it's pretty safe to assume that I'm the right guy ^^

If you are not able to verify my account I hope someone else can? I can send you the kickstarter email per purple mooseage if needed.

I can only see the permies side, I don't have access to Paul's Kickstarter backend.  So I can't process the merge.  

But Paul's kickstarter team is working through these.  I just don't know how fast.  

Marvin Stahlhacke wrote:Thanks for looking into it r ranson. Had I knows this was such a trouble I wouldn't have used that feature/bug... From what I read on this thread and from checking the Apple-ID settings, there is now way to get Apple to send on emails from permies to the same address used on Kickstarter.

If it's just a question about checking who is owning the kickstarter account and matching it to my permies account, I have a pretty unusual combination of first- and last name, unique in the world to my knowledge. And unless someone was so kind to make a $300 donation to the kickstarter campaign in my name I'd say it's pretty safe to assume that I'm the right guy ^^

If you are not able to verify my account I hope someone else can? I can send you the kickstarter email per purple mooseage if needed.

Excellent point!

So I went into kickstarter and ... shore nuff ... exactly one person with that name.  I grabbed the wacky email address and fed it into our system - using my super powers to override the need for verification.  I think it is all set now.

Marvin Stahlhacke wrote:Had I knows this was such a trouble I wouldn't have used that feature/bug...

Sounds like it is solved for you.

But for the next person looking at this, I wonder how difficult it would be to update Kickstarter with a standard email address?

Thank you so much Paul! I see the email address in my settings and can also use it to log in to the forums now. I also got access to the Kickstarter-Support forum, but the My Stuff page is still empty. Is there a step I missed in the How to get access-thread, or can I ask for someones support here one more time?

Jeff Bosch wrote:But for the next person looking at this, I wonder how difficult it would be to update Kickstarter with a standard email address?

I checked how to change email settings on Kickstarter and it seems like you can change it to your normal Apple ID-email, but not just any other email-address. In my case I use a different email-address than the age-old email connected to my Apple account. In any case, I assume that even once someone changes their Kickstarter-account with a new email-address, here on Permies someone would still need to be notified of the change and then add that new email address to the forums. Unless there is some automation built between KS and Permies of course.

Watch https://permies.com/wiki/203861/gmcks/GMC-KS-Full-Status#1681864

It will show the status of things as they are distributed. We haven't started yet (we wait until we get the money from Kickstarter and confirm that people have paid).

Ok I see this Icon K1 to K5,

So I guess this is for members that have contributed to a Kickstarters and the number of times

I have contributed 2 or 3 yet I have NO K.

So its not Kool but Kruel. I want my K's, so I can be Kool like all the other Kool Permies here :)

Craig Lewis wrote:Ok I see this Icon K1 to K5,

So I guess this is for members that have contributed to a Kickstarters and the number of times

I have contributed 2 or 3 yet I have NO K.

So its not Kool but Kruel. I want my K's, so I can be Kool like all the other Kool Permies here :)

Oh ok I see now I Kool like all the other Kids  LOL

It K's don't show up in Profile, but I see it to the left side now.

How Kool is that :)

Adding a secondary email doesn’t work for me.
Of course I would be in the <3%
My kickstarter account uses Apple ID
I didn’t realize it until now, but by doing so my actual email address is “hidden”.
The email address found in my Apple ID for kickstarter is simply a relay that automatically forwards, so unfortunately I don’t have access to this account in order to verify it so that I can add it as a secondary here.
Assuming I made this conundrum make sense, how can we skirt the problem I created by “hiding” my email. (Didn’t even know I was doing it)

Beau Davidson wrote:R Lewis,
I have merged your topic into this topic. I hope that helps.

Yessem! I’ve twisted the arm of kickstarter so now I wait to see if they can get it changed on their end. Thank you for pointing me here!

R Lewis wrote:

Beau Davidson wrote:R Lewis,
I have merged your topic into this topic. I hope that helps.

Yessem! I’ve twisted the arm of kickstarter so now I wait to see if they can get it changed on their end. Thank you for pointing me here!

Gimmie something on your kickstarter survey so i know it is you.  

paul wheaton wrote:

R Lewis wrote:

Beau Davidson wrote:R Lewis,
I have merged your topic into this topic. I hope that helps.

Yessem! I’ve twisted the arm of kickstarter so now I wait to see if they can get it changed on their end. Thank you for pointing me here!

Gimmie something on your kickstarter survey so i know it is you.  

Clicking on the “view response” within the email it leads to a blank page within kickstarter. I do not remember the exact question but my answer was “The Most Awesome…” It was in reference to a name appearance because I vividly remember giggling like a school kid over that answer.
My backer #423 (yes I was slow to the party).
I could send screenshots if that would help.
Thank ya!

R Lewis wrote:

paul wheaton wrote:

R Lewis wrote:

Beau Davidson wrote:R Lewis,
I have merged your topic into this topic. I hope that helps.

Yessem! I’ve twisted the arm of kickstarter so now I wait to see if they can get it changed on their end. Thank you for pointing me here!

Gimmie something on your kickstarter survey so i know it is you.  

Clicking on the “view response” within the email it leads to a blank page within kickstarter. I do not remember the exact question but my answer was “The Most Awesome…” It was in reference to a name appearance because I vividly remember giggling like a school kid over that answer.
My backer #423 (yes I was slow to the party).
I could send screenshots if that would help.
Thank ya!

Yup, story checks out.  This is, indeed, "His MOST Awesomeness R Lewis".

I think I fixed it.  You should see stuff in your "my stuff" now.

Hi.  I have the same problem others in this thread have had.  I signed up for Kickstarter using my Apple ID and a private email address that’s exclusive to Kickstarter.  When I put this email address into the secondary email the confirmation request from permies is not forwarded to my regular email.  Can anyone here help resolve this?  Thanks.

Jamie Martin wrote:Hi.  I have the same problem others in this thread have had.  I signed up for Kickstarter using my Apple ID and a private email address that’s exclusive to Kickstarter.  When I put this email address into the secondary email the confirmation request from permies is not forwarded to my regular email.  Can anyone here help resolve this?  Thanks.

I'm looking into it now ...

paul wheaton wrote:

Jamie Martin wrote:Hi.  I have the same problem others in this thread have had.  I signed up for Kickstarter using my Apple ID and a private email address that’s exclusive to Kickstarter.  When I put this email address into the secondary email the confirmation request from permies is not forwarded to my regular email.  Can anyone here help resolve this?  Thanks.

I'm looking into it now ...

The good news - you actually used the exact same name on both kickstarter and permies.  That is a huge help.  And just to verify, the Jamie Martin on kickstarter is using the twisted email from apple.  

I put the email in.  I can now see the green "K" next to your name.  Your "my stuff" seems pretty loaded with stuff.  

I think you are all set!

paul wheaton wrote:Today I heard from a second person that says they backed the kickstarter, but their kickstarter account uses a "secure apple email".  

We base all the goodies on the kickstarter email address.   For every goody we hand out, if the email address is not in our database, the backer gets an email with instructions on creating an account or adding this email address to an existing account.

So, your "secure apple email" should forward to your real email address and all is good.  We will make any email address a "secondary" email for an account.  All sorted.

Unless, of course, the security is so extreme that emails from kickstarter or permies is not relayed.  Your fancy secure email has sorta locked you out of your own house.  Quite secure, but where ya gonna sleep tonight?

I am starting this thread in the hope that people that know more about this apple email stuff might be able to say something here so we might learn to make the best of what appears to be a really awful program set up in the name of "security".

Anybody have experience with this?

I backed the GMC Kickstarter also by logging into Kickstarter using my Apple ID. Sorry, I didn’t know the trouble it would cause! When I try to go to the kickstarter support forum I get this message “Oooops. You don’t have sufficient privileges to access this forum”. I see from this thread that it’s due to Apple security screwing up my email address. How can I fix this? Or does the kickstarter team have to fix it? Please advise me how to proceed.

Justin Burch wrote:I backed the GMC Kickstarter also by logging into Kickstarter using my Apple ID. Sorry, I didn’t know the trouble it would cause! When I try to go to the kickstarter support forum I get this message “Oooops. You don’t have sufficient privileges to access this forum”. I see from this thread that it’s due to Apple security screwing up my email address. How can I fix this? Or does the kickstarter team have to fix it? Please advise me how to proceed.

Fortunately, there is a backer with your exact name using the dreaded apple id stuff.  (some people use "fun" names on kickstarter and then it is difficult to figure out which account is theirs)

Because of those that have come before you, we now have a process that takes us just three or four minutes.  All sorted now!