EMF/WIFI sensitivity in an increasingly EMF-filled world

I saw something about this in another post that was a bit off-topic, so I thought it deserved its own thread.

I have trouble finding non-sensationalist news articles about this, but I think it’s important, and it would be great if people could share articles.

One thing I have heard about in passing but haven’t read anything on is about lots of 5g satellites being launched by Elon Musk. Does anyone have any good articles about this to share?

From what I have read, 5g sounds very dangerous compared to 3g and 4g. To escape 3g and 4g, there are still some areas we can move to far away from mobile phone towers, but if a satellite is orbiting the earth, it makes it more difficult to escape.

My own story is that around this time last year we switched to a new internet provider, who assured me that the WIFI dongle they’d given us to access the internet was only emitting WIFI over a couple of feet and was harmless, there was no option for a non-WIFI dongle. My husband and I both use the internet for work purposes as well as news and forums, and were fine at first, but after a week or two we both started getting headaches (which is unusual for us), and we realised it was connected to the WIFI dongle, which was actually emitting WIFI through our entire house, and that when we stopped use of this dongle, the headaches stopped.

Before this happened, we’d never had any issues with using the mobile phone or a non-WIFI dongle too often, but once this had happened we became more sensitive to using these forms of internet as well, and it took us a while to recover, and even now I can notice if I’ve been on the internet or phone for too long, and try to be offline and have my phone on aeroplane mode as much as possible.

The internet company had trouble believing that it caused trouble. Just as people who spray toxic air freshener and perfume everywhere don’t realise that it can make other people very sick. I wonder if this is that some people have lower thresholds for handling toxins? Or are we just being observant and realising that when we are around a type of toxin something happens?

The museum in the nearest city to us started offering free WIFI a few months ago, and now we can’t go there without getting headaches and nausea. I’m not sure if some forms of WIFI are worse than others? Or if it’s the length of time that I’m around them, because I don’t spend much time in WIFI-filled shops (and I do start to feel a bit weird in these places even after a short time) but in the museum we are usually there for a long time.

I’ve contemplated asking the museum if they can have a ‘quiet day’ every so often without WIFI, so that EMF-sensitive people can enjoy the museum too, but I am just not sure how effective it will be, after the disbelief I experienced from the internet company about EMF sensitivity.

We are not in the city much, but our nearest city also wants to become a “smart city” with 5g everywhere, does anyone have any good ideas about how to convince them to stop this? Or ways to get the voices of EMF-sensitive people heard?

Also I wonder if there’s anything I can be doing to shield my family from the damage that EMFs might be causing, for instance, I found a list of foods that protect against radiation a while ago, will these same foods protect our bodies from the damage that EMFs can do?

Do you have any articles, ideas, or stories to share?

Here's a good article about EMFs and their effect on chickens: https://permaculturenews.org/2017/07/27/got-chooks-lay/

The scary bit about this experience is that we do not know what all this radiation from wireless technology is doing to us… Is it preventing humans from having kids? Is it throwing women into premature menopause? Is it reducing men’s sperm count? And beside the procreation side of things, is it playing a part in hormone based obesity and stress related illnesses? And of course, many other ailments that can occur due to upset hormones… As we give our kids wireless devices from a very young age and everyone is walking around with a mobile phone in their pockets, it is a very serious concern that I feel needs more research.

Hi Kate;
Until a few years ago I had never heard of EMF sensitivity.
I would have been skeptical, had I not met a college professor who came to me for Subaru work.
While waiting for her car to be repaired. She carefully explained a few of the issues she was having. Starting with the new vehicles and all the electronics.  
She literally had a brand new van, she bought in full and then had too return to the dealer to resell at a loss!  She couldn't spend more than a few minutes inside . Motels  were all unlivable for her. Most restaurants were out as well.
She had me repairing her old 1987 Subaru so she could go camping.
She was very concerned about the upcoming 5G system.

This is a very real issue. Some folks are much more sensitive to EMF/WIFI than others.  
The long term effects on us all, are unknown.





 

I am so glad I'm not sensitive to energies, and my heart goes out to those who are.  How can you use a computer or live in a house with electricity, etc?

thomas rubino wrote:

She literally had a brand new van, she bought in full and then had too return to the dealer to resell at a loss!  She couldn't spend more than a few minutes inside .

How did she know it was the electronics and not the off-gassing toxic plastics?

I'm not a complete skeptic, but I think there is often a psychological component to these types of sensitivities.

A family member works for a telecommunications company, sometimes doing the residential hookup and repair stuff. He was called in to disable something for a person who said they were sensitive to the equipment. I don't know exactly what. While he was working, she asked him a question. He misunderstood her question and answered in a way that led her to believe he had disabled the thing that was bothering her. She said, oh I thought so! I could tell right away. I feel so much better. He hadn't actually done anything yet.

After that, he had another house call for a similar request. This time he set up a bit of a test to see if the person could tell when the equipment was disabled or not and found it was the same situation. If they thought it was disabled they felt better, whether it was or not.

My aunt started out always getting my uncle to turn off his cell phone when he came home cause it made her feel sick. He often forgot though, and it seems like she's either gotten used to it physically or psychologically cause she doesn't say anything about it anymore.

Having said that, I often get headaches when I'm under high voltage power lines. I don't think it's psychological, but who knows.

I'm EMF sensitive. I "hear" wifi (that's not the right word, but there is no right word for it) and high power lines make me feel horrible. When wifi was new and password protection was rare, my bf at the time used me to find open wifi for him, as I could tell him if there was wifi in an area, and he'd check it for passwords. At this point in the world, especially in cities, there's so much it's a constant background of low grade pain. When I get out in the country again, it quiets down and hurts less. Driving across the country, I start hearing the big power lines about a mile from them, it's blinding pain when they cross the highway, and another mile or so before it's quiet again.

I go to a doctor I like in the city, whose office is in one of the big office complexes attached to a huge hospital, and the electronic noise in there is close to unbearable. I lose my words, feel like I drop 30 IQ points, and am in pain and have a headache for the rest of the day after being there. I pull into the parking lot and the noise hits like a brick wall. Trying to talk to the doctor through that is like trying to do trigonometry in a loud concert with flashing lights and ground shaking volume, it's possible, but really hard to stay focused.

Part of our parameters for the property we bought is low EMF noise, and the house is designed to mitigate it more (and cell phones probably will not work well inside the house.) I looked for power lines, stations and substations, and cell towers as we drove around, and marked them on the map. When you come back into an area from another road the other way, sometimes you aren't aware how close that stuff is. For other reasons, we couldn't buy farther away from a town, so I picked the quietest, most likely to stay quiet, property I could find. I have nightmares of a cell tower being put up across the street.

So, from my point of view, yes, it is totally real. I think it's a normal thing, just like having more acute hearing or better vision, I can "see" EMF a little more clearly than most people (and it hurts.) For what it's worth, I had never heard of EMF issues, took me a long time to figure out what exactly I was reacting to, and longer to figure out others reacted too. I think 5g is an incredibly bad thing, the health issues I fight with are horrible, I wouldn't wish them on anyone. I suspect that a lot of people who are mildly reactive now will be highly reactive to 5g, and we will see a LOT of physical and mental health issues in those areas. The smart meter problems are already showing how many people are affected, it will only get worse with 5g. If I could stop it from happening,  I would.

I read a book called "Dirty Electricity" by Samuel Milham.  It explained it well. Available at libraries for free or kindle for $3.

Also, there is a film called "Take Back Your Power" that you can see for free on You tube. It also gives lots of helpful details.

There is a guy name Nicolas Pineault who wrote a book on it and an English guy named Lloyd Burrell who made an internet summit on it. The last two have interviewed many people and explained quite a bit on it.

WE were going to buy solar electricity panels, but we're waiting to see if they can do that without bombarding us with dirty electricity.

John S
PDX OR

For me, I don't tolerate mobile phone connections very well. WLAN on a laptop is tolerably when I am awake. The USB 3G modem that connects us to the world, emits enough radiation for me to get a headache in about one minute when 1m or less away. I don't use mobile phones as the close radiation (WLAN or cellular) gives me a headache.

I am not concerned about Starlink as the available power is very limited. They will send as much power down as is necessary to decode the data, and with modern electronics that is very, very, very little. (And I am looking forward to a better connection!)

Imagine you would be allergic to tobacco smoke, and most places you have to go would be filled with it... That's how it feels for us, emf-sensitives. We have to endure other's electromagnetic pollution, but people (and the "industry") say it's just in your head... Well, how do you explain all the problem connected to animals, when wifi or an antenna is installed? Ants, horses, storks, and bees, for instance, suffer, die, disappear or get confused... Also, experiments have been made showing that sprouting can be difficult nearby strong wifi.
I am not totally against wireless, but I also feel there should be a fair discussion, from both sides.

As in many of these issues, the results of the studies vary.  The studies that are concocted by the industry that is trying to convince you that it is safe tend toward convincing you that it is safe.  The others don't.

When I talk on the cell phone, which isn't often, I switch to speaker mode and angle and remove it from my head an inch or so.  

I moved the router, based on the advice of scientists, so that it is four feet away from me, rather than 1 foot away from me right now as I type this on the desktop.  

I don't use laptops, partly because it is directly sitting in your lap.

Cordless phones are considered the worst. We just got rid of ours.

You can actually do a DIY dirty electricity test around your house by turning on an AM transistor radio, leaving it on, and seeing what additional sounds you get when you are near an appliance. We did it and it surprised us.

Almost all scientists that talk about this issue urge you to turn off the wifi at night.  

Mercola's next book is called  "EMF'ed".  He was a skeptic for years until he talked to scientists who did that kind of stuff for a living.  

Many health professionals explain that EMF is another issue on top of everything else.  If we were eating healthy fruits and veg every day, exercising and away from other toxins (and toxic people) for some of the people, they wouldn't be as sensitive to the EMF problem.  Sadly, most people aren't exhibiting outstanding overall health in modern societies now, so we are more vulnerable than we would be otherwise.

John S
PDX OR

John Suavecito wrote:
Many health professionals explain that EMF is another issue on top of everything else.  If we were eating healthy fruits and veg every day, exercising and away from other toxins (and toxic people) for some of the people, they wouldn't be as sensitive to the EMF problem.  Sadly, most people aren't exhibiting outstanding overall health in modern societies now, so we are more vulnerable than we would be otherwise.

And that is a lot of the problems. Any testing they do does not take that into account. I have tried to tell doctors that before, it's not A or B, it's A +B +C +D that makes me ill. Most of modern society has other factors in play, and so adding one more just brings more people close to their tipping point, and they start reacting. Increasing the dose, and changing the frequency adds multiple unknown stressors to a person who already has other stressors they may or may not be keeping in check.

I know that days I am in less physical pain from old injuries, and am in a better mood, the EMF doesn't bother me so bad. Days I'm already floored, it's one thing too many.  When I'm running bad health issues as well as the EMF issues, it's harder to have the strength to deal with the physical pain and illness, so I get weaker, and the EMF bothers me more, it's a spiral down, and VERY hard to break when there is a loud source of EMFs in the area that I can not remove. I end up having to work on other factors, because I can possibly change them, when I don't have strength to do so.  EMF pollution just makes it all harder.

The missus just told me about the Austrian Medical Association's guidelines for diagnosing and treating EMF related health problems and illnesses.  Seems pretty legit.

She's had me hardwire ethernet to our offices so that we don't have wifi and had me run phone lines for corded phones.  It's like it's 1995 in our house

a researcher/professor at an Australian college of technical sciences posted a lecture she did on youtube. don't know if it is still there I saw it a few years ago. She found that holding a cell phone to your ear gives out radiation equal to putting your head in a microwave oven and turning it on high, but it is actually worst than that because the signal from cell phone is pulsed.
I'm convinced this is very damaging and might be the cause of so many people getting brain cancer. I no longer use my cell phone unless I can use it on speaker
wifi signals and other rf signals, I guess we are an experiment that technology of the times has cast upon us.

-growth under high power transmission lines causes plants issues
-microwave ovens cause some forms of eye cataracts
-high cell phone usage causes some types of brain tumors

I can provide the medical studies for anyone who really cares about this info

these energies are real (how do you think the information is passed through the walls of your house???), your body's energy is real......to pretend that your body's magnetic field isn't affected by electromagnetic energies (on frequencies it has never experienced before) slamming into it is similar to pretending that fluoride is a great chemical to put in your drinking water (geeee, I wonder why all other well established European countries do NOT put fluoride in their water???  ...is it possible it's because the periodic table shows that F is above Cl in reactivity and is a great poison?   hmmmmmmm is that why F is all the way to the right and at the upper most column on the periodic table???)

running cat5e or cat6 in your house is a better idea than having your own source of MHz or GHz electromagnetic radiating into you at home ....and that will be true in 1995 or in the year 3035

I believe you. There are no conflicted interests for you sharing your questions and experiences.

We cannot say the same for the telecom funded studies.

There are products evolving to help those who are suffering. Clothing made with silver. Emf detectors which can be used to pick lower level areas. Arginite rocks. Digital Emf neutralizers. Not sure if those last two are legit or gimmicks. But if I were suffering and couldn't relocate, I would certainly find out.

Orin Raichart wrote:
I can provide the medical studies for anyone who really cares about this info

I'd be curious to read any studies you think are credible, if it's not a hassle to round them up.

Thanks

J Davis wrote:Clothing made with silver.

How does that help?

J Davis wrote:I believe you. There are no conflicted interests for you sharing your questions and experiences.

We cannot say the same for the telecom funded studies.

There are products evolving to help those who are suffering. Clothing made with silver. Emf detectors which can be used to pick lower level areas. Arginite rocks. Digital Emf neutralizers. Not sure if those last two are legit or gimmicks. But if I were suffering and couldn't relocate, I would certainly find out.

I had hope some the those shielding products would help me, but I have to say, it's not the solution, (unless maybe in a short term situation).
Many of those materials/products are very, - VERY - expensive, but then you might think it's a good investment for your health, but the problem is, many of these material deteriorate very easily over time. Some say folding the material is a problem (and will damage the metal), or even touching (!) in some cases, as some oe of the metals of some nets are sensitives, washing of course will weaken the efficiency. Some of these products cannot be used for a long time. There are many upcoming companies selling all this things and wanting to make a good profit, and not all are quality products. Then you've got all these strange "magic" gadgets, that will instantly remove all sort of electro smog, and I've seen people I thought were quite rational totally falling for these scams.
Also, we need the natural energies (natural grounding etc), that can be hindered by these shields, and then create other health issues. Also trapped waves in a closed net can make things much worse. It's not an optimal solution, but more of an emergency aid.

Some metals will shield from radiation. Try to put a mobile phone wrapped in alu foil: impossible to receive a phone call. Now, people dont want to go around wrapping their bedroom in alu foil (well, I've hear some do). There are paints you could use (they are expensive), not sure how people feel in the long run. And the problem with all these metal clothes (alu, silver etc), is that they can trap waves that get in, and make things even worse.

Tyler Ludens wrote:

J Davis wrote:Clothing made with silver.

How does that help?

Similar to farraday cage.

90% or better RF attenuation from 20 MHz to 8 GHz.

Lessemf dot com

Lana Weldon wrote:
I had hope some the those shielding products would help me, but I have to say, it's not the solution, (unless maybe in a short term situation).
Many of those materials/products are very, - VERY - expensive, but then you might think it's a good investment for your health, but the problem is, many of these material deteriorate very easily over time. Some say folding the material is a problem (and will damage the metal), or even touching (!) in some cases, as some oe of the metals of some nets are sensitives, washing of course will weaken the efficiency. Some of these products cannot be used for a long time. There are many upcoming companies selling all this things and wanting to make a good profit, and not all are quality products. Then you've got all these strange "magic" gadgets, that will instantly remove all sort of electro smog, and I've seen people I thought were quite rational totally falling for these scams.
Also, we need the natural energies (natural grounding etc), that can be hindered by these shields, and then create other health issues. Also trapped waves in a closed net can make things much worse. It's not an optimal solution, but more of an emergency aid.

Glad to have your feedback on those items. Yeah the smog blocker seemed phony pixie dust type solution.

I recently paid for an emf meter and am planning to test it out to see what works to create safe zones and to check impact of appliances in workspace and home. Could use one to find place to live I suppose.

Plants near windows, thermal curtains, etc

My suspicion is earthbags surrounding living spaces  or underground home might be best for the highly sensitive. Or we could do 25 foot high hugel mounds near the house but that wont block satellite as youve said.

Keep us posted on what works for you. I think you are the leading edge, I suspect many will discover they are sensitive as the smog grows thicker

Amy Arnett wrote:

Orin Raichart wrote:
I can provide the medical studies for anyone who really cares about this info

I'd be curious to read any studies you think are credible, if it's not a hassle to round them up.

Thanks

in a couple of days, I'll have some time to dig....I'll purple moosage you when I re-find them.

I used to not believe in this... but really, who am I, who  has an "it's all in your head" sensitivity to artificial and natural fragrances, to judge? I can either take two types of daily asthma meds - or I can avoid all scented products. It's pretty obvious which is the better choice!

The bigger reason I believe in EMF sensitivity now - is because I've met someone who seems to have it. There's a woman in my home town who claims to be extremely fragrance + EMF sensitive. So sensitive even driving into town is hard She used to love coming in to my mom's store, and said several times that it was the only place in town she felt comfortable. One day, when my mom was working, she came in, incoherent (mom said it sounded like she'd had a stroke) and could finally settle down after about 15 min of just sitting with a cup of tea in mom's store.

So - why could she handle our store, and not the others in town?
1) 0 fragrances. All store cleaning was done with water and vinegar. There was some offgassing from the products in the store, but the carpets were 15 + years old, and the walls were 20 + year old varnished wood. The only fragrance and the harshest chemical used in the place was lemon scented dish soap.
2) The store was covered in aluminum siding, and under the siding was 2-3 layers of old growth hewn wood, then insulation, then another layer of wood (it was built by a lumber baron). The WIFI signal didn't travel well, and you dropped a bar or more of cell service when you went inside.
3) We used no florescent lights, just old incandescents and one or two LEDs (my mom gets migraines from fluorescent light)

Prior to that point (the lady was kind of annoying) we had never told her these things, she just repeatedly told us our store was the only store she could handle, and we smiled and nodded and prayed she'd go away. So yes - I believe in it. I can't otherwise see how the lady would know the detailed construction of our store to know that it should be less -EMF transmittent, or that we were extreme chemical/fragrance haters, etc, etc.

I, too, would love to see any links to credible studies about this... I saw a study recently that says dogs poop in alignment with the earth's electromagnetic field (https://www.pbs.org/newshour/science/dogs-poop-in-alignment-with-earths-magnetic-field-study-finds), so seriously, that some humans have some level of EMF sensitivity wouldn't be that surprising to me.

Kate Downham wrote:
I have trouble finding non-sensationalist news articles about this, but I think it’s important, and it would be great if people could share articles.

One thing I have heard about in passing but haven’t read anything on is about lots of 5g satellites being launched by Elon Musk. Does anyone have any good articles about this to share?

From what I have read, 5g sounds very dangerous compared to 3g and 4g. To escape 3g and 4g, there are still some areas we can move to far away from mobile phone towers, but if a satellite is orbiting the earth, it makes it more difficult to escape.

I went looking for some studies and articles, and found quite a few by Scientific American. Here's one https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/we-have-no-reason-to-believe-5g-is-safe/

 the preponderance of peer-reviewed research, more than 500 studiesmore than 500 studies, have found harmful biologic or health effects from exposure to RFR at intensities too low to cause significant heating.

Citing this large body of research, more than 240 scientists who have published peer-reviewed research on the biologic and health effects of nonionizing electromagnetic fields (EMF) signed the International EMF Scientist Appeal, which calls for stronger exposure limits. The appeal makes the following assertions:

“Numerous recent scientific publications have shown that EMF affects living organisms at levels well below most international and national guidelines. Effects include increased cancer risk, cellular stress, increase in harmful free radicals, genetic damages, structural and functional changes of the reproductive system, learning and memory deficits, neurological disorders, and negative impacts on general well-being in humans. Damage goes well beyond the human race, as there is growing evidence of harmful effects to both plant and animal life.”

The new 5G uses millimeater in addition to the micrometer waves in older celluar technologies. This quote seems very relevant to those that have neurological effects from EM radiation. I wish there was a link to research backing up this quote further:

Millimeter waves are mostly absorbed within a few millimeters of human skin and in the surface layers of the cornea. Short-term exposure can have adverse physiological effects in the peripheral nervous system, the immune system and the cardiovascular system.

5G will not replace 4G; it will accompany 4G for the near future and possibly over the long term. If there are synergistic effects from simultaneous exposures to multiple types of RFR, our overall risk of harm from RFR may increase substantially. Cancer is not the only risk as there is considerable evidence that RFR causes neurological disorders and reproductive harm, likely due to oxidative stress.

Hi Amy,

If you search in google scholar, from about 1975 forwards on EMF, you will find many good studies by American Universities, PhDs and MDs from 1975 until about 1995  or so.

I learned about the dangers from EMF when I was in high school.  Then later, when the EPA did a study on cancer correlations and alternating electrical current, there were literally pictures of the EPA employees' offices where desk were pushed away from sources of magnetic fields generated by AC.
After about 1996, corporate funded studies inside universities tried to show there was no harm....but if you find and read the studies from 1975 through 1995, you'll likely see how weak the post 1996 studies seem in comparison both in methodology and in their conclusions.


A quick search gave me these:


Dr. Kamal H. Masaki
Honolulu Heart Program
"the study results support hypothesized roles for cellular and molecular oxidative injury in the pathogenesis of brain aging and neurodegenerative diseases, including Alzhiemer's dementia and Parkinson's dementia, and vascular dementia."



Henry Lai
Narendra Singh
University of Washington's Bioelectromagnetics Research Laboratory
DNA damage, both single and double strand breaks, was observed in the brain cell of rats exposed for two hours to a 60Hz magnetic field.


1999
Swedish Researchers
exposed mice to EMF from actual power transmission lines of 220 kV for 32 days.
their data indicate that transmission lines of this type may induce genotoxic effects on mice seen as changes in the DNA migration


EMF creates stress
Robert O. Becker MD
Cross Currents: Perils of Electropollution; the promise of Electromedicine
exposure to any abnormal electromagnetic field produces a stress response.

September 1986, Scientific American
US AIr Force School OF Aerospace Medicine
Test animals continously exposed to microwaves at twenty times lower than the safe thermal level developed a fourfold increase in cancers of the pituitary, thyroid, and adrenal glands.

EMF cause stress in cells
Columbia University
Reba Goodman
Martin Blank
"Cellular response to low frequency magnetic fields is activated by unusually weak stimuli
they discovered remarkable similarities in the biological responses to both the low and the high frequency fields emanating from cell phones.

Cell and Molecular Biology Associated with Radiation Fields of Mobile Telephones
Dr. W. Ross Adey
"Microwave bioeffects at the cellular level support concepts of athermal responses not mediated by tissue healing."

Most people will agree that the placebo effect is real, likewise there is a complimentary nocebo effect, where if you expect a possible negative effect it actually occur, and make it worse, so in some way placebo and nocebo is like hypnosis.

The other thing is that as we get older we become acutely aware of certain things, for example an incoming storm makes ones back/knee hurt or biting cold ice cubes hurt or florescent light hurt, one drink cause a mighty headache vs a dozen drinks in our younger days.

We also have folks with highly sensitive nose/tongues/etc so I dont see why some folks would be able to react the same way with EMF.

Our body can sense EMF, our skin can sense the UV spectrum of EMF, or eyes and skin the visible part, our skin can surely sense the infra-red spectrum of EMF.

It do believe that EMF does strongly affect our endocrine-hormone system and also our neurotransmitter. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK208983/ And if our body is already weaken due to years of other oxidative stress, then it will affect us negatively.

For people who are less inclined to read through lengthy reports this might be useful.
resonance beings of frequency

Pearl Sutton wrote:

John Suavecito wrote:
Many health professionals explain that EMF is another issue on top of everything else.  If we were eating healthy fruits and veg every day, exercising and away from other toxins (and toxic people) for some of the people, they wouldn't be as sensitive to the EMF problem.  Sadly, most people aren't exhibiting outstanding overall health in modern societies now, so we are more vulnerable than we would be otherwise.

And that is a lot of the problems. Any testing they do does not take that into account. I have tried to tell doctors that before, it's not A or B, it's A +B +C +D that makes me ill. Most of modern society has other factors in play, and so adding one more just brings more people close to their tipping point, and they start reacting.

Because, unfortunately, scientific research is reductionist by nature. It must exclude as many variables as possible and isolate factors to test individually. Add too many factors and there's no way to examine the interactions in a controlled manner. Science, as we know it, has it's limitations.

I found website recently that might be of interest. It focuses quite a bit on 5G, although it has a lot of more general EMF articles. It cites a lot of studies. Smart Meter News

Leigh Tate wrote:
Because, unfortunately, scientific research is reductionist by nature. It must exclude as many variables as possible and isolate factors to test individually. Add too many factors and there's no way to examine the interactions in a controlled manner. Science, as we know it, has it's limitations.

And that is exactly the problem, the limitations on the research do not correlate with the real world, where there are multiple factors in force. Any one factor may not be too bad, but humans are exposed to hundreds of factors, and if a lot of them are a problem, it adds up to cumulative problems.

Just reread though this whole thread again, the questions about the silver fabric etc, yes, it works like a not very effective Faraday cage. Grounding those fabrics works better, grounded metal screen works better, grounded metal sheets works even better. The home we are building has VERY well grounded metal walls. I'm building an open to the energy of the earth sort of Faraday cage we can live in. I cannot, for many reasons, do natural construction on our home. If I were doing natural, I'd go for as deep in the ground as I could, and thick earth berms everywhere it may block the EMF. My last real home (not a rental) was 2 foot thick rock walls inside and out, and I did well there. When I had to move, I ended up in a neighborhood of tract houses with smart meters and it TRASHED my health. I borrowed an RF meter from an electrical repair guy and checked the numbers, and it was horrifying. So the rock walls were both blocking it and naturally grounding it out, and I know dirt does the same.

FWIW, the RF meter vs the tract house numbers, the meter topped out at 1000, I don't recall at this point the scale it was reading, only the numbers.
About 3 miles out of town: 50
In the parking lot of a hospital: 150
In front of the ICU in that hospital: 400
In front of the microwave in the hospital cafeteria: 900
In front of the microwave at a convenience store: overload, so over 1000
Out by the smart meter: fluctuating from 300 to overload
In my bedroom at the tract house: 750
I built a metal screen cage around my head in the bed, and grounded it, inside that: 500 (still high, but better)

I also looked around and realized that there was a building that was very close that had a lovely view of the valley, and was renting out their roof space to a LOT of people for their communication repeaters. The state police, several trucking companions, and an ambulance service were all definitely using it. And I was within 300 feet of it, as the crow flies, much farther by the road, which is why I hadn't noticed it. The RF meter showed a blast zone about 3/4 mile in each direction around that building.

Was that RF meter the best thing for measuring it? Doubtful, but it's what I could borrow. Better equipment would have been fascinating to see. The blast zone around that building and fluctuations around the meters would have been more informative if I had better equipment.

Not entirily related to this topic, but anyway...
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/06/us/green-bank-west-virginia-quiet-zone.html?algo=als1_desk_filter&fellback=false&imp_id=253730387&imp_id=398323259&action=click&module=editorContent&pgtype=Article®ion=CompanionColumn&contentCollection=Trending

I mentioned above that I "hear" (not the right word) wifi and electrical noise. I ranted about my doctor's office being in a bad place full of EMF noise. https://permies.com/t/132408/EMF-WIFI-sensitivity-increasingly-EMF#1038160

The other day I was in the city and drove past that office, I don't usually do so, it's not on my usual routes unless I'm going to see that doctor. The office she is in is on one side of the road, along with some other medical places, the other side of the road is the huge hospital they are part of. The EMF noise started about 1/2 mile away, and was horrible by the time I got to the hospital, then noisy for 1/2 mile on the other side. That's at least a mile diameter blast zone, I don't know how sensitive I am.

If EMF pollution was visible, that area would look like smokestacks billowing black smoke, but because it's not visible, people don't notice or try to change things. In my fantasy world, there would be a phone app that people who were into that sort of thing could put on their phone (wouldn't be me, no apps on my phone, thanks) that would sample the EMF levels of the area it was in every so often, and add it to a map of the city. Maybe if people saw the big black blob on the map, they would believe it. Better yet would be sensors on street corners, that show green, yellow or red, how bad the EMF is in that area. Might wake some people up. Ah, my fantasies are fun, wish I could make them reality.

This is a difficult topic for me, because with my background in science, I'm usually good at separating the science from the pseudoscience, but not this time. This case has me stumped.

I rely on RationalWiki a lot, and RationalWiki is definitely skeptical:

Initially, conspiracy statements against 5G were similar to that of mobile phone signals, radio signals and other sources of non-ionizing radiation: it causes various cancers, deep state. The usual sorts of things for anything new.

They then go on to list seven different, contradictory conspiracy theories linking 5G to COVID-19.

But on the other hand, with members of this thread describing their own experiences, well, I can't just dismiss that either. I don't live in your body, I can't lecture you about what your body feels. At the end of the day, just because fringe conspiracy theorists seize upon something and distort it, doesn't mean there are not real problems with it also. This branch of science is not my specialty, so I can't really weigh in. I do know, though, that -- as RationalWiki repeatedly points out -- correlation is not causation. Just because two phenomena seem to occur at the same place and time, or one seems to follow the other, does not, in itself, prove that one causes the other. Your feeling the way you do when you go into the town might be because of the non-ionizing radiation; or, it might be because of something else entirely, maybe something you are not yet aware of.

Pearl, you could get one of these: http://rfexplorer.com/
The ones usable start at $300… not quite the "starting at $120" promised about them.

I'd send you my spectrum analyzer, but it is way too heavy and needs a 230V supply …

Sebastian Köln wrote:Pearl, you could get one of these: http://rfexplorer.com/
The ones usable start at $300… not quite the "starting at $120" promised about them.

I'd send you my spectrum analyzer, but it is way too heavy and needs a 230V supply …

If I had the money, I guarantee I'd have a good meter. I have priced them, and what I can afford is not useful.  I would want one mostly to try to make other people understand that this is not healthy for humans or animals, and I wish that things would change. I'm not an activist type, for many reasons, other than writing, but if I were, this is one of the things I'd be fighting against. My solution is I bought land in a low EMF area, and I'm building a house designed to be EMF resistant. Best I can do.

If I had a 23 volt power supply I could drag around, I'd try to talk you out of that heavy meter :D

My partner & I have a 22 acre emf free sanctuary in SW Wisconsin , with affordable rooms to rent by the week or month, & great, pure food as part of staying here , whether you have EMF related illnesses, or you want to detox from the energies,  , just look at Canada's Weep Initiative & it shows all that connection with different illnesses !
We have folks that come from afar & feel so much better within several days, it is incredible !  I know myself , having dealt with EMF problems since 2008, ......I had symptoms for 5 years before that , that NO doctors could make that connection for me ! I also do consulting for folks attempting to make their current habitat safer & charge only $30 per hour for that , including help finding a safe property for you ! I have been through hell & back with this , until I found this pure property ! I have an incredible amount of knowledge from actual , honest experiences with EMF's & was close to death before 2013,........then I found this property & my life vitality come back ,& I felt like I had a new lease on life !
I am also working on a book this winter , related to my 15+ years of experience to help bring more awareness to the masses, hopefully !

contact me @ dellkoprime@frontier.com if you truly are ready to feel better ! Dell

When we bought our property I had to have a new electrical pole installed, the electric co would give me one free pole (long story why) I had them put my meter on it, and it's as close to the road (and far from the house) as I could get it. The guy said "We don't use smart meters!" "Will you in 5 years?" "I don't know." "Then put it as far away as possible!"

It's been almost 4 years since I had them put the pole way out there.  And I'm vindicated, but don't want to be. Yesterday we got snail mail saying "We are putting on smart meters!" In this rental I'm in though, the meter is on the west side of the house. Thankfully my bedroom is on the east end, but my computer area is about 20 feet from the meter, with a couple of walls in between.

Sigh. This area is always 10 years behind the rest of the world, I had hoped it would take longer.

Guess I need look at what I can do to the meter here to keep it's blast away from the house. Well grounded metal between it and us is most effective, will see if I can put some up.

I wouldn't mind them if all they did was transmit the billing info once a month, but the real time monitoring and constant reporting is the problem.

We were given the option to opt out of the smart-meter, but have an extra $5 a month fee so that the electric company can send someone out to do the reading every once in a while. We can submit our own reading every couple months to keep billing info more accurate.
I have a friend who has been wrapping his meter successfully in aluminum foil. He uncovers it every once in a while so the info will send without the company coming to inspect it.
We've also recently just had our functioning streetlights changed. I've read that part of the 5g system could be incorporated with streetlights, so perhaps that's what happened, but I'm not sure yet. Something else to watch for though I guess..