permaculture bootcamp - learn permaculture through a little hard work

Keshav Boddula wrote:i understand the deep roots program to help in getting more community there living in a exemplary way, awesome.. but is there any arrangement where i/one could help setup a plot, then get credit for that for my/their final community i choose to settle in?

It sounds like you're asking if someone could work on someone's deep roots plot and somehow receive compensation at another unrelated place.  Am I understanding correctly?  

Here is a new video with Reid from the bootcamp showing how fixing things, or improving them with just one stick that you might find lying around on the ground is a fulfilling, creative and super-useful activity!  Low tech solutions are positively encouraged at the bootcamp - come join in!

Check out the new video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eK6BuoX_0To

Someone is asking, over at WWOOF:

I am thinking the greyhound to missoula sometime around mid may (i believe it arrives around 7:30 am). so, i'll pay the $100 and also, as for a ride from 1660 W Broadway, 59808 Missoula [greyhound missoula]? do i have to plan to arrive on a weekend day?

Can someone confirm available start dates around this time?

Jules Silverlock wrote:
Can someone confirm available start dates around this time?

Current start dates:
May 28
June 11
June 25
July 23
Aug 13
Sep 3

Jules Silverlock wrote:Someone is asking, over at WWOOF:

I am thinking the greyhound to missoula sometime around mid may (i believe it arrives around 7:30 am). so, i'll pay the $100 and also, as for a ride from 1660 W Broadway, 59808 Missoula [greyhound missoula]? do i have to plan to arrive on a weekend day?

Can someone confirm available start dates around this time?

The next official arrival date for May 2023 is 28th May. It could be that this is a bit later than they are seeking. But at least it can give them a bit more time to plan their trip.

EDIT: Hahahaha! Looks like Jeff beat me to it.

huh? coincidental-interesting. i did not get a notification email about beau's clarification question (also, my post looks kinda stupid without the link of my "homestead flipping exchange idea" from a google doc, i'll try again here* (looks like i cannot add google doc links)
hmm, yeah beau, i guess you could think of it that way. yeah, the "somehow" part is the challenging part, which is like coordinating / setting up a network of time-share-like exchanges, but for being part of a like-minded, supportive community we know better of.
some people sorta leave it to God. some people have our recognized systems and institutions of law, finance/money, etc. be the judge. i observe that, and hope to help the best i can

also, i'm the wwoofer person jules is talking about here, though unsure why she asked about available start dates, as my understanding was that it is any time. is it helpful to youall that i arrive at an official start date? if so, now i'm unsure/hesitant to come...

*https://docs.google.com/document/d/1wOJNgocMW9RMSaXhW5poVueq87r9XHZ4/edit#bookmark=id.brre70gtjul3

We only open two weeks to wwoofers  (once in the spring and once in the fall).

Outside of that, we have the bootcamp program which has an $100 applicant fee (non-refundable) which has specific start dates.

(i'm assuming i shouldn't/can't arrive on a weekday unless i have my own transportation) so what's the earliest i can arrive for the may 28th start date - the 27th of may? (if this late, i'm unsure now). or can i arrive on the 20th, help/work for a week with whatever's needed, and then officially start on the 28th?
and/otherwise, an offering of one of my audio mashes with sadhguru "get us f-responsible..." (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1OrIUNvKVIFkalXdCbZ3maPneDOCUTIqe/view?usp=share_link)

For the may 28th start date, we will ask you to arrive between 3 and 4 pm.  On the 28th. Please do not arrive early or late.

When people fly in, we will pick them up in missoula give or take a few hours.

(sigh) yo paul/permies, are these forums really the place to be coordinating my personal plans to arrive/bootcamp there? anyway, ok, so (with very good intentions) i'm trying very much to make this bootcamp visit/work-exchange work, and hoping you can help me figure this out.

i believe this would be so much easier to coordinate with a 2 min. phone call, anyway.. can somebody pick me up or possible carpool on saturday may 27th too, or only sunday the 28th? and it's only between 3 and 4 pm? unless i get picked up from the airport, then, it's any (reasonable) time on sunday (in that 2 hour time frame) ?? and is the airport the only pickup spot, or? paul wasn't very clear on that

i don't have my own transportation or too much money to be spending on air-travel, ubers or hotels.  i'm planning to use greyhound, and i guess the mountainline bus, right? i'm even trying to make arrangements with other wwoof hosts also closeby missoula area (a week before the 28th) now just for this visit to wheaton labs.. but (outside of the hosts helping me make it in that time frame) could you suggest how i can make it there without my own transportation?

check out the FAQ:  https://wheaton-labs.com/bootcamp/#FAQ

Q: Can I call you and talk to you for a few hours about my mom's cat, Miss Stephanie?

No.


Q: How about if I call you and talk to you about being a boot and I don't mention the cat?

We used to do this sort of thing and we still ended up hearing about way too many cats.  "And as long as I got you on the phone ..."   So what we do now is:

A:  ask you to please post your questions to this thread.

B:  once you have paid the Bootcamp fee, then we know you are serious.  If you really need to have a phone chat, you will be able to talk to a human.

C:  once in a long, long while, a person needs to ask a question via email instead of a forum for a very good reason.   In that case, I ask that you head to this forum and ask.

The thing is that your request to talk to a human is normal, and you are not the first.  At the same time, you must be thoroughly punished for the actions of those that have come before you!  :)



Rides from missoula:  No problem.  Have a crisp $20 bill for your driver.  Generally, they are glad to pick you up from anywhere in missoula.  Usually as early as noon (on sunday).  Once it gets to be about a week before you arrive, you will get all the contact info for the person giving you a ride.

The super smart thing about doing the pickups at about that time, is that if there are one or two new boots needing a ride, then they can all be picked up at about the same time.  Clever, right?!

I think we do a pretty good job with rides to and from missoula.  And, of course, over the years we have optimized our systems so that everything is much smoother for everybody.

Jefferson Bus Lines is the main one into Missoula. https://www.jeffersonlines.com/

Allegiant Air has cheap flights to Missoula.
https://www.allegiantair.com

If you don't want to arrive on a bootcamp start date, the SEPPer program would be a better fit. https://permies.com/wiki/sepper

Check out this sunny photo of the current boots/seppers/residents at Wheaton Labs :)
Picture courtesy of Stephen (a current boot) - and you can read/view more about his bootcamp experiences here: https://permies.com/t/375/181512/SEPP-Boot-Stephen-Experience-BRK

i PMd jeff about how those options he gives does not seem to be right (for me).

so there may be a nearby-missoula woofing that works out, otherwise, there doesn't seem to be any affordable transportation arriving on sunday the 28th, so i'd arrive saturday, and (not having much money to spend), i'd get a cheap room for a night right, or...?

Keshav Boddula wrote:, so i'd arrive saturday, and (not having much money to spend), i'd get a cheap room for a night right, or...?

There is cheap camping nearby. Bring a tent?

can someone explain to me why forums/this forum is the right place to coordinate my personal plans to potentially visit for the bootcamp? maybe i underestimate the power of this data that can be referenced at a later time, but a 2 minute phone call (or even chat/private messaging - to a lesser extent though) seems like it would save us more time, and really better/the right way (and sure there will be some who want to talk and talk.. i'd hope you could smartly/politely-like be able to handle that and just tell those types that you don't have that much time).

Most people pay the boot fee, pick a day, show up and everything is silky smooth.

The great thing about this thread, is there are loads of little things that have been discussed over the years - in advance.  Just in case a person has questions.  

The quote above, from the FAQ, spells it out very clearly.  Another way of putting it is:  you must be thoroughly punished for the actions of those that have come before you.  The people here are trying to help new boots get here.  But phone calls seems to always be something that the people here dread.

So, my guess is that if strikes you as off, then you won't be coming.  Stick to things that feel good.  


It seems that more than half the people coming here have read one of my books, or listened to a bunch of my podcasts, or watched a bunch of my videos - so they have really good idea of what they are getting into.  So they are ready to make the leap.  

Some come through the sepper program - they pay more, but they can show up any day.  And they join in the bootcamp as much or as little as they like.  

Some come to an event and then stick around for the bootcamp.

Most sign up for the bootcamp directly.

Yeah it strikes me as off man, but what is more off is the way the misguided, unsustainable Economy/way of life is set up. And your/Permaculture's response to this is right/great, you know. It's about choosing our battles, having to sometimes go through things that don't make too much sense. I'll try very much to make it out there for a visit, but it's not like I must. God bless 🙏

We have found in most cases that those who argue and have issues with the rules of when to arrive at the bootcamp also have issues with the rule being in the bootcamp.

We have named it bootcamp for a reason, there are rules and they need to be followed.

Q: How about if I call you and talk to you about being a boot and I don't mention the cat?

We used to do this sort of thing and we still ended up hearing about way too many cats.  "And as long as I got you on the phone ..."   So what we do now is:

B:  once you have paid the Bootcamp fee, then we know you are serious.  If you really need to have a phone chat, you will be able to talk to a human.

Please don't PM me.

If you haven't seen the Permaculture Design Course & Appropriate Technology Course videos yet, check out this new trailer released just today!  I have to say, I got a lot out of this video course and continue to review it to this day.

Check the trailer out here https://permies.com/wiki/120/65386#1842046

The next day for new boots to arrive is june 11!  

The PDC starts the following week.  Boots are welcome to attend the evening stuff in the PDC.

Here are some photos from recent events at Wheaton Labs taken by boots  Stephen and  Dez.  You, too, could be working on projects like these, with friendly faces like these, in the bootcamp!  The bootcamp, for the next few weeks, will be finishing some excellent PTJ projects - come join in with a fun, skills-building, hard-working experience.  Sign up HERE.

The next few bootcamp starting dates:

july 23
aug 13
sep 3
sep 24
oct 15

A potential new boot messaged me with some queries. I thought i'd post them here and hopefully someone can answer:

Im interested in the bootcamp.  I am going to need to be back [home] at the end of the month to take care of something.  
Is it ok to leave and then come back during active projects?  
Also,  for the payment.....I am locked out of paypal and don't have any crypto.  Is there any other options for getting the money to the lab?

For the payment, we now offer Stripe (which is a secure payment portal to use your credit card/requires no account) - as well as Paypal/Crypto - it should pop up as an option once you click on the pay button :)

With the start/leave question, I'm not so sure - but I'm sure someone in this thread can assist.   I think the potential boot is keen to come asap (looks like Sunday August 13 is next available date?)

Im interested in the bootcamp.  I am going to need to be back [home] at the end of the month to take care of something.  
Is it ok to leave and then come back during active projects?

We've had Boots leave and then come back at a later date to resume their work (I've done it myself a few times). In general this is not a problem, and we can discuss the particulars as the time approaches.

If you're really, really concerned (whoever you are), then just drop me a PM and we can discuss it in more detail. I'm the current High Commander of the Boots, and can pass along specific and accurate info.

Here's a new YT video that covers some of the cool stuff that was built this summer at Wheaton Labs.  Check it out!

https://youtu.be/oklSNTkUf0A

The next few start days

sep 3
sep 24
oct 15
oct 29
nov 12
dec 3
dec 17
jan 7

Working on the half assed holidays for this upcoming winter

https://permies.com/w/half-assed-holidays

Dez did the bootcamp for 2 years, got his acre, and lived to talk about it!

Check out this video for an insidght intod Dez's experience at Permacutlure Bootcamp!

https://youtu.be/dORqYPTC-LM

Hola,

Are there some months of the year when it would be possible for a raw vegan to join the bootcamp?  In practice, that would be about 2,000 calories from locally grown fresh, ripe, whole fruit -- the juicier and sweeter the better -- along with a generous daily portion of mild tender greens (lettuce and celery, basically) and/or vegetable-fruits.  If it would be possible, but not exactly budget-friendly, I'd be willing to put in extra hours to balance the scales.

And a second, unrelated, question: For those who can't stand the noise/fumes emanating from power tools, vehicles, machines, and the like; would an extended stay end up being more nightmare than dream?  Or would it be possible to request to always be assigned jobs which would avoid being in their presence?

Hey, we never know unless we ask, ain't it?

✌️

raw vegan:  we supply food staples.  It has some raw vegan stuff.  But if you have special dietary needs, you would need to bring your own food.

And a second, unrelated, question: For those who can't stand the noise/fumes emanating from power tools, vehicles, machines, and the like; would an extended stay end up being more nightmare than dream?

I think we try hard in this department, but it is not a 100% win.  I do think the air here, in general, is super clean.  And our sawmill is solar powered.  And our chainsaws are all electric.  We have a bunch of electric bicycles, which get a fair amount of use.

We have had some people stay as seppers on the lab and never come in contact with a petroleum powered thing.  

But the bootcamp:  we do have some petroleum powered rigs, and an excavator.

Or would it be possible to request to always be assigned jobs which would avoid being in their presence?

I think if it is an authentic request, then it will have weight.  It is really up to the high commander.

(by "authentic request" I mean a person that will accept "no" or "not this time" with grace.  As opposed to a request being a veneer over a demand.)

paul wheaton wrote:raw vegan:  we supply food staples.  It has some raw vegan stuff.  But if you have special dietary needs, you would need to bring your own food.

Thanks, Paul.  What about the second part of the question?  In the summer months, would you be willing to procure a few thousand calories per day of fresh fruit for those willing to work extra hours?  Even if it were, say, twenty-five hours a week over and above, I think I'd be game to give it a go.

Not trying to be pushy.  I just want to see if there's a way to make it work.

I think if it is an authentic request, then it will have weight.  It is really up to the high commander.

(by "authentic request" I mean a person that will accept "no" or "not this time" with grace.  As opposed to a request being a veneer over a demand.)

That sounds totally fair to me!

That would be your own responsibility to purchase.

From the first post, some of the ways to earn money outside of boot hours to buy extra raw vegan stuff:

a little jingle in your pocket

COIN-1: Several boots have harvested hundreds of dollars by posting pics and videos of theirs experiences here in the BRK program (now at about $2000).

COIN-2: You can edit videos for Paul's YouTube channel.  He pays $400 to $500 per video.  Some people can whip up a video in less than an hour. Details here.

COIN-3: After a few weeks (once we think you can do stuff on your own), talk to us about some bounties for coin.  There are several little projects we are willing to pay for.   A person could earn about $100 to $200 per month on evenings and weekends.

COIN-4: And if there is a special tool or bit of warm clothes you would like to have, the BRK and ant love programs have proven to be quite generous.

COIN-5: When people need a ride to and from the airport a person with a rig could harvest pick-up and drop-off bounties.  (Normally $35 one way during normal hours and $55 for crazy hours)

COIN-6: When a boot is here long enough, they can harvest some coin giving tours.

COIN-7: Sometimes we have a rush and there is a need for people to help with rentals - and that pays money!

COIN-8: Some ants and deep roots people have paid for help with their plots - building and gardening.

COIN-9: We have a neighbor that sometimes needs some construction help and has paid for that on evenings and weekends.

COIN-10: Some residents in the past have set up patreon accounts and made a few hundred bucks a month posting videos and pics.  

COIN-11: When you have a plot to play with, you can build a fence and some gardens and a structure.   And then you can sell those improvements to somebody else.  

COIN-12: When a boot is here long enough, they can harvest some coin helping with events on weekends.

Also, Paul has supplied items for boots to grow sprouts and mushrooms and this past Wednesday was indoor gardening day to help provide the boots with more fresh food in the other months.

Jeff Bosch wrote:That would be your own responsibility to purchase.

Okay.  Thanks, Jeff.

I want to find people, preferably in Western Massachusetts or near there, to learn from, hands-on, how to build a rocket mass heater. Ultimately, I want to build one in my house, using cob from my own back yard and buying whatever else I need, like firebrick, but not some big metal thing I can't lift by myself.

That is the short version of what I want.

Below are more details, if you have the desire and time to read them.

I would love to be part of a Western Massachusetts community effort where I got to show up and be one more body helping people build their own rocket mass heaters; I would love to be able to participate in several builds before even deciding what design would work best for me, and I want to have learned hands-on how to start and maintain a fire in several different kinds of RMH before I choose a design.

I am the kind of person who shows up before most people in the morning, happily does even the most boring, repetitive jobs that are within my average level of strength. I'll probably fall asleep on the couch mid-afternoon, but I'll stay up to finish the dishes, in company or alone,  because I got my nap in. And crash in my car or wherever, and do it again tomorrow.

I ask questions, preferably of people who take the attitude that there are no stupid questions. Most of my questions are those of an engineer (software, musical instruments) but some will inevitably be, like, uh, what? I never did that, I'm clueless.

I don't fly (carbon, cost, hate airport travel stress). I'd take the train, but it rarely goes where I want to go and costs even more to get to, like Missoula, MT. And there would be a lot of travel stress on that long a trip, I don't want to pay for that, even though I love the concept of trains.

I will drive my Prius anywhere in New England or even Pennsylvania, for a one-time workshop, because I can cope with that despite carbon; travel stress is low enough; if it's over a four hour trip I'll make it into a two or three day trip and stop over to camp and hike for a day. I'm retired, so I can afford the time.

But I really, really want to find a community within an hour or two distance from my home that is building RMH's with and for each other. It's not even that I want them to come build mine for me: I'm quite likely to choose to build as much of it as I can all by myself, because I am a mostly hermit who never invites anyone over to my hermit-crab shell house.

I just want to learn how to build an RMH (and pick a design) the way I learned how to build musical instruments: that is, somebody showed me and answered all my questions and helped me figure out things that went wrong, helped me debug and fix problems that came up.  

And then I want to pass it along, the same way being a volunteer coordinator for a traditional dance community has allowed me to participate in passing along my favorite dance form, because I want everyone in the world who needs to heat their home to have the opportunity to build an RMH that works for them.

Hello beautiful permies!!

I just signed up for bootcamp... I know it's a first come thing but I saw the post showing 3 current openings....

I am wrapping up services as a caregiver for a client in January and will be available to come out starting in February 😁

Partner is on board and looking to possibly join up for a few weeks, and deep roots are looking incredibly attractive!

Looking forward to meeting everyone!