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the first wofati - allerton abbey- version 0.7

 
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How about an update.
Is anybody living here for the winter?
Anybody keeping track of the temps etc?
 
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Miles Flansburg wrote:How about an update.
Is anybody living here for the winter?
Anybody keeping track of the temps etc?



Yes, it would be quite useful/revealing to get some data for the performance of both of the WOFATIs
 
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We don't have anybody that is currently dedicated to staying the whole winter there.

Kai is there now, but will be headed out for the holidays.

Evan and Sharla will be back in a few days and it sounds like they will stay there.

The key to all this is that we cannot do a full ATI test this year, because the final door didn't go in until november - and it was already damn cold. So it is safe to assume that the mass is also damn cold.

I talked to Kai about the idea of doing a test: take the temp up to 85 at least once a day for ten days, and then go ten days without any additional heat and see how that is. He said he would contact evan and sharla and see if they would help with that experiment.

 
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That sounds great. Keep us posted on the results. I'd be very interested in hearing how it goes.
 
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(Note: I have revised the Concept Aerial to address some of the dialog that follows, all wonderful suggestions)

This should be obvious to me, but the cold has apparently affected my brain. Are Wofati 0.8 and Allerton Abbey one and the same?

Wasn't there also another Wofati that Tim was going to build?

I am still totally stoked by the Wofati experiment at Wheaton Labs.

Using my modeling skills, I have built a concept model to illustrate the simplicity of the concept.

I made these diagrams to help others visualize the concept.

Of course, these are JUST diagrams that help explain Paul's brilliant insight into such structures.

This concept is scalable from small to large. Trombe walls are way more complicated than straw-bale, too. But they might have some advantages in digger designs with bigger budgets.

If you can move the dirt, you don't even need a hill to dig into. That makes the north side drainage considerations almost non-existent. Still want to keep the north side daylight small as it is almost always cold and therefore a great way to lose heat you are trying to keep in the winter. There is also a need to make north and south windows operable to use air movement to control temperature inside and improve healthy quality of air.

I have an animation as well, but can't figure out how to share it here.
Wofati-Concept-Plan.png
[Thumbnail for Wofati-Concept-Plan.png]
Floor Plan of Concept
Wofati-Sections.png
[Thumbnail for Wofati-Sections.png]
Cross Sections Through Concept
Wofati-Concept-Aerial-revised.png
[Thumbnail for Wofati-Concept-Aerial-revised.png]
Aerial Concept Diagram
 
Jason Marlow
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It's my understanding that 0.7 and 0.8 are the same structure only with enough modifications to alter the thermal performance. Can anyone verify?
 
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Ty Morrison wrote:This should be obvious to me, but the cold has apparently affected my brain. Are Wofati 0.8 and Allerton Abbey one and the same?


nope, 0.7 = Allerton Abbey.


Using my modeling skills, I have built a concept model to illustrate the simplicity of the concept.

I made these diagrams to help others visualize the concept.


some comments:
The insulating qualities of earth while a part of the equation, are not the reason to use earth at all. The main consideration is storage and rate of heat travel. That is, it would be easy to have more heat storage in a smaller volume (water for example). Also note the there is generally a layer of material above the earth for the purpose of insulating and water sealing to keep the earth dry. Heat travels by more means than one and earth umbrellas rely on all of them. Earth that has been heated at the hottest times of year in a trombe wall will be emitted quite soon and probably before it is needed/wanted. heated earth 12 feet away from the dwelling will let it's heat take as much as 6 months to reach the dwelling and start releasing that heat to the interior. So earth has the quality of cheap, but massive heat storage, but also slow heat release without manual intervention with the right design.


This concept is scalable from small to large. Trombe walls are way more complicated than straw-bale, too. But they might have some advantages in digger designs with bigger budgets.


I don't know that I would put a trombe wall on the south side. It is hard to know what would work best with that.

It is (another) interesting coincidence, that the materials on hand seem to be the best materials for the job.

 
Len Ovens
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Jason Marlow wrote:It's my understanding that 0.7 and 0.8 are the same structure only with enough modifications to alter the thermal performance. Can anyone verify?


0.8 is a second larger structure.
 
Jason Marlow
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So they are two separate structures entirely!? Wow, you guys put them up pretty quick, then.
 
Len Ovens
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Jason Marlow wrote:So they are two separate structures entirely!? Wow, you guys put them up pretty quick, then.


Heres the thread:
https://permies.com/t/33160/labs/wofati
Much bigger inside:
https://permies.com/t/33160/labs/wofati#376480
 
A "dutch baby" is not a baby. But this tiny ad is baby sized:
Dave Burton's Boot Adventures at Wheaton Labs and Basecamp
https://permies.com/t/119676/permaculture-projects/Dave-Burton-Boot-Adventures-Wheaton
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